davidwilliams0644
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I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better for

Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:53 am

I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better for the robotics enthusiast, Arduino or Raspberry Pi?

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B.Goode
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:47 am

Welcome to the Raspberry Pi forums.

davidwilliams0644 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:53 am
I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better for the robotics enthusiast, Arduino or Raspberry Pi?


Getting Started: https://www.raspberrypi.org/help/

Edit to add: there is also a paper or online book - The Official Raspberry Pi Beginner’s Guide book https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/the-ne ... erry-pi-4/



Best resources: https://www.raspberrypi.org/

In particular -
https://projects.raspberrypi.org/en/
https://www.raspberrypi.org/magpi/issues/82/ (Back issues also available.)
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/



Arduino or RPi?
Define better.
Arduino is simpler (only one single task.)
Arduino can provide tighter time-critical control (because it has no Operating System.)
Arduino can support Analog devices directly via built in ADC connection pins.

Arduino offers pretty much no choice of programming language or development environment.
Arduino usually requires code development on an external system and an 'upload' step before the code can be tested.


Summary: they are too different to make a binary decision - use both as appropriate, as necessary.
Last edited by B.Goode on Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

dsyleixa123
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:04 am

B.Goode wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:47 am
Welcome to the Raspberry Pi forums.
Arduino or RPi?
Define better.
Arduino is simpler (only one single task.)
Arduino can provide tighter time-critical control (because it has no Operating System.)
Arduino can support Analog devices directly via built in ADC connection pins.

Arduino offers pretty much no choice of programming language or development environment.
Arduino usually requires code development on an external system and an 'upload' step before the code can be tested.


Summary: they are too different to make a binary decision - use both as appropriate, as necessary.
Arduino = only single task is not true. For all Arduinos there is cooperative multithreading provided by the Scheduler class, and additionally there are RTOS-based (semi-) preemptive multithreading libs for Teensy (TeensyThread for M4 single cores) and ESP32 (RTOS and std::thread for the ESP32 dual cores).
The biggest pro for Arduinos is the simple and convenient IDE and API which provide tons of libs for almost everything.
Arduino is programmed in C++ but there are also other PLs (e.g. Java and Scratch, not very common though)
Programming the Arduino on a PC or a Pi and then uploading is correct, it's almost like programming the Pi via ssh or perhaps via Windows toolchains.
Also IoT programming is far easier using the Arduino IDE, e.g. via esp8266 or esp32 wifi and webserver libs (I have not tried the Arduino Wifi shield yet admittedly).

For programming the Pi I am now also using C/C++ via the Geany IDE like some others before, because command line compiling/building and makefiles and all that was too complicated and too cumbersome to me.
The Raspi foundation supports just Python, but there is a MagPi for free download about C programming which is quite fine.

edited (typo)
Last edited by dsyleixa123 on Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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B.Goode
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:16 am

Arduino = only single task is not true. For all Arduinos there is cooperative multithreading provided by the Scheduler class, and additionally there are RTOS-based (semi-) preemptive multithreading libs for Teensy (M4 single core) and ESP32 (dual core).


Correct, of course.

I was guilty of over-simplification for an assumed newcomer.

There will probably be no agreement on a precise alternative: something like Arduino is simpler (only one single executable program.)

dsyleixa123
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:21 am

yes, I agree, and the Raspi Linux OS is a huge and steep obstacle for complete newcomers.

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rpdom
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:38 am

dsyleixa123 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:21 am
yes, I agree, and the Raspi Linux OS is a huge and steep obstacle for complete newcomers.
I'd argue that is the same for any OS on any system for someone who hasn't used one before.

LTolledo
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:44 am

I always program my arduinos (and the likes) using my (then) RPi3B, with Raspbian Jessie with Pixel and Arduino IDE nightly builds.
...sort of combining both worlds....

I've since upgraded that to RPi3B+ with Raspbian Stretch with Desktop (long upgrade from Jessie).
still doing some python coding from time to time on the RPi3B, which was also upgraded to Raspbian Stretch...

Immerse yourself with the project samples, and modify it to your liking/use-case.....

but of course, start with the some of the basics, specially if you're doing some electronics fiddling...

To prevent those "accidental shorts" that can render your RPi as K.I.A. may I suggest you encase the RPi in some non-metallic case specifically designed for the RPi3B (or you can make your own out of calling card boxes)
Make sure you get yourself a good power supply (...and not just any phone charger...please!).
"Don't come to me with 'issues' for I don't know how to deal with those
Come to me with 'problems' and I'll help you find solutions"

Some people be like:
"Help me! Am drowning! But dont you dare touch me nor come near me!"

jahboater
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:50 am

rpdom wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:38 am
dsyleixa123 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:21 am
yes, I agree, and the Raspi Linux OS is a huge and steep obstacle for complete newcomers.
I'd argue that is the same for any OS on any system for someone who hasn't used one before.
I'd argue that its often simpler.
Take writing an OS image to an SD card, something we Pi users do often.

Windows cannot write to a raw disk, so a separate third party program must be installed (etcher or wind32diskimager)
Linux can, and the plain "cp" copy command works fine.

Windows has trouble with the modern 64-bit zip format, so again a third party program is needed (7zip or etcher)
The Linux unzip has correctly supported ZIP64 for over a decade
(which is odd because zip was originally a windows thing).

I cant remember what you do for the SHA256 checksum on Windows (its not obvious), but Linux has a simple program provided as standard (sha256sum).

hippy
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:03 am

jahboater wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:50 am
rpdom wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:38 am
dsyleixa123 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:21 am
yes, I agree, and the Raspi Linux OS is a huge and steep obstacle for complete newcomers.
I'd argue that is the same for any OS on any system for someone who hasn't used one before.
I'd argue that its often simpler.
Take writing an OS image to an SD card, something we Pi users do often.

Windows cannot write to a raw disk, so a separate third party program must be installed (etcher or wind32diskimager)...
Using BalenaEtcher on Windows it's a simple case of inserting SD Card, launching BelanaEtcher, selecting the .zip file, and clicking the "Flash" button. It doesn't get much simpler than that.

But I took dsyleixa123 and rpdom to be referring to using rather than installing.

There is the PiDuino framework which can be used to create Pi programs using familiar Arduino idioms on the Pi within the Arduino IDE running on the Pi.

jahboater
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:11 am

hippy wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:03 am
Using BalenaEtcher on Windows it's a simple case of inserting SD Card, launching BelanaEtcher, selecting the .zip file, and clicking the "Flash" button. It doesn't get much simpler than that.
Yes, totally agree. But you had to download and install BalenaEtcher first.
My point was simply that the native Linux tools work fine without the user having to add third party software.

dsyleixa123
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:27 am

rpdom wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:38 am
dsyleixa123 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:21 am
yes, I agree, and the Raspi Linux OS is a huge and steep obstacle for complete newcomers.
I'd argue that is the same for any OS on any system for someone who hasn't used one before.
I would argue that using Windows (for running the Arduino IDE which (both) work out of the box) is much easier than Linux on the Pi, even when running Windows toolchains plus eclipse or what ever or via ssh for building Pi Linux programs (even then one had to handle the Linux overhead additionally).

OTOH, already Linux plus Python on the Pi requires some more knowledge about Linux than Windows does from it's users.

hippy
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:42 am

jahboater wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:11 am
hippy wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:03 am
Using BalenaEtcher on Windows it's a simple case of inserting SD Card, launching BelanaEtcher, selecting the .zip file, and clicking the "Flash" button. It doesn't get much simpler than that.
Yes, totally agree. But you had to download and install BalenaEtcher first.
My point was simply that the native Linux tools work fine without the user having to add third party software.
Downloading and installing third party software and using that on Windows can often be easier than using the provided software on Linux. Installing the latest Arduino IDE and the PiDuino framework under Windows was a breeze compared to the hours struggling to make that work on a Pi itself.

But we are drifting into 'my OS is better than your OS' territory. The original point I believe was that using a target system with an OS will likely be more complicated than using a programming tool which then throws the developed code at the target. I would agree with that.

But, while that might be easier, it doesn't necessarily make it better. There is no absolute better as noted; that depends on what one wants to do, what is most suitable for doing it, and what experience one has.

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rpdom
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:47 pm

dsyleixa123 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:27 am
rpdom wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:38 am
dsyleixa123 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:21 am
yes, I agree, and the Raspi Linux OS is a huge and steep obstacle for complete newcomers.
I'd argue that is the same for any OS on any system for someone who hasn't used one before.
I would argue that using Windows (for running the Arduino IDE which (both) work out of the box) is much easier than Linux on the Pi, even when running Windows toolchains plus eclipse or what ever or via ssh for building Pi Linux programs (even then one had to handle the Linux overhead additionally).

OTOH, already Linux plus Python on the Pi requires some more knowledge about Linux than Windows does from it's users.
I was talking about general use of the OS, not specific toolchains. Someone who has never used a computer before would find any OS equally difficult to use at first.

On a number of occasions I have had guests who wanted to use a PC for general stuff and I've given them a Linux system to use. They didn't even realise they weren't using Windows, just that some of the icons and menus were slightly different to what they were used to.

W. H. Heydt
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Re: I bought a Raspberry Pi 3 model B. Where should I start and what are the best resources on the net ? Which is better

Fri Jun 28, 2019 4:14 pm

davidwilliams0644 wrote:
Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:53 am
Which is better for the robotics enthusiast, Arduino or Raspberry Pi?
The short answer is: Yes.

Since the major factors of choice between them have been expounded on in this thread, just let me a bit of joke that has circulated about this question ever since the question first came up several years ago...

Pi for the brains, Arduino for the muscles.

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