pyroking
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 06, 2012 10:51 am

I received my Pi yesterday, added a SD (Sandisk 4GB SDHC C4) card with thedebian6-19-04-2012 image, connected HDMI, keyboard and mouse and ethernet. Added power and hey presto, a machine which booted...apparently. I was able to startx and off it went. It wasn't until I tried to access the net via Midori I noticed something was wrong.

A tail on /var/log/messages revealed repeated entries:
raspberrypi kernel: DEBUG:handle_hc_chhltd_intr_dma:: XactErr with NYET/NAK/ACK

which continued until the SD card was out of space. I changed the config to use static IP - which stopped any messages being logged, but didn't resolve the connectivity (couldn't ping the router). Once I'd made more space, rebooted without the ethernet connected, I plugged the ethernet in whist tailing the /var/log/messages. The first message was ecouraging:
raspberrypi kernel: smsc95xx 1-1.1:1.0: etho0: link up, 100Mbps, full-duplex, lpa 0x45E1

The next message (and the remaining messages) reverted to the previous debug error above.

Reading around, I noticed other people having issues had changed PSU - so I've just bought 2 different 5V/1A and 5V/2A PSUs. The current PSU has a microUSB connector hard-wired - and with keyboad,HDMI & keyboard attached, I've got 4.95V @ TP1 which sounds more than reasonable.

I've tried different cables into different network devices (one dlink sky broadband router, one cisco network switch) and I always get the same issue.

I now don't know if this is a faulty board, back luck with the PSUs (I've now tried 4) or the combination of ethernet leads (tried 2) but i think i've done most things I can reasonably try.

Have I missed something obvious?

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jbeale
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 06, 2012 3:10 pm

pyroking said:


...I've got 4.95V @ TP1...


That's right on the money, so I think you have ruled out a power supply problem (unless it's something high-frequency that the multimeter doesn't see).

The error message you mention can also be associated with USB, not just ethernet (they go through the same chip on the R-Pi). Is it possible to boot with no USB devices attached, just to see what happens?

pyroking
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 06, 2012 5:46 pm

I've run out of USB keyboards to check with. I can see 4.95V @ TP1 whether or not anything is connected to USB. With the HDMI disconnected the voltage rises to 4.97. I originally tried with a wireless keyboard and mouse, with the same network issues.

The wired keyboard I'm using at the moment says it's rated at 60mA; I'll see if I can find another USB keyboard to test with in case this one is telling a mis-truth!

pyroking
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Mon May 07, 2012 7:31 pm

I've just tried again with a wireless keyboard receiver which is labelled 25mA...and I get the same issue. Everything is fine until the ethernet cable is plugged in and then the logs go haywire. The router to which the Pi is connected doesn't make a difference.

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jbeale
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Mon May 07, 2012 7:39 pm

Are all the errors the same one you reported at first, that is: (?)

DEBUG:handle_hc_chhltd_intr_dma:: XactErr with NYET/NAK/ACK

jamesh
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Mon May 07, 2012 7:42 pm

Are you  using the very latest Debian image?
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pyroking
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Mon May 07, 2012 8:16 pm

I'm using the Debian image downloaded from the torrent yesterday on Saturday morning, and yes, I'm getting the same image repeatedly as far as I can see. It seems slightly strange that when there's a static IP set in /etc/networks/interfaces I don't get the error (though I don't get any connectivity either), but when the Pi is looking for a DHCP lease, I do get the issue.

pyroking
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Tue May 08, 2012 7:03 pm

So I've tried the current archlinux image this evening - and I'm still no better off. ifconfig doesn't give me any IP address details and I'm getting the same DEBUG output in /var/log/messages.log, with the occasional
DEBUG:handleth NYET/NAK/ACK

I'm beginning to think there's something wrong with the hardware. I did notice tonight that the network "link" light on the routers are flashing madly as soon as the connection is made, even though there is no data being transferred. I'd not noticed this before since the routers are buried behind the TV!

Anyone got any thoughts or better ideas?

pyroking
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Mon May 14, 2012 1:32 pm

Just a quick update...I've just received a replacement Pi from Farnell. Seems the ethernet controller must have been duff on the previous board; the new one works like a charm.

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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Mon May 14, 2012 1:46 pm

Excellent news. Enjoy!
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kevpatts
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Thu May 17, 2012 11:51 pm

Hey,

I've got exactly the same problem. Is this common or am I just unlucky?

Kev

kevpatts
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 20, 2012 12:20 pm

I've just confirmed that my power supply is delivering 5 volts and it's rated at 2.1 amps (iPad charger) and I'm using a powered USB hub, so it can't be a power supply issue. Going to return it I think.

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nick.mccloud
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 20, 2012 12:36 pm

If you can try a different Micro USB lead that would be worth giving a go - it's entirely possible for 5V to be delivered but not insufficient quantity that the Ethernet/USB can run properly.

kevpatts
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 20, 2012 1:12 pm

I think you might be on to something here. I have two of these mice usb cables and I hadn't tried the other until now. The one I was using causes these errors (above) and if I try the other cable I can't even use my USB keyboard (even if it's hooked up via a powered usb hub).

They are low quality cables I think (bought off dx.com) so I'll try to get better ones, and a digital multimeter.

One question, would this be caused by low voltage or current? My guess is voltage because the I'm using a 2.1 amp supply which should be easily sufficient.

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nick.mccloud
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 20, 2012 1:28 pm

I have experienced these sorts of issues with my iPad power supply rated at 2.3A.

It's the lack of current getting down the wires due to the very very very fine strands that are used.

As soon as I used a Samsung phone lead everything burst in to life.

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mahjongg
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 20, 2012 1:37 pm

kevpatts wrote:One question, would this be caused by low voltage or current? My guess is voltage because the I'm using a 2.1 amp supply which should be easily sufficient.
It would cause a drop in the voltage received at the end of the cable.

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rurwin
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 20, 2012 1:38 pm

Voltage and current are intimately related. You can think of it like water in pipes: voltage is the pressure and current is the flow rate. The only reason you would have insufficient flow (current) is because you had insufficient pressure (voltage). One reason for having reduced pressure would be a constriction in the supply pipe (USB cable). Another reason would be if the supply was not able to supply water at a fast enough rate. But in both cases what you observe is a reduction in both pressure (voltage) and flow rate (current).

Another possible reason for the RaspPi misbehaving would be ripple on the power line, so the pressure is not smooth and the water comes out of the tap in bursts. A multimeter would not detect that, it would average the voltage over a second or so. The only way to detect it is to use an oscilloscope. I have one, but as yet I have no Pi and hence no problem to diagnose. (If anyone is interested I also have a couple of spares going cheap ;-) )

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johnbeetem
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 20, 2012 3:00 pm

rurwin wrote:Another possible reason for the RaspPi misbehaving would be ripple on the power line, so the pressure is not smooth and the water comes out of the tap in bursts. A multimeter would not detect that, it would average the voltage over a second or so. The only way to detect it is to use an oscilloscope. I have one, but as yet I have no Pi and hence no problem to diagnose. (If anyone is interested I also have a couple of spares going cheap ;-) )
That's an excellent analogy for ripple on the power line. The power coming from the mains is AC, so every 8 msec (USA) or 10 msec (UK) the voltage going into your DC power supply drops to 0. Your DC power supply has a large capacitor to maintain DC voltage while the AC voltage is low. The capacitor's voltage droops while the AC voltage is low, and then kicks back up when the AC voltage comes back. If the capacitor is too small, its voltage will droop too low each cycle and the DC power supply's 5V regulator won't be able to maintain 5V for the whole cycle.

As rurwin says, you need a sillyscope to see it.

kevpatts
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 20, 2012 4:08 pm

Thanks for the explanation guys, but what I meant was is the Pi very sensitive to slight variations in the power supply and if it is, is it likely to manifest in similar issues to what I'm seeing.

From what you've described this seems to be likely.

I'll go out and pick up a Samsung phone PSU and see if that helps. Thanks guys.

silvan
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Mon May 21, 2012 4:13 pm

Hi guys,
I found this thread, when I was looking for a solution for this problem:

Code: Select all

DEBUG:handle_hc_chhltd_intr_dma:: XactErr without NYET/NAK/ACK
It was caused by my WLAN dongle, which is the following:

Code: Select all

ID 148f:2573 Ralink Technology, Corp. RT2501/RT2573 Wireless Adapter
I tried another one, same manufacturer (Hama) but another chipset (RT2870). It worked perfectly. I got the error message once, but it didn't interrupt the connection.

After I read this thread, I grabbed the next capacitor (470uF) and attached it parralel to the 5V rail. Now, the other card works, too. Unfortunately I still get those error messages - frequently, but with longer intervals, I guess.

I'm sure, it will flood the log-files again! Any suggestions?

jophrei
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 27, 2012 7:50 am

I'm getting this messages to with my TP-Link TL-WN821N v2 too, i measured with my scope around +- 40mV ripple on the measuring points on the raspberry, the stick is powered through an active USB hub.

I have also problems with my RT3070 and RT3072 based wifi cards, on my dockstar they work, but not on the raspberry, even with external supply.

dics
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 27, 2012 8:18 am

I posted on another thread thinking it might be a heat problem.
Last night i tried to download a 2GB+ file hosted on my RPi using FTP. After about 500MB i got a kernel panic message. Restarted, tried again and this time it stopped at about the same point and unconfigured the network adapter.

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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Sun May 27, 2012 8:33 am

I'll try later another power supply (linear, no switched), may it works.

Hydrael
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Fri Jun 01, 2012 8:24 pm

Did using another powered USB hub help?
I'm having the exact same issue with the same setup and I'd love to know if this is a power-supply based or wifi stick based problem.

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eamon
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Re: Network issues - could this really be power issue?

Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:00 pm

Guys,
I'm seeing the exact same DEBUG error on boot. Thought it was a power issue originally, but have tried many different PSU ranging from 700mA to 1000mA all at 5v DC. Tried with different mice/keyboards, with/without network, HDMI or Composite. Basically, it fails even with nothing but the display connected at boot. It must be a dodgy board or at least heat affected?

I guess it's replacement time! (and I only got it yesterday).

Eamon.

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