Very...unpleasant...experience.

[bartimaus]

Greetings,

Right up front, I am a complete noob. I did not even see a computer until the sixth grade, and spent most of my life not liking them. In fact, I still hate them sometimes. I've also struggled with anything technical/mechanical/mathematical all my life. However, that is where the money is, so I keep trying. On top of returning to college for computer science classes, I kept reading about how the RPi was such a great educational piece and was even being used in schools, so I thought it would be a great way to fill my summer between classes. I was really excited; I was wrong, so very wrong.

I bought a Pi Zero kit that came with cables/adapters and a pre-installed micro SD card. I bought an HDMI cable and found someone with a HDMI compatible tv, but it did nothing. I bought an HDMI/RCA cable and tried on another tv, but it did nothing. I tried hooking it up to my laptop, but it did nothing. I've checked the SD card to make sure there were files actually installed on it, which there are, and I tested the Zero to make sure it wasn't dead, which it is not. I didn't expect everything to be easy, but I had no idea the hardest part would just be trying to turn the freaking thing on.

Then why, when I hook this thing up, it basically doesn't exist?

I've tried looking online but a lot of what I've found is for people who are already good with this stuff, not for people like me. One of the most frustrating things I've found, if I'm understanding it correctly, sounds like you need to do things on the Pi before it will work on the monitor; BUT, if you can't see anything, how do you do anything???

Honestly, I'm not even sure what help to ask for at this point. I guess I'm just hoping someone will have an idea I can try. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

-bartimaus

[scotty101]

Please ready the Sticky Post about Pi's that don't boot

viewtopic.php?f=28&t=58151

There is also a specific mention of the Pi Zero

viewtopic.php?p=850218#p850218

FYI: Pre-installed cards often contain out of date and incompatible software.

[jbeale]

When you say you checked that the Pi Zero is not dead, was it this test below?

viewtopic.php?p=850218#p850218
Take your Zero, with nothing in any slot or socket (yes, no SD-card is needed or wanted to do this test!). Take a normal micro-USB to USB-A cable (the most common type) & connect it to your PC, plugging the micro-USB into the Pi's USB, (not the PWR_IN). If the Zero is alive, your Windows PC will go ding for the presence of new hardware & you should see "BCM2708 Boot" in Device Manager. Or on linux, with a "ID 0a5c:2763 Broadcom Corp" message from dmesg. If you see that, so far so good, you know the Zero's not dead.

Then, when you try to boot it up with the uSD card installed, does the green LED turn on, like in the photo below? Have you confirmed you are connecting USB power to the USB power socket, not the USB data socket? Does the "HDMI compatible TV" you found work with any other HDMI signal source? Note that most TVs will need to be switched to select the HDMI input, and in particular, the correct HDMI input if there is more than one.

[W. H. Heydt]

I'm terribly sorry to hear that you are having so much trouble. Some of things to watch for... Check the labels by the two microUSB connectors. One is for power an the other is for connecting USB devices. Don't confuse them. While preinstalled SD cards are often sold, it is better to download and install the )OS yourself. If you are not comfortable downloading SDinstaller on a PC (or using the 'dd' command on a Linux system), you can install NOOBS with a simple copy, once it is unpacked. See the "Downloads" page for documentation. Make sure that the microSD card is inserted all the way.

The following remarks are NOT a criticism of you or your choices.

This is an example of why I have maintained that the Pi Zero is *not* a suitable device for beginners. Better for beginners are Pis in the B series, particularly the Pi2B and Pi3B.

[bartimaus]

I did read the sticky post about not booting but I did not realize the pre-installed SD card was so likely to be out of date. I just figured that was probably extremely rare and not the problem, but apparently it is not so uncommon. I should not have ruled that out. I am in the process of formatting the SD card to download NOOBS directly from the website. The first time I tried formatting it, was apparently a quick-format. I'm not sure if that is the problem, but when I first tried to extract the files to the SD card or a C folder, a Windows error window kept popping up. I'm hoping the new format will help.

As for the cord placement, I did plug them in to the right ports, but I did try moving them around once just because I figured anything was worth trying at that point. As far as the HDMI tv I tried, I don't know if other HDMI things work on it because neither I nor the person who owns the tv has any other HDMI devices. My tv only has RCA, which didn't work either. I bought both cables specifically for the Zero. The HDMI tv has three selections, "side", "1" and "2", but there was no signal on any of them.

The SD card is currently formatting and it is taking a long time so it must be a full format this time. The last thing I ever had to format was a 3.5" floppy disk, 15-20 years ago. I thought it would be faster. As for which Pi, I'm using, I actually wondered if there might be a better device to start with. I kind of got the impression the Zero might not have been the best one. I've contemplated buying a Pi3 but I've had so much trouble with the Zero, I was afraid to spend any more money on something I'm afraid I'll never be able to turn on.

I'm still trying though. Thanks everyone for responding.

[fruitoftheloom]

You stated "I bought an HDMI/RCA cable" this will definitely not work, you need to Solder a Composite Out Connector on the RPi and use a Composite Cable:

Another issue which has arisen is the Adaptors included in the Kits.

So yes a ZERO is not a beginners RPi but you will learn a lot starting your RPi adventures with it !!

[bensimmo]

Stick with it, like your insistence to want to learn these damn computer things.

To be honest you're one step above NOOB as you know things like SD card, HDMI and how to format someone, OR you are goodish at following the RaspberryPI website, though not so good at following the noobs format instructions given

The next thing willbe what to do with it and to be honest nkt much more than you could do on a PC until it comes to connecting things, which is where the zero looses out.

Zero is a fiddlers/hobby Pi in reality, for people who want ot shrink their Pi projects.

[bartimaus]

Lets add an "extremely" in front of that heading.

I've formatted the SD card with Windows and SDFormatter, and I've tried extracting the zip file with Windows and 7Zip. The card appears to be formatting properly but when extracting with windows I repeatedly get a "windows explorer has quit working" message and it shuts down. With 7Zip, it makes it to the third step and says "device not ready", although some files do get saved to the SD card. For that reason, I went ahead and tried the boot process just to see if it might work, since, ya know, I'm ready to burn England down. However, when I plug in the power, nothing, nada, zilch. Neither Zero will even power up, so who knows if anything from the SD card would work. As I've said, I'm a noob, but come on, it should not be this ridiculously difficult.

[jbeale]

> "windows explorer has quit working"

This indicates some unusual problem with your Windows system; I don't recall this being reported before. Maybe someone more knowledgeable with windows could comment but I wonder if there is a hardware problem with either the SD card or the card reader. For example, if you have a counterfeit SD card that claims to be 8 GB but is in fact 4 GB with a false descriptor map claiming 8GB. Perhaps this happens in that case but that is just a theory; I don't actually know. I suppose it could also be a misbehaving virus checker program.

I do know that fake memory cards exist; see for example http://www.happybison.com/reviews/how-t ... sd-card-8/

[fruitoftheloom]

Lets add an "extremely" in front of that heading.

I've formatted the SD card with Windows and SDFormatter, and I've tried extracting the zip file with Windows and 7Zip. The card appears to be formatting properly but when extracting with windows I repeatedly get a "windows explorer has quit working" message and it shuts down. With 7Zip, it makes it to the third step and says "device not ready", although some files do get saved to the SD card. For that reason, I went ahead and tried the boot process just to see if it might work, since, ya know, I'm ready to burn England down. However, when I plug in the power, nothing, nada, zilch. Neither Zero will even power up, so who knows if anything from the SD card would work. As I've said, I'm a noob, but come on, it should not be this ridiculously difficult.

You unzip the NOOBS download to a foldet, then copy contents of the folder to SD Card

Though if you have downloaded standalone Raspbian Jessie you unzip to a folder, then use W32diskimager to wite the .IMG file to SD Card.

10 million Raspberry Pis have been sold.........

OR https://thepihut.com/collections/raspbe ... ed-sd-card

[bensimmo]

You may be missing some steps or have a faulty SD card.

https://www.raspberrypi.org/help/noobs-setup/

Has instructions to follow and a video.
Download noobs to your windows PC
Unzip it

Download the formatter
Format card as instructed.

Copy the already unzipped files across.
When finish, select it for unmounted or turn computer off.
Take card out.

If explorer is hanging and crashing it could be a dodgy SD card or you just don't have the pc drive space and it just can't cope and gets stuck.

What windows are you using?

[bartimaus]

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I originally did try unzipping the files to the computer. It was after that repeatedly did not work that I tried unzipping to the SD card. I just figured it was worth a shot.

As for the card being fake, I have had that happen when I once bought a 64G card on ebay that was really only 8G. I then looked it up online and discovered that was much more common than I realized. However, the card I am using was a pre-installed card that I bought from the Pi Hut as part of the mega zero wifi kit. I just assumed it would be fine but maybe I should try another SD card. Even if the original is okay, it is always good to have an extra.

I'm using Windows 7 and have made sure it is fully updated. Since I don't have administrative rights on my computer at work, I don't know if it will work or not, but I'll try it on my work PC and see. It is worth a shot. It also runs Windows 7. I also have an old laptop that is just for tinkering that I installed Ubuntu on, maybe I'll have better luck with it.

Lastly, just to clarify, I'm not claiming I'm doing everything perfectly and the fault is all with RPi, but I am following instructions as best as I can tell. That doesn't mean I'm not doing something wrong, it just means I've tried so much that at this point, I don't know what the problem is or how to find out. I've read multiple times that these things are being used in computer classes in schools and thus I got the impression they were pretty simple to get started with, even for someone like me and not in a class. I think I may have under-estimated the Pi and, extremely out of character for me, over-estimated my ability. Live and learn I suppose.

Thanks for replying.

[bensimmo]

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I originally did try unzipping the files to the computer. It was after that repeatedly did not work that I tried unzipping to the SD card. I just figured it was worth a shot. ....

Get this part sorted, this is where I would say it was going wrong.

Try the 'Lite Noobs' installer, it is as far as I know, just the small boot up bit at the beginning with and installation selector, it then downloads all the raspian files needed to install when the Pi is installing Raspian rather than having them on the SD card ready to install.
Though I've never tried it myself, if you can unzip that small file, you are halfway there.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/downloads/noobs/

worth a go.

[bartimaus]

Holy moly. I tried formatting the SD and downloading the NOOBS file on my work PC and after a couple format attempts and saving the unzipped NOOBS files to the SD failed, I tried the NOOBS Lite and it all worked. It will be a while before I can access an HDMI tv but thankfully, the person who has it also has wifi so hopefully it will work then. Thanks.

However, I am concerned that when I plug either Zero in, they will not power up. At least, no LED comes on. How long can it take for the breaker to reset?

[drgeoff]

However, I am concerned that when I plug either Zero in, they will not power up. At least, no LED comes on. How long can it take for the breaker to reset?

There is no breaker on a Zero. It does not have a polyfuse or any other protection on the power input.

The single LED on a Zero is more than a power LED. However it should show signs of life when a bootable (in the RPi sense) micro-SD card is present before applying power.

[jbeale]

Note that "The Zero does not have a power LED, only an activity LED, which only turns on when it can actually read from the SD-Card."

So if you don't see any light, that means it is not reading from the SD card. Maybe it is not written correctly, or not fully seated, or upside down, or some other problem.

[asandford]

Holy moly. I tried formatting the SD and downloading the NOOBS file on my work PC and after a couple format attempts and saving the unzipped NOOBS files to the SD failed, I tried the NOOBS Lite and it all worked. It will be a while before I can access an HDMI tv but thankfully, the person who has it also has wifi so hopefully it will work then. Thanks.

However, I am concerned that when I plug either Zero in, they will not power up. At least, no LED comes on. How long can it take for the breaker to reset?

Not sure NOOBS Lite will fly on a Zero, the lack of an internet connection will be a showstopper (it might have changed, but it didn't work on an A+ with USB ethernet adapter)

[bensimmo]

Holy moly. I tried formatting the SD and downloading the NOOBS file on my work PC and after a couple format attempts and saving the unzipped NOOBS files to the SD failed, I tried the NOOBS Lite and it all worked. It will be a while before I can access an HDMI tv but thankfully, the person who has it also has wifi so hopefully it will work then. Thanks.

However, I am concerned that when I plug either Zero in, they will not power up. At least, no LED comes on. How long can it take for the breaker to reset?

Not sure NOOBS Lite will fly on a Zero, the lack of an internet connection will be a showstopper (it might have changed, but it didn't work on an A+ with USB ethernet adapter)

I think you can set the WiFi up in the noobs directory now via another computer when it's copied across or when on the Noobs launch screen.
Assuming the WiFi is a noobs supported one (no idea if there is a list of noobs compatible Wi-fi chipsets on here, there website Noobs help files last time I looked, I know the Pi3 chipset is supported, I can only assume the Pi Official Wi-Fi is supported too at the least, someone will know).

But the fact the full Noobs copy isn't working shows something somewhere might be wrong with the SD card or it's not not a complete wipe/fomat of all of it happening ?

[HawaiianPi]

Not sure NOOBS Lite will fly on a Zero, the lack of an internet connection will be a showstopper (it might have changed, but it didn't work on an A+ with USB ethernet adapter)

Yup. that's the problem. NOOBS Lite requires Internet, and the Pi0 has no built-in network capability (of any kind).

There is a WiFi icon on the latest NOOBS that you can click on to enter your key and connect, but that requires a Pi with WiFi.

The OP really should have purchased a Pi3. The Pi0 is a great project board, but a lousy computer. It just requires too many extra bits and pieces to be noob (as in new, inexperienced user) friendly. And it's definitely not the choice for the technically challenged!

My advice to the OP at this point would be to give up on NOOBS and use your Ubuntu computer to write a Raspbian image to the micro-SD card with the Linux dd command (or if you want to try it from your messed-up Windows computer, use Win32 Disk Imager).

Scratch that, my advice is to go out and buy a Raspberry Pi3. The Pi0 is the wrong choice for you.

But... since you already have the Pi0, and I suspect you will ignore my advice about getting a Pi3, I'd also like to know how you are planning on using the Pi0?

What are you using for a power supply?

Are you planning on using a keyboard and mouse (and how are you connecting them)?

How are you connecting to the Internet?

No HDMI monitor is bad news, since connecting to a composite video monitor requires soldering on the Pi0, and even then you will have no sound.

Really, a complete description of your Pi0 setup is needed to offer accurate help.

[mikerr]

The OP really should have purchased a Pi3. The Pi0 is a great project board, but a lousy computer. It just requires too many extra bits and pieces to be noob (as in new, inexperienced user) friendly. And it's definitely not the choice for the technically challenged!

Pi zero is fine, If you want keyboard and mouse - add a usb hub

Yes the pi3 is better, but it's also 7x the price ! ($5 vs $35)

OP just needs to copy the full NOOBs to the SD, now he's verified the pi & SD are ok

As for not having HDMI, check if your monitor has DVI, as HDMI -DVI leads are very cheap and work well with the pi.

[procount]

Just to answer the previous questions on noobs/noobs-lite and network connections (noobs = noobs-lite + Raspbian install files)

They support the SMC95xx(?) Lan adaptor that is provided on all RPIs (Not fitted on PiZero).
They support the official Broadcom wifi adaptors, including the one built-in to the RPI3 (Not on PiZero).
So to use noobs-lite on a PiZero you really need a Broadcom wifi adaptor to access the OSes.

Another idea:
If unzipping noobs-full is a problem, try putting noobs-lite on the SD card, then try copying the Raspbian installation files manually.
Go to http://downloads.raspberrypi.org/raspbian/ and download/copy all the files there (excluding any folders) into the /os/Raspbian folder on the SD card. (Note: some files are redundant, and the marketing.tar file should be expanded, but it will work without). You can do the same for the other OSes too.

I will shortly be releasing v1.9.4 of my PINN fork of NOOBS-LITE.
I have included additional support for several USB wifi and ethernet dongles including the dm9601, rtl8192, rtl5370, mt7601, rtl28xx, some ASIX adaptors etc. (I included the fix for the buggy dm9601 driver as well)
Hopefully, this will allow PiZero owners to install other OSes in a NOOBS-like manner more easily.

The current version v1.9.3 already allows you to install OSes from a USB stick, so you can just download the distro files into the /os/xxx folders on there and install them without a network connection to the Pi. So maybe that is another option for the OP (if he has a USB hub to plug the USB stick into)

[DougieLawson]

Note that "The Zero does not have a power LED, only an activity LED, which only turns on when it can actually read from the SD-Card."

So if you don't see any light, that means it is not reading from the SD card. Maybe it is not written correctly, or not fully seated, or upside down, or some other problem.

That's not quite true. The ACT light goes off when there's SDCard activity, unless you invert its status with

Code: Select all

dtparam=act_led_activelow=on

which I've done on my RPiZ.