tap5
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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Fri Mar 04, 2016 3:28 pm

Hi 4K fans,

> The Pi 3's GPU has higher clock frequencies 300 MHz and 400 MHz of different parts that in previous versions ran at 250 MHz

Would this make it possible to reach higher framerates than the former raspberries?

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GTR2Fan
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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Fri Mar 04, 2016 3:44 pm

tap5 wrote:The Pi 3's GPU has higher clock frequencies 300 MHz and 400 MHz of different parts that in previous versions ran at 250 MHz... Would this make it possible to reach higher framerates than the former raspberries?
Maybe, but there's nothing stopping a person trying the same or even higher clock frequencies on a Pi2B first to confirm it. It's all tweakable in config.txt. I always run the Core at 500MHz and the h264 clock at 333MHz on mine and it's completely stable.
Pi2B Mini-PC/Media Centre: ARM=1GHz (+3), Core=500MHz, v3d=500MHz, h264=333MHz, RAM=DDR2-1200 (+6/+4/+4+schmoo). Sandisk Ultra HC-I 32GB microSD card on '50=100' OCed slot (42MB/s read) running Raspbian/KODI16, Seagate 3.5" 1.5TB HDD mass storage.

locutus
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Both 4k and portrait mode

Fri Apr 01, 2016 6:41 pm

To summarize: How do I run both 4K and portrait mode? What is the hdmi_timings pixel frequency setting for [email protected]?

I can get my RPi3b Jessie to run 4K, or I can get it to run in portrait mode. I just can't get it to do both. I have no idea why. I know others have been able to do this with the Pi2.

I am doing a sign display, similar to the MagicMirror. No video. Planning to run a web/php page for active updates. Latest Raspbian Jessie and firmware updates. I have a Samsung 40" UHD TV series 6.

For 4K in config.txt, the hdmi_cvt method does not work. The Pi hangs on boot. No messages output. I have used the hdmi_timings method successfully at both 24 and 25Hz. The following hdmi_timings lines have been posted:

hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 24 0 211190000 3
#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 28 0 248140000 3
#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 25 0 220430000 3

Does anyone know the pixel frequency number for a 15Hz config, or how I calculate it? I have searched everywhere, and found a couple of calculators on the web, which do not output this information. The above settings work for me at 24 and 25Hz.

My thoughts are that 15Hz will run lower load on the GPU, evenly multiplies to 60Hz, the monitor/TV's native frequency, and it simply isn't necessary to run faster for nearly static display.

Here is my current /boot/config.txt:

disable_overscan=1
framebuffer_width=3840
framebuffer_height=2160
max_framebuffer_width=3840
max_framebuffer_height=2160
#display_rotate=3
hdmi_ignore_edid=0xa5000080
hdmi_pixel_freq_limit=400000000
hdmi_group=2
hdmi_mode=87
hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 24 0 211190000 3
#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 28 0 248140000 3
#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 25 0 220430000 3
gpu_mem=256

This works for [email protected] If I enable the display_rotate line to any number but 0, the Pi hangs on boot with no console messages. If I disable 4K, I can rotate the display just fine. But not both!

I have tried cranking the GPU mem all the way up to 512MB to no avail. Back to running gpu_mem=256.

I have installed Chromium, Apache, PHP, and noclutter. Static IP on ethernet, wifi disabled.

Someone mentioned a method with fbturbo, I tried that and managed to rotate the display, but the desktop is totally garbled, no color, stretched funny.

Any ideas? TIA

dom
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Re: Both 4k and portrait mode

Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:13 pm

locutus wrote:To summarize: How do I run both 4K and portrait mode?
Transposing the display is an expensive operation at 1080p.
I think there is no chance at 4K.

altosack
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Re: Both 4k and portrait mode

Sat Apr 02, 2016 5:02 pm

dom wrote:Transposing the display is an expensive operation at 1080p.
I think there is no chance at 4K.
I assume you mean that there's no chance of the GPU doing it, because it has been done with the X framebuffer. The "magic mirror" guy did it, I did it, and others have done it.

I use xorg.conf (Option "Rotate" "CCW"), not config.txt, and it seems to do just as well in portrait 4k24 as in landscape, meaning not great, but passable. I've used it as a desktop this way, but I have not tried omxplayer, which I think may not rotate properly without it being done by the GPU.

locutus
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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Sun Apr 03, 2016 1:43 am

Thanks. Yes, I have heard of a couple of people doing it, I haven't seen all the details.

I know it can be GPU intensive, which is why I was seeking to do 2 things: reduce the frame rate, and offload it to the software/X11.

I tried fbturbo, but couldn't get the Rotate CCW thing to work. For regular xorg, which file did you put the Rotate mod in?

Thanks at least for the hint though, I will keep pursuing the xorg method.

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Re: Both 4k and portrait mode

Sun Apr 03, 2016 11:25 am

altosack wrote: I assume you mean that there's no chance of the GPU doing it, because it has been done with the X framebuffer. The "magic mirror" guy did it, I did it, and others have done it.
Yes, I'm talking about GPU transpose with "display_rotate" config.txt option.
If you can persuade X to render the framebuffer already portrait then there is no issue (but GPU apps like omxplayer won't be transposed automatically).

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Sun Apr 03, 2016 6:27 pm

locutus wrote:For regular xorg, which file did you put the Rotate mod in?
When I tried to replicate it, it seems a little more involved than I remember. I had to put the following in /etc/X11/xorg.conf, which does not exist by default:

Code: Select all

Section "Device"
	Identifier "4k"
	Driver "fbdev"
	Option "Rotate" "CCW"
	Option "fbdev" "/dev/fb0"
EndSection

Section "Monitor"
	Identifier "generic"
EndSection

Section "Screen"
	Identifier "screen1"
	Device "4k"
	Monitor "generic"
EndSection

Section "ServerLayout"
	Identifier "slayo1"
	Screen "screen1"
EndSection
I'm not sure it's all necessary, but it works, and it doesn't work with just the Device section.

Good luck !

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Sun Apr 03, 2016 7:27 pm

Success!

I was stumbling around the point, but never seemed to hit it correctly. And yes, every step seems to be more complicated than it should be.

I now have both 4K and portrait mode working together. Still running at 24Hz.

Thanks.

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Thu Apr 14, 2016 1:42 pm

DISCLAIMER: This is my understanding, hope someone can confirm or dismiss this post.

I have been investigating 4K support for the Pi, based on previous posts. Tests made on Pi 2.

According to a post on another thread, the hdmi_timings parameters are:

Code: Select all

hdmi_timings=<h_active_pixels> <h_sync_polarity> <h_front_porch> <h_sync_pulse> <h_back_porch> <v_active_lines> <v_sync_polarity> <v_front_porch> <v_sync_pulse> <v_back_porch> <v_sync_offset_a> <v_sync_offset_b> <pixel_rep> <frame_rate> <interlaced> <pixel_freq> <aspect_ratio>
Here is a diagram of what the hdmi_timings parameter actually mean:
[attachment=0]2016-04-14_13-06-19.jpg[/attachment]
So, i think that the <pixel_freq> parameter is derived from the other parameters, as follows:

Code: Select all

<pixel_freq> = ( <h_active_pixels> + <h_front_porch> + <h_back_porch> ) *
               ( <v_active_lines> + <v_front_porch> + <v_back_porch> ) *
               <frame_rate> /
               ( <interlaced> + 1 )
This is the EDID data from a test 4K Samsung TV:

Code: Select all

00 FF FF FF FF FF FF 00 4C 2D 44 0C 01 00 00 01 2A 18 01 03 80 59 32 78 0A 23 AD A4 54 4D 99 26 0F 47 4A BD EF 80 71 4F 81 C0 81 00 81 80 95 00 A9 C0 B3 00 01 01 04 74 00 30 F2 70 5A 80 B0 58 8A 00 50 1D 74 00 00 1E 02 3A 80 18 71 38 2D 40 58 2C 45 00 50 1D 74 00 00 1E 00 00 00 FD 00 18 4B 0F 51 1E 00 0A 20 20 20 20 20 20 00 00 00 FC 00 53 41 4D 53 55 4E 47 0A 20 20 20 20 20 01 FE 02 03 42 F1 53 5F 10 1F 04 13 05 14 20 21 22 5D 5E 62 63 64 07 16 03 12 29 09 07 07 15 07 50 3D 04 C0 83 01 00 00 E2 00 0F 6E 03 0C 00 30 00 B8 3C 21 10 80 01 02 03 04 E3 06 05 01 E5 0E 60 61 65 66 01 1D 80 D0 72 1C 16 20 10 2C 25 80 50 1D 74 00 00 9E 66 21 56 AA 51 00 1E 30 46 8F 33 00 50 1D 74 00 00 1E 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 93
I used an online EDIT parser, gave me these results for 2160p30:

Code: Select all

Pixel Clock: 297MHz 
Horizontal Active: 3840 
Horizontal Blanking: 560 
Vertical Active: 2160 
Vertical Blanking: 90 
Horizontal Sync Offset: 176 
Horizontal Sync Pulse: 88 
Vertical Sync Offset: 8 
Vertical Sync Pulse: 10 
Horizontal Display Size: 1872 
Vertical Display Size: 1053 
Horizontal Border: 0 
Vertical Border: 0 
Interlaced: false 
Stereo Mode: 0 
Sync Type: 3 
Note that "Blanking" equals <front_porch> + <h_back_porch>, and that "Vertical Sync Offset" equals <h_back_porch>.

So, i think the 3 entries posted earlier:

Code: Select all

#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 24 0 211190000 3
#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 28 0 248140000 3
#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 25 0 220430000 3
should be like:

Code: Select all

#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 24 0 211129344 3
#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 28 0 246317568 3
#hdmi_timings=3840 1 48 32 80 2160 1 3 5 54 0 0 0 25 0 219926400 3
On our Samsung, both 24Hz and 25Hz with both pixel frequency values worked, and 28Hz did not work with either pixer frequency value. Tried also a 15Hz version, based on the TV's EDID values, changing only the refresh rate and pixel frequency to half:

Code: Select all

hdmi_timings=3840 1 384 88 176 2160 1 82 10 8 0 0 0 15 0 148500000 3
This did not work either.
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locutus
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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Fri Apr 15, 2016 12:34 am

Thanks for the info mihalop. I had gathered some of that, but not all. Of course not working puts a bit of a damper on things.

I had the same results as you, 24Hz and 25Hz were fine. I couldn't get 28Hz or 15Hz. So far with the Pi3, continuing to run at 24K has not been an issue, and because I offloaded the rotation to software, the GPU has no problem with 24K.

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Fri Sep 09, 2016 6:50 pm

For what it's worth, I've found that setting anything other than the TV's recommended input gleaned by the tvservice command, will kill CEC communications:

Code: Select all

[email protected]:~ $ tvservice -m CEA
Group CEA has 8 modes:
           mode 1: 640x480 @ 60Hz 4:3, clock:25MHz progressive
           mode 2: 720x480 @ 60Hz 4:3, clock:27MHz progressive
           mode 3: 720x480 @ 60Hz 16:9, clock:27MHz progressive
           mode 4: 1280x720 @ 60Hz 16:9, clock:74MHz progressive
           mode 5: 1920x1080 @ 60Hz 16:9, clock:74MHz interlaced
  (prefer) mode 16: 1920x1080 @ 60Hz 16:9, clock:148MHz progressive
           mode 32: 1920x1080 @ 24Hz 16:9, clock:74MHz progressive
           mode 34: 1920x1080 @ 30Hz 16:9, clock:74MHz progressive
[email protected]:~ $ tvservice -m DMT
Group DMT has 5 modes:
           mode 4: 640x480 @ 60Hz 4:3, clock:25MHz progressive
           mode 9: 800x600 @ 60Hz 4:3, clock:40MHz progressive
           mode 16: 1024x768 @ 60Hz 4:3, clock:65MHz progressive
           mode 35: 1280x1024 @ 60Hz 5:4, clock:108MHz progressive
           mode 39: 1360x768 @ 60Hz 16:9, clock:85MHz progressive
[email protected]:~ $
For instance, I set it up to do 4K as shown in the posts above and it looked fantastic. But nothing I could do would allow CEC communications. it seemed I had to set a known group and mode to get it to work. In my case, group=1, mode=16.

sconner

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Sat Sep 10, 2016 8:04 am

srconner wrote:For what it's worth, I've found that setting anything other than the TV's recommended input gleaned by the tvservice command, will kill CEC communications
Yes, I have seen that too. Will be looking into it, as we need it for a project. I wonder if this could be a firmware issue.
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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Mon Oct 31, 2016 1:10 pm

anyone tried 4K on Sony 4K TV? I enabled "extended" format on HDMI but the console does not show up at all.

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:59 am

dom wrote:
mimi123 wrote:At turbo mode and increasing the pixel clock limit, I got [email protected]!!!
But I view that the VPU is running at full tilt.
Cool. If someone want to make a Youtube video of the Pi doing some desktop stuff at 4K we'd be interested. Might make a blog post.
Hola Dom. Thank you (and everyone else in this thread) for the instructions. I managed to get the Qt (QML) based art application that I use on my own Pis to work at 4K, making a nice reference example of the Pi running at UHD :)

Video is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbYJd0zSYhM

along with associated blog post with links to every bit of software I used. (and hopefully due attribution)

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:31 pm

It seems that there is a inherent restriction on the hardware that does not allow you to have a DispmanX layer starting left of the 2047 pixel. Just thought I should also update the thread here.

Except that and the CEC adapter, everything else works fine on 4K. Of course, the HVS has more work to do, so having a lot of layers can cause the HDMI signal to get lost. But framebuffer + 1 layer (e.g. omxplayer) works fine @25Hz on Pi 3.
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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Thu Feb 02, 2017 5:27 am

Best friends,

Please can somebody help me with my PI 3?

I am trying to get 4k on my sony 4k hdr tv. I tried some config files from this topic but it does not work.
I have openelec 7.0.1 with kodi jarvis.

Please help me my friends.

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:12 pm

tatliboy16 wrote: I am trying to get 4k on my sony 4k hdr tv. I tried some config files from this topic but it does not work.
I have openelec 7.0.1 with kodi jarvis.
There is no point in running Kodi at 4K. The hardware in the Pi cannot decode 4K video.
You are much better off running at 1920x1080 and letting the display upscale it.

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Thu Feb 02, 2017 6:04 pm

Hello Dom,

What about the messages in this topic then? I read that some people have 4k now. Or is this part just for upscale?

How could I upscale it then my friend?

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:14 am

Messages in this thread deal with getting a Pi desktop environment working in 4K.

There is absolutely no sense in trying to get 4K for Kodi.
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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:49 pm

I understand. Well then I hope raspberry will come with 4k.

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:17 pm

Raspberry pi3 cannot handle any 4K resolution. If some one on this thread did accomplice this "in a way" the only thing have done is to upscale it to 1080p and nothing more. It doesn't have the hardware power to do it, I think...!! Gpu is very poor to do REAL 4K resolution.

Please be serious people ... 15 Hz for a 4K resolution is a joke..!! why is a joke ??? Of course it is.

The eye has a finite resolution
This is basic biology. The accepted "normal" vision is 20/20. In response to my previous articles on the stupidity of 4K TVs, many people argued they had better vision, or some other number should be used. This is like arguing doors should be bigger because there are tall people. Also, just because you have better vision, doesn't mean most people have better vision. If they did, it wouldn't be better, it would be average.

Try this. Go to the beach (or a big sandbox, or a baseball diamond). Sit down. Start counting how many grains of sand you can see next to you. Now do the same with the grains of sand by your feet. Try again with the sand far beyond your feet (like, say, 10 feet away). The fact that you can see individual grains near you, but not farther away is exactly what we're talking about here. The eye is analog. Randomly analog at that. So of course some people are going to see more detail than others, and at different distances, but 20/20 is what everyone knows, and it is by far the most logical place to start any discussion.

At 15hz per second YOU DOWNGRADING your image quality throwing away information. For your eye you should have at least 50-60hz per second as a refresh rate. Now your 4K TV is capable of producing a video with much more refresh rates lets say 240hz ( True Motion and not the marketing 400Hz that mine has..!!) and you are playing in 15hz or 24Hz???
Ohhhh this is so LAME. Your eye won't get any difference AT ONCE but in time you will mark my words as you head straight to the eye-doctor. So be careful what you really do.

DO NOT TRUST MARKETING.. They are lying..! of course my TV in market has a refresh rate of a 400hz but that is not true at all..!!

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:53 pm

arxaios wrote:
Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:17 pm
Raspberry pi3 cannot handle any 4K resolution. If some one on this thread did accomplice this "in a way" the only thing have done is to upscale it to 1080p and nothing more. It doesn't have the hardware power to do it, I think...!! Gpu is very poor to do REAL 4K resolution.

Please be serious people ... 15 Hz for a 4K resolution is a joke..!! why is a joke ??? Of course it is.

The eye has a finite resolution
This is basic biology. The accepted "normal" vision is 20/20. In response to my previous articles on the stupidity of 4K TVs, many people argued they had better vision, or some other number should be used. This is like arguing doors should be bigger because there are tall people. Also, just because you have better vision, doesn't mean most people have better vision. If they did, it wouldn't be better, it would be average.

Try this. Go to the beach (or a big sandbox, or a baseball diamond). Sit down. Start counting how many grains of sand you can see next to you. Now do the same with the grains of sand by your feet. Try again with the sand far beyond your feet (like, say, 10 feet away). The fact that you can see individual grains near you, but not farther away is exactly what we're talking about here. The eye is analog. Randomly analog at that. So of course some people are going to see more detail than others, and at different distances, but 20/20 is what everyone knows, and it is by far the most logical place to start any discussion.

At 15hz per second YOU DOWNGRADING your image quality throwing away information. For your eye you should have at least 50-60hz per second as a refresh rate. Now your 4K TV is capable of producing a video with much more refresh rates lets say 240hz ( True Motion and not the marketing 400Hz that mine has..!!) and you are playing in 15hz or 24Hz???
Ohhhh this is so LAME. Your eye won't get any difference AT ONCE but in time you will mark my words as you head straight to the eye-doctor. So be careful what you really do.

DO NOT TRUST MARKETING.. They are lying..! of course my TV in market has a refresh rate of a 400hz but that is not true at all..!!
What is the point of this post? Did we really need a lecture like this? People here know what 15Hz means.

No one is lying, you can make the Pi run at 4k display resolution at 15Hz if you want to. Yes, its is a REAL 4K resolution desktop, not a scaled up 1080p. Note though, that the H264 decoder will not run at 4K, that maxes out at just over 1080p. But I think that was explained somewhere up thread.
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F1LT3R
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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Sat Feb 03, 2018 7:56 pm

Apologies if this is a dinner question..
If I set my config.txt up as suggested in this thread, could I use my raspberry pi to drive a 4K console at boot? Or would this only work for the GUi?

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Re: Raspberry Pi and 4k @ 15Hz

Sat Feb 03, 2018 8:15 pm

Yes, 4K resolution works for everything, console and desktop alike.
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