kr0ne
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:49 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:20 pm

Hi All,

I have been following the Raspberry Pi blog on the main site for many months now and have been eagerly awaiting the delivery of my Pi from Element14. I was not lucky enough to make it into the first batch but did get my order placed early and am expecting delivery soon. I also registered interest with RS pretty much as soon as I was able to so am still waiting to see who get's a Pi to me first.

I had largely stayed away from the forums until recently as there didn't seem a whole lot of point getting too involved in the technicalities until I had a Pi in my hands but, as the date draws closer, I started browsing a week or so ago. What I have found has shocked me and left me incredibly disheartened. So much so that I felt moved to sign up and post this.

It seems that there is a certain level of dogmatic doctrine that prevails on this forum and anybody who questions this in any way is immediately pounced on by literally dozens of people and branded a troll. So many of the members on here seem obsessed with pedantically tearing apart anyone who is seen to break from the party line and discussion / debate appears stifled, to say the least.

I am sure that I will now be branded a troll and my opinions discounted also but, to be quite frank, I no longer care.

I was enthused by the idea of the r-Pi and saw it as a fantastic way to affordably embed some real processing power in various pieces of test gear that I have been designing for some time now. It truly revolutionised my designs and indeed how I thought about the problems I was attempting to tackle. I was looking forward to working with an open community and developing something that I could not otherwise afford to own - possibly even being one of the first people to home construct such devices.

After reading these forums for a bit I now feel absolutley gutted. I am sure that there are many folks on here who are truly decent and mature human beiungs with much to contribute but, I am afraid, you are overshadowed by those who would shout down anybody they feel disagrees with their point of view. I routinely find myself closing my brower after half an hour or so because, quite frankly, reading the drivel that these keyboard-nazis spew forth makes me so angry that I just don't think it is worth sticking around.

I am sorry to say that the thought of relying on this community to help me develop something unique and wonderful now fills me with dread. I am half tempted to just stick my Pis on eBay when I get them and hopefully make a few quid, although I have seen what many of the smaller minded idiots around here think of that.

I apologise to those who do not contribute in the way that I am describing, you have my sympathy as I am sure you are wonderful people. I fear you are tarred by the vocal contingent that I describe above though and I am sorry that so many people will be turned off by this community and so never learn of what you have to offer.

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grumpyoldgit
Posts: 1452
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 12:20 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:27 pm

You've said very little in quite a long post.

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reiuyi
Posts: 165
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2011 4:59 pm
Contact: Website

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:45 pm

I'm convinced we all mean well. The majority doesn't really care what you do with your raspberry once you get it. You'll feel the seller's remorse at some point; the realization that money isn't worth as much as the endless fun and learning you'd have with your Raspberry Pi.

Ignorance is bliss; all internet fora and indeed all companies and institutes have a degree of being 'mean' to those who ask silly questions. Besides, it's really annoying to yet again answer why you can't solder BGA for a memory upgrade, or why the raspberry pi is better than a $50 tablet computer. You'd honestly start to believe those questions are asked again and again only for trolling potential. Is it not natural for us to react mildly offended to a question already asked and elucidated many times? We're not your personal army, is what 4chan would say, and indeed we're not your personal DIY instructors . Have fun and put in some effort, the community will love your projects

poing
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:32 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:48 pm

kr0ne said:


...


And here we go again...

hippy
Posts: 5772
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:34 pm
Location: UK

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:53 pm

kr0ne said:

I am sorry to say that the thought of relying on this community to help me develop something unique and wonderful now fills me with dread.
You can take the R-Pi board for what it is, and if you need help take what you can find to you taste on this forum and ignore the rest, and you can also seek help from elsewhere.

I've had my share of frustrating experiences trying to do things where the communities that were the only support were far from helpful and have thrown in the towel, but the R-Pi has the advantage that it will potentially become all-pervasive and there won't just be a single community or forum for it. You just have to find one you are comfortable with.

rmm200
Posts: 259
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2012 10:25 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:03 pm

Well I must say he jumped right in to the spirit of helping others!  Good job there!

adlambert

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:32 pm

poing said:


kr0ne said:


...


And here we go again...


I can't imagine why.....

poing
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:32 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:35 pm

adlambert said:


poing said:


kr0ne said:


...


And here we go again...


I can't imagine why.....


Because...


DeliciousRaspberryCake said:


...



jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 23341
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:36 pm

I'm sorry you feel that way, but you haven't given any examples of why you feel that way! You have also dived straight in using exactly the sort of language you profess to find so disheartening -' keyboard Nazi's', 'smaller minded idiots' - which seems rather unnecessary, and according to the forum rules, will get you banned rather quickly if it continues. Sorry to be blunt, just giving you a heads up.

I suggest you take a look through the troubleshooting section, where you can find lots of very useful help and encouragement, showing non of the behaviour you find so abhorrent.

All forums have their fair (or unfair) share of people who could be regarded somewhat challenged in the social graces department, just like real life. You have to learn to take the rough with the smooth although we do attempt to dispatch the really rough to the long grass when it goes too far. On the whole this forum is one of the politer ones, try Slashdot if you really want your eyes opened.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
"My grief counseller just died, luckily, he was so good, I didn't care."

lewmur
Posts: 368
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2011 3:20 pm
Contact: Website

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:51 pm

Anybody seen my Whine Filter?  I seem to have lost it.

poing
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:32 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:58 pm

lewmur said:


Anybody seen my Whine Filter?  I seem to have lost it.


It's in the cupboard in the shed. And now don't go whining about which cupboard in the shed as we've been over that a million times. Enough already! It's in the cupboard. Yes,...In the shed. Jeez...

lewmur
Posts: 368
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2011 3:20 pm
Contact: Website

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:14 pm

poing said:


lewmur said:


Anybody seen my Whine Filter?  I seem to have lost it.


It's in the cupboard in the shed. And now don't go whining about which cupboard in the shed as we've been over that a million times. Enough already! It's in the cupboard. Yes,...In the shed. Jeez...



poing said:


lewmur said:


Anybody seen my Whine Filter?  I seem to have lost it.


It's in the cupboard in the shed. And now don't go whining about which cupboard in the shed as we've been over that a million times. Enough already! It's in the cupboard. Yes,...In the shed. Jeez...



Whine, whine!!  But I don't have a shed!  Whine!

poing
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:32 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:18 pm

lewmur said:


Whine, whine!!  But I don't have a shed!  Whine!


Why do you spell 'wine' with an 'h'?

lewmur
Posts: 368
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2011 3:20 pm
Contact: Website

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:19 pm

One of the easiest ways to spot the species "MS Troll" is the whining noises it makes.  It will always attempt to paint any community other than its own as "unfriendly".  But, of course, anyone who wants to find a real example of an "unfriendly community" need look no further than the nearest MS programming forum.

Chris.Rowland
Posts: 239
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:45 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:35 pm

The OP has a point.  I find the signal to noise ratio on this group particularly poor.  There does seem to be an intolerance of beginners and a willingness to put people down, especially if they have an unpopular idea. Several of the answers in this thread are examples. I don't see this on other technical help orientated groups.

This is what I suggest:

If you are fed up with people continually asking the same questions - just don't answer.

If you think that people are trolling - just don't answer.

If you think that a question is silly - just don't answer.

You see the pattern. If you have nothing useful or helpful to say then don't say anything.

Remember that if you are rude to someone then it's you that are being rude. Even if they have been rude then if you are rude in return it is you being rude.

The only silly question is one where you already know the answer.  There are silly answers as well, a silly answer is one that you know is not helpful.

It's really up to everyone to resolve to be polite to one another, even when people are not polite to them. It can be done.

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Westmead Hawk
Posts: 13
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Location: Cambridge

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:44 pm

Chris Rowland said:


The OP has a point.  I find the signal to noise ratio on this group particularly poor.  There does seem to be an intolerance of beginners and a willingness to put people down, especially if they have an unpopular idea. Several of the answers in this thread are examples. I don't see this on other technical help orientated groups.

This is what I suggest:

If you are fed up with people continually asking the same questions - just don't answer.

If you think that people are trolling - just don't answer.

If you think that a question is silly - just don't answer.

You see the pattern. If you have nothing useful or helpful to say then don't say anything.

Remember that if you are rude to someone then it's you that are being rude. Even if they have been rude then if you are rude in return it is you being rude.

The only silly question is one where you already know the answer.  There are silly answers as well, a silly answer is one that you know is not helpful.

It's really up to everyone to resolve to be polite to one another, even when people are not polite to them. It can be done.


Completely agree. I cringe at the thought of actual children logging in and asking newbie questions.

hzrnbgy
Posts: 106
Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2011 10:55 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:47 pm

What bothers me is that being honest in this forum can get you ban yet rudeness fall on deaf ears.

poing
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:32 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:49 pm

Chris Rowland said:


The OP has a point.


No. He's just whining and no good wine will ever come from it.

poing
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:32 pm

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:00 pm

hzrnbgy said:


What bothers me is that being honest in this forum can get you ban yet rudeness fall on deaf ears.


What attracts me is that so many people are enticed by the concept.

lewmur
Posts: 368
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2011 3:20 pm
Contact: Website

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:30 pm

Chris Rowland said:


The OP has a point.  I find the signal to noise ratio on this group particularly poor.  There does seem to be an intolerance of beginners and a willingness to put people down, especially if they have an unpopular idea. Several of the answers in this thread are examples. I don't see this on other technical help orientated groups.

This is what I suggest:

If you are fed up with people continually asking the same questions - just don't answer.

If you think that people are trolling - just don't answer.

If you think that a question is silly - just don't answer.

You see the pattern. If you have nothing useful or helpful to say then don't say anything.

Remember that if you are rude to someone then it's you that are being rude. Even if they have been rude then if you are rude in return it is you being rude.

The only silly question is one where you already know the answer.  There are silly answers as well, a silly answer is one that you know is not helpful.

It's really up to everyone to resolve to be polite to one another, even when people are not polite to them. It can be done.



Seems your solution to everything is "just don't answer".  So how come you're answering?

Personally, I haven't seen anyone beating up on anyone asking question.  Telling them to "read the FAQs" is educating them on proper use of the forums.  Not picking on them.

And as to being impolite to trolls, IMO, that is just what trolls deserve.

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scep
Posts: 1062
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2011 8:53 am

Re: The Raspberry Pi Community

Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:32 pm

hzrnbgy said:


What bothers me is that being honest in this forum can get you ban


No, it can't. No one has been banned for this reason.

But signing up after several months just to post stuff like "reading the drivel that these keyboard-nazis spew forth" and refer to other members as "smaller minded idiots" will get your thread locked.

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