sbg
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Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 3:44 pm

I happily received my Pi3, but was somewhat surprised to read "Made in PRC" on the packet.

I thought they were made in Wales, which despite being in Greater Old Blighty, should still have better working conditions, and does maintain some manufacturing in the nation that was once the manufacturing heart of the planet. (Shuffling pieces of paper around doesn't quite cut it, in my opinion, even if they do call it the financial "industry").

So, why is my Pi-3 made in China? (bought from element14 via sparkfun.com).

Heater
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 4:07 pm

Why not?

Price is the same. Quality is the same.

I think it's pretty amazing that the Pi Foundation, RS, Farnell and Sony have shown that it is even possible to mass produce such a thing in Blighty at a competitive price. We have been told for decades that it is cheaper to get stuff made "over their" and we don't need to bother manufacturing anything. Thanks Margaret Thatcher. Not so, it seems.

Now there is a moral dimension to this. We customers could insist that we only want Pi from Wales. Because they have better working conditions. Because we want to support home grown industry. And so on.

But the end result of that would be a bunch of unemployed people in China whose lively hoods depend on it.

gordon77
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 4:07 pm

http://www.raspberrypi-spy.co.uk/2012/0 ... rd-version
https://www.raspberrypi.org/magpi/pi-3-interview/
“I’d like to do at least three million units, and that requires you to build, say, 60,000 a week. We’ll probably build around 100,000 a week in the UK, plus whatever Embest builds in China, for a month or two, then you back off to maybe 60,000 a week.”

boyoh
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 5:43 pm

Yes it would be nice to have more things made in the UK, But why work when you can sit on your
Back side all day and get paid for It. Go into any town center, see a bunch of lay about's , ask them if they
Want a job, see what answer you will get.
BoyOh ( Selby, North Yorkshire.UK)
Some Times Right Some Times Wrong

sbg
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 5:55 pm

Heater wrote:Why not?

Price is the same. Quality is the same.
The same was said about slave produced cotton from the Confederacy. By my standards, "quality and price" are a poor argument.

The Raspberry Pi Foundation made a big deal about now producing Raspberry Pis in Wales. I want to know why they went back on that promise without telling anyone. If I misunderstood them, and they only promised to make some Raspberry Pis in the UK, I would like to know how they allocate production, and whether one can choose as a customer.
Last edited by sbg on Sun Mar 27, 2016 5:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

sbg
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 5:56 pm

gordon77 wrote:http://www.raspberrypi-spy.co.uk/2012/0 ... rd-version
https://www.raspberrypi.org/magpi/pi-3-interview/
“I’d like to do at least three million units, and that requires you to build, say, 60,000 a week. We’ll probably build around 100,000 a week in the UK, plus whatever Embest builds in China, for a month or two, then you back off to maybe 60,000 a week.”
Thank you for your informative answer.

Heater
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 6:19 pm

sbg,
The same was said about slave produced cotton from the Confederacy...
Perhaps true.

In the extreme the western world would buy nothing from China, for example, because working conditions, human rights, etc, etc. Brilliant now we have a billion people starving to death.
The Raspberry Pi Foundation made a big deal about now producing Raspberry Pis in Wales.
Well, yeah. Why not? It's an amazing accomplishment. But don't forget that originally all Pi were made in China. There was no plan to do otherwise. Because it "obviously" impossible. It was Sony who stepped up to the plate, called the Foundation and said "Hey, we can do this for you, for the same price."

If my reading of Pi history is correct.

Now, if you could specify in your order if a Pi came from Wales or China, you are basically saying "I want to put bread on the table in one place rather than the other".

Do you really want to take on that responsibility?

mikerr
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 6:44 pm

Most production is UK based, see my graph/timeline:

viewtopic.php?f=63&t=75996

It was around 6 months after launch in 2012 that (main) production switched to the UK:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-19510600
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Flagbit
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 7:33 pm

Would a customer buy a 35 euro device if it is 5 euro more expensive, same quality?
Only because it says "made (by machines) in your country"?
(E.g. the fair phone has other reasons to buy it)

Afair taxes in China are cheaper if the chips leave the country assembled and not loose.
So there should be some costs which are adding now.
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mikerr
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 7:45 pm

sbg wrote: some Raspberry Pis in the UK, I would like to know how they allocate production, and whether one can choose as a customer.
A quote referring to the Pi2, but same applies:
jamesh wrote:You won't see PRC labelled Pi2 in Europe, but in times of extreme need (i.e. high demand straight after the launch)!, some that go the the USA may have been made in China. It's simply to increase production capacity
viewtopic.php?f=63&t=99293#p689633
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sbg
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 8:26 pm

Subject: Why's my PI3 made in China?
Heater wrote:sbg,

Do you really want to take on that responsibility?
I'm surprised you think that someone else took on that responsibility for me. The money over which I had control supported something I disagree with. I may not have known better, but the consequences of what I did have occurred and have impacted people and the environment. So yes, I would definitely prefer to have a choice in the matter, since I already am responsible.

I lived in China before it opened to Western manufacturing, and have spent time there since. It used to be polluted and one wouldn't see the sun for days on end. The people used to be poor but mostly equal and cheerful working on the land. The industrial facilities were quite primitive, but the workers I met were not unhappy. I never saw a prostitute or child orphans alone in Beijing.

Today the people who build our technological gizmos live in dormitories as second class city dwellers, with different rights. They see what rich people have, and they don't, which is painful. The level of pollution is incredible. Not just a matter of not seeing the sun for a few days, but a matter of not seeing the building next door. And one's throat hurts constantly. Now there are nets in industrial facilities to prevent employees from committing suicide. Nowadays one does see prostitution and young orphans alone in the streets of Beijing, which reflects how hard life has now become.

I do not believe the West moving its manufacturing to China was good for the average Chinese person or Chinese nature, although it did make some people very wealthy. Nor was it good for the planet, since Chinese contract-manufacturers are held to worse standards than Western ones were.

It took time for Britain to regulate the dark satanic mills, and to treat industrial workers better, and hopefully the same progress will happen in China. But when I buy something, I would prefer to avoid supporting the exploitation of people and the environment, even if it means I have to wait an extra month for my gizmo. If we all behaved this way, China would change in order to compete, and everyone would be better off for it.

sbg
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Sun Mar 27, 2016 8:28 pm

mikerr wrote:
sbg wrote: some Raspberry Pis in the UK, I would like to know how they allocate production, and whether one can choose as a customer.
A quote referring to the Pi2, but same applies:
jamesh wrote:You won't see PRC labelled Pi2 in Europe, but in times of extreme need (i.e. high demand straight after the launch)!, some that go the the USA may have been made in China. It's simply to increase production capacity
viewtopic.php?f=63&t=99293#p689633
Thanks for the information!

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mahjongg
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Re: Why's my PI3 made in China?

Mon Mar 28, 2016 1:08 am

sbg wrote:I happily received my Pi3, but was somewhat surprised to read "Made in PRC" on the packet.
It could be that its just the PCB that is made in china, but that it is still assembled in Wales.
just my two cents.

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