ErvKosch
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:00 pm

I've been moving and I'm kinda out of the loop.  How units have shipped? Is the stock now spent?  When is the next order scheduled to arrive?  By the supply/demand curves when will we see parity?

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abishur
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:59 pm

The following is my understanding, but please take it with a grain of salt.  I'm not privy to the inner workings of RS, Farnell, or the RPF.  But this is based completely on the information provided via blog posts, forum comments, and tweets

My understanding is ~700 boards were sent out by each Distributor.  This makes for a total of ~1400 boards sent out by the distributors.  The other ~600 were given predominantly to QT developers, and others of note (other programmers/developers, news people, reserve for given out to children like Eben/Liz did the other day, etc)

The immediate stock has been spent.

There are another 8K boards which are being sent directly to the distributors.  They'll have to go through customs and all that fun jazz, but that will provide about another ~4K per distributor to send out.

The two distributors have already started serial production of the boards, which means that for anyone not in the first ~10K boards shouldn't have to wait too long for their turn to come up
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ErvKosch
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:04 pm

Please forgive but 'serial production'?  Are they pouring milk on the units and hope they will sprout more? Does that mean each supply house is now producing there own version of the RPI or are the going through a common firm?

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abishur
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:10 pm

Top google hit when searching serial production

But it means that they are directly producing the R-pi.  It is not their own spin on it, they are identical.  But they are allowed to directly produce the boards themselves instead of having to go through the RPF (that's a good thing, it means we get our boards much, *much* quicker)
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ErvKosch
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:17 pm

Thanks for the responses.  Do you know what the licensing fee is to become an RPI producer?

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mkopack
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:21 pm

Basically it means that it's continuous production, NOT the following:

"RPF orders a batch of 10,000", those 10,000 get shipped to customers, then they order another 10,000... (which is how it would have been if the RPF had done all the production/sales/shipping itself.)

Basically, RS+Farnell have started non-stop production and we should start seeing boards coming continuously from here on out from those production runs. So the backlog should get blown through quite quickly once the first ones from the continuous production start flowing out to customers. Those production ones SHOULD start appearing around end of this month/early May based on what I've seen posted.

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Montala
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:37 pm

Thanks for two very informative posts Abishur, although I do fully appreciate that they are purely you own personal understanding of the current position in respect of the on-going production process.

What I think is now the main concern for the majority of customers, which is those who have either not yet received their Raspberry Pi's, or an indication that they are definitely in the next batch, is the actual speed of this serial production you mention.

After the first mad chaotic rush had settled down and prospective customer were actually able to place a firm order (or at least express an interest in doing so), apart from either a vague optimistic date, or a mention of 'August' we have received no further information as to when we might actually receive our products, and this is what is causing the frustration.

Surely by now 'they' must have some idea as to the production programme, and the number of units which will be produced each day, week or month, and be in a position to at least make some sort of official announcement?

I personally think that RS Components are the worst offenders here as apart from a few dates assuring us that they are aware of our 'interest' and telling us that we are 'somewhere' in 'some sort of a queue' we have been told nothing.

There is probably nothing you can do about it personally, but now that shipping has commenced, and boards are actually being despatched, it is starting to get VERY frustrating.

Thanks for listening!

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:50 pm

Abishur said:


The following is my understanding, but please take it with a grain of salt.  I'm not privy to the inner workings of RS, Farnell, or the RPF.  But this is based completely on the information provided via blog posts, forum comments, and tweets


Abishur - many thanks for your recent posts and attempts to keep us informed (it is much appreciated) but if your are an 'Admin' then why do you not have the definitive information from RPF? Neither you, or anyone, should have to search forums, blogs and Twitter to find out the latest status of where these things have disappeared to.

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:01 pm

timn said:


Abishur said:


The following is my understanding, but please take it with a grain of salt.  I'm not privy to the inner workings of RS, Farnell, or the RPF.  But this is based completely on the information provided via blog posts, forum comments, and tweets


Abishur - many thanks for your recent posts and attempts to keep us informed (it is much appreciated) but if your are an 'Admin' then why do you not have the definitive information from RPF? Neither you, or anyone, should have to search forums, blogs and Twitter to find out the latest status of where these things have disappeared to.



Most of us admins are here to help out in the forums, we make sure that misinformation isn't being spread, that people are playing nice, and answer questions where we can.  But I am not an employee of the RPF.  As such there are things that they simply cannot divulge.  I have to wait to get my news just the same as everyone else

That said, I have an excessively good memory (at least I do when I'm not trying to remember if something applies to Austria or Australia, stupid dyslexia) so it's not that I'm having to search forums, blogs and twitters posts, it's that I'm remembering what has already been said on them and presenting them in a quick readable format for people to enjoy.  I should also mention that I actually already made a thread discussing this here, but it only covers 100% official updates which is why the status of the remaining 8K are not mentioned.

It's actually a pinned topic so I was a little surprised to see this thread pop up at all, but I left it open so people could speculate as much as they desired off the known facts
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AlArenal
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:53 am

Montala said:


After the first mad chaotic rush had settled down and prospective customer were actually able to place a firm order (or at least express an interest in doing so), apart from either a vague optimistic date, or a mention of 'August' we have received no further information as to when we might actually receive our products, and this is what is causing the frustration.

Surely by now 'they' must have some idea as to the production programme, and the number of units which will be produced each day, week or month, and be in a position to at least make some sort of official announcement?


I understand and to some degree share this frustration. But the process of getting the boards produced and shipped has tought us one lesson of life: Expect the unexpected.

Sure, the board design has proven to be good according to EMF testing, etc. But until RS and Farnell did not get anything produced (probably somewhere in China) and tested by themselves they do not now if whatever factory does it for them is able to deliver the product with the required quality and quantity.

We all remember the "Ethergate" disaster. You wouldn't want to contract someone doing mass production for you until you made sure he can deliver. And take the supply chain into consideration. Some hundred thousand people expressed their "interest" in this product. That translates to hundreds of thousands, maybe even more than a million Pis that could get sold in a rather short amount of time.

Within this period you'd need a million identical chips from Broadcom and Hynix (or whoever makes the PoP RAM), sockets, etc. pp. You have to make sure they can deliver as well.

It makes quite a difference if you do a little party and order some pizza or if you're planning for catering of an event with hundreds of people.

That's we kinda feel like being left hanging out to dry is bad. No doubt about it. That I'd wanted both Farnell and RS to be more proactive in communication is also true. If memory serves me well we were promised weekly updates but nothing has happend in my inbox for about two weeks. I was happy when I could finally place an order but I have nothing to track it - or at least nobody told me how to apart from calling them by phone.

Yesterday Farnell tweeted about "Hey we wanted to keep you up to date, look at this" and shared a URL to a blog that has been updated four days ago. That's just not good enough.

Things are more complex than they seem and wouldn't help us to get vague estimates that would only apply more and more pressure to Farnell and RS and raise our frustration level. I'm positive that everyone on this is doing her / his best and in the end we'll all have our piece of the Pi. We've lived so long without one, we'll survive another week or month or quarter

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:14 am

I think everyone needs to get a good dose of patience. Everyone wants everything now now now these days. For example, my other half sold something on Ebay - sold Sunday afternoon. On Tuesday afternoon she had received an irate email saying she hadn't responded to any of the buyers emails and if she didn't do so soon he would cancel the sale. When she checked, he had emailed on Monday evening, Tuesday during the day. She was at work Tuesday, and hadn't checked email Monday night because she was busy. She doesn't have a smartphone.  Now, can someone explain how someone can get so irate because they hadn't received a reply to two emails sent within less than 24hrs?

People need to learn a bit of patience - both on the Raspi's themselves, and on information. It's only been a few days since the tests passed, certainly not enough time to figure out production rates etc. Just wait. You'll get your Pi soon enough.
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:15 am

Ervin Kosch said:


Thanks for the responses.  Do you know what the licensing fee is to become an RPI producer?


By producer you mean someone that builds them then I'm sure that Farnell & RS would be more than happy to entertain your enquiry - assuming you have automated assembly lines, rows of solder stations and testing equipment - and can match China pricing .

If you mean distributor, then Farnell & RS have that covered.

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:15 am

So only 10k when there are apparently 250k orders (and this is going to grow as the Pi is STILL getting masses of mainstream news coverage all over the place) is due to fear of manufacturing errors? It's all a bit of a shame that expertise in large volume manufacturing wasn't sought long before now - seems a case of 'fingers crossed China don't mess it up again'.

Oh well, it's still an impossibly cool project and the delays, balls ups and flapping about are reminiscent of of the good old days of early personal computing - all very Acorn, very Sinclair. Great nostalgia!

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:26 am

BlowingRaspberries said:


So only 10k when there are apparently 250k orders (and this is going to grow as the Pi is STILL getting masses of mainstream news coverage all over the place) is due to fear of manufacturing errors? It's all a bit of a shame that expertise in large volume manufacturing wasn't sought long before now – seems a case of 'fingers crossed China don't mess it up again'.

Oh well, it's still an impossibly cool project and the delays, balls ups and flapping about are reminiscent of of the good old days of early personal computing – all very Acorn, very Sinclair. Great nostalgia!


10k have been planned and financed by the RPF before anyone could register his interest and so it was before anyone could know how big the market already was. The 10k were planned to be sold to early adopters, software and hardware developers, etc., not so much to ordinary people wanting to play around with a cheap device, setting up their own media servers, etc.

Noone imagined the interest would be this overwhelming right from the start. Initially (correct me if I'm wrong) it was considered to be a rather small and rather local market and the RPF would have ordered batch after batch as long as needed. Someone has to pay the bills and they just could not handle the production and distribution of tens and hundreds of thousands of Pis themselves in their free time. So when the interest grew they decided to license the Pi to RS and Farnell and that was the point at which we finally got numbers. That was when we got to now how much interest there really was in the UK, Europe, North America, Australia, Asia, South America, etc.

Sometimes success can be quite surprising.

And the producer the RPF chose for their 10k batch doesn't necessarily have anything to do with whoever Farnell and RS chose. We should be carefuly not mix everything up

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:29 am

BlowingRaspberries said:


So only 10k when there are apparently 250k orders (and this is going to grow as the Pi is STILL getting masses of mainstream news coverage all over the place) is due to fear of manufacturing errors? It's all a bit of a shame that expertise in large volume manufacturing wasn't sought long before now - seems a case of 'fingers crossed China don't mess it up again'.

Oh well, it's still an impossibly cool project and the delays, balls ups and flapping about are reminiscent of of the good old days of early personal computing - all very Acorn, very Sinclair. Great nostalgia!


No, you have completely misread the situation. Now that testing (which we originally didn't expect to do at this stage) is complete, full production can start. That needs to ramp up. I really don't understand where you got the manufacturing errors still causing problems thing from. The first 10k batch had an ethernet plug issue. 2k have already been reworked and sent to end users via RS and Farnell. The rest of the 10k is done, and is going to RS/Farnell for distribution.

Expertise in large volume manufacturing is in place, RS and Farnell do it all the time, and the Foundation has some very experienced people on board.
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:13 am

Thanks for the background information! I did order on the first day sometime after the servers crashed - guess I'm just impatient and curious as to whether I'm number 3678 or 201,454.

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:17 am

BlowingRaspberries said:


Thanks for the background information! I did order on the first day sometime after the servers crashed - guess I'm just impatient and curious as to whether I'm number 3678 or 201,454.



Same here. As long as you (and everyone else who still has no Pi) is behind me, everything is a-ok.

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:22 am


JamesH said:


For example, my other half sold something on Ebay - sold Sunday afternoon. On Tuesday afternoon she had received an irate email saying she hadn't responded to any of the buyers emails and if she didn't do so soon he would cancel the sale. When she checked, he had emailed on Monday evening, Tuesday during the day. She was at work Tuesday, and hadn't checked email Monday night because she was busy. She doesn't have a smartphone.  Now, can someone explain how someone can get so irate because they hadn't received a reply to two emails sent within less than 24hrs?


Short answer to this is, I would expect an answer quickly! If someone chooses to sell something via a global 24-hour online system I would expect a rapid turn-around to queries.

If one prefers to sell at a more leisurely pace, then stick a note in the local shop window with a postal address for responses.


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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:32 am

What you're saying is as soon as someone is online he has to respond to everything within hours? I mean come on, there's normal people out there who don't spend half the day sitting on a computer, checking and answering to their private emails.

And selling stuff on eBay from time to time doesn't automatically make you a commercial powerseller. Email is a asynchronous communication tool, like it or not.

There's professionals out there, working online for a living, who don't guarantee you answer times below 48 hours. Often it's these people who do better, because they're busy and focused on getting work done, instead of getting distracted every time their mail client pops up. That's why a lot of people turn it off for hours..

ErvKosch
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:33 am

nmcc said:


Ervin Kosch said:


Thanks for the responses.  Do you know what the licensing fee is to become an RPI producer?


By producer you mean someone that builds them then I'm sure that Farnell & RS would be more than happy to entertain your enquiry - assuming you have automated assembly lines, rows of solder stations and testing equipment - and can match China pricing .

If you mean distributor, then Farnell & RS have that covered.


I meant someone that builds the units.  I don't think that Farnell & RS should have a monopoly on the production.  So I kindly ask again, does anyone know what the licensing fee is to become an RPI producer/builder?

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:41 am

Ervin Kosch said:


I meant someone that builds the units.  I don't think that Farnell & RS should have a monopoly on the production.  So I kindly ask again, does anyone know what the licensing fee is to become an RPI producer/builder?


By definition it is no monopoly if there are two. And it's even more different from a monopoly because pricing is not up to Farnell and RS. You should ask Liz about this if you really want to do it (and not just out of curiosity). If the RPF told you then supposedly only after you signed an NDA.

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:46 am

Ervin Kosch said:


nmcc said:


Ervin Kosch said:


Thanks for the responses.  Do you know what the licensing fee is to become an RPI producer?


By producer you mean someone that builds them then I'm sure that Farnell & RS would be more than happy to entertain your enquiry - assuming you have automated assembly lines, rows of solder stations and testing equipment - and can match China pricing .

If you mean distributor, then Farnell & RS have that covered.


I meant someone that builds the units.  I don't think that Farnell & RS should have a monopoly on the production.  So I kindly ask again, does anyone know what the licensing fee is to become an RPI producer/builder?


Yes. But that's not public information. You will need to talk to Eben and Liz re: this, and sign lots of legal docs and NDA's. I do know that part of the contract states you cannot sell for more than the prices quoted by the Foundation, which doesn't give much room for profit. You will also likely need an independent contract with Broadcom for supply of the SoC which might be difficult to arrange. So there are quite a few hoops to jump through, but if you are really sure, go for it. Contact Liz/Eben..
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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:51 am

Alex Langer said:


There"s professionals out there, working online for a living, who don"t guarantee you answer times below 48 hours. Often it"s these people who do better, because they"re busy and focused on getting work done, instead of getting distracted every time their mail client pops up. That"s why a lot of people turn it off for hours..

It's all about choice, I suppose. you stick with your 'on-line' services with a mimium 48-hour turn around, and I'll stick with the ones that really are on-line.


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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:54 am

JamesH said:


Yes. But that's not public information. You will need to talk to Eben and Liz re: this, and sign lots of legal docs and NDA's. I do know that part of the contract states you cannot sell for more than the prices quoted by the Foundation, which doesn't give much room for profit. You will also likely need an independent contract with Broadcom for supply of the SoC which might be difficult to arrange. So there are quite a few hoops to jump through, but if you are really sure, go for it. Contact Liz/Eben..


Thanks, all I wanted was a direct answer.  I figure there would be a bunch hops to jump through.

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Re: # of Units Shipped?

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:59 am

Ervin Kosch said:


I meant someone that builds the units.  I don't think that Farnell & RS should have a monopoly on the production.  So I kindly ask again, does anyone know what the licensing fee is to become an RPI producer/builder?


RS & Farnell, the distributors, are sub-contracting production at present - if you are a manufacturer, why not contact them and ask about quoting for production? They should be able to answer your questions rather than our random speculation.

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