KanoMaster22
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2016 6:06 pm

Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:46 pm

I know this has probably been asked before, but I thought I read recently that you were allowed to buy more than one Pi Zero now.
1. Is this true?
2. If it is is there anyway that will sell me more than one (everywhere seems to only sell 1 only still) at the price of £4.80?

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24149
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Tue Nov 28, 2017 5:10 pm

You can buy in large quantities, or ones...

By large, 500's at least.

EDIT: Forgot to say, for larger orders the price per unit INCREASES.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

W. H. Heydt
Posts: 11091
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:36 pm
Location: Vallejo, CA (US)

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:19 pm

There was one report of some company selling multiple Pi0s in the same transaction. MicroCenter has done so from time to time, but they charge more for Pi0s after the first one (and they only sell Pi0s and Pi0Ws in their physical stores, so they aren't a viable vendor for all but a very tiny proportion of Pi owners). One of the UK suppliers was selling multiple Pi0s and Pi0Ws, but only if you bought ones in which they had installed the GPIO header pins.

So far as i know, there has been no general relaxation of the "one per customer" announced by the RPF/RPT.

It is interesting that 2 (!) years after launch, and in spite of the Pi0W, depand is still outstripping supply to the point that the "one per order" has to be retained. "Steam engine time" would appear to have arrived for a $5 computer.

User avatar
HawaiianPi
Posts: 4871
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2013 4:53 am
Location: Aloha, Oregon USA

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:51 pm

Adafruit had a brief period where there was no restriction on placing an order for multiple Pi Zero v1.3, but that appeared to be a glitch as the restriction was reimposed a day or so later (and it's unknown if the order would have actually shipped).

One of the Pi dealers will sell multiples if you buy their version with pre-soldered GPIO headers, but of course that costs extra.

So the bottom line is, no, you can't buy multiple Pi Zero computers anywhere for $5 (or the Zero W for $10).

The best you can do is order 1 Pi Zero and 1 Pi Zero W at the same time.
My mind is like a browser. 27 tabs are open, 9 aren't responding,
lots of pop-ups...and where is that annoying music coming from?

User avatar
Ronaldlees
Posts: 294
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 4:28 pm
Location: North Carolina, US
Contact: Website

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:34 pm

I keep seeing ads from people who are selling multiple Pi Zeros in lots. The ads say they are made by Raspberry Pi Trading, Ltd, and they typically are priced at about $13. Are the ads legit?
I am the Umbrella man

W. H. Heydt
Posts: 11091
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:36 pm
Location: Vallejo, CA (US)

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:20 am

HawaiianPi wrote:
Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:51 pm
The best you can do is order 1 Pi Zero and 1 Pi Zero W at the same time.
Good luck with that. Every vendor I've tried to do that with restricts you to one OR the other, not one of each.

User avatar
HawaiianPi
Posts: 4871
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2013 4:53 am
Location: Aloha, Oregon USA

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:33 am

W. H. Heydt wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:20 am
Good luck with that. Every vendor I've tried to do that with restricts you to one OR the other, not one of each.
Adafruit let's me go through the checkout process without protest. Did you try to order from them?
My mind is like a browser. 27 tabs are open, 9 aren't responding,
lots of pop-ups...and where is that annoying music coming from?

fanoush
Posts: 491
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:37 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:51 am

HawaiianPi wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:33 am
Adafruit let's me go through the checkout process without protest. Did you try to order from them?
I got this combination from shop in CZ. They limit each to one but allow both. This seems fair to me as it is different product. Also even if they wouldn't allow this, it is no big issue for me anymore since local shipping is bearable (50CZK~=2.2USD). This is much better than Pimoroni I used before (4GBP for shipping). So since they extended list of resellers I can't complain about getting Zero anymore :-)

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24149
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:48 am

Ronaldlees wrote:
Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:34 pm
I keep seeing ads from people who are selling multiple Pi Zeros in lots. The ads say they are made by Raspberry Pi Trading, Ltd, and they typically are priced at about $13. Are the ads legit?
Can you post a link to one of these ads?

All Zero's are made by RPF(T), and you can buy in bulk at a higher price. Bulk is > 500 or so. So someone could do that, then sell on smaller batches if they wanted to and could afford the up front costs. The would be 'legit'.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

fanoush
Posts: 491
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:37 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:48 am

jamesh wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:48 am
you can buy in bulk at a higher price. Bulk is > 500 or so.
So basically the one Zero per order/customer is no longer due to production limits but is now part of pricing model. And now there is no incentive to drop this limit as it would lower the profits. So the $5 Zero is a "trial/non-commercial/for personal use" version of the product sold with a discount. Well, OK, in some ways it makes sense.

User avatar
scruss
Posts: 2628
Joined: Sat Jun 09, 2012 12:25 pm
Location: Toronto, ON
Contact: Website

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:47 pm

jamesh wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:48 am
… you can buy in bulk at a higher price. Bulk is > 500 or so.
Is this for you == ‘anyone’, or only for you == 'official Raspberry Pi resellers’?
‘Remember the Golden Rule of Selling: “Do not resort to violence.”’ — McGlashan.

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24149
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:02 pm

scruss wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:47 pm
jamesh wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:48 am
… you can buy in bulk at a higher price. Bulk is > 500 or so.
Is this for you == ‘anyone’, or only for you == 'official Raspberry Pi resellers’?
Anyone, as long as the order quantity is high enough. PM me if you want more details.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24149
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:06 pm

fanoush wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:48 am
jamesh wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:48 am
you can buy in bulk at a higher price. Bulk is > 500 or so.
So basically the one Zero per order/customer is no longer due to production limits but is now part of pricing model. And now there is no incentive to drop this limit as it would lower the profits. So the $5 Zero is a "trial/non-commercial/for personal use" version of the product sold with a discount. Well, OK, in some ways it makes sense.
Pretty much. The profit margin on the Zero is so low that we can afford to sell it with a discount in one offs* to those people who really cannot afford the Pi3, but not in quantity to industrial buyers. They need to pay a price that makes it cost effective for us to sell. i.e. why should we give industrial users an educational discount...?

* In effect, since the Zero(W) would cannibalise sales from the other models, we lose the profit margin we would make on the P3. Cannot afford to do that in quantity.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

KanoMaster22
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2016 6:06 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:26 pm

Is there anyway to get one Pi Zero and one Pi Zero W in the UK at the same time?

W. H. Heydt
Posts: 11091
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:36 pm
Location: Vallejo, CA (US)

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 3:33 pm

KanoMaster22 wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:26 pm
Is there anyway to get one Pi Zero and one Pi Zero W in the UK at the same time?
If the UK vendors won't do that for you, order one from PiHut and one from Pimoroni.

KanoMaster22
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2016 6:06 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 4:57 pm

It seems it might work at Pi Supply. Enter all my details and checked out and it didn't show any error messages, although I didn't do the credit card details bit, I think it might work.

fanoush
Posts: 491
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:37 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:07 pm

fanoush wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:51 am
I got this combination from shop in CZ. They limit each to one but allow both. This seems fair to me as it is different product. Also even if they wouldn't allow this, it is no big issue for me anymore since local shipping is bearable (50CZK~=2.2USD). This is much better than Pimoroni I used before (4GBP for shipping). So since they extended list of resellers I can't complain about getting Zero anymore :-)
Wow. I spoke too soon. I made one Zero related order with the CZ shop two weeks ago and it went fine. I also made other orders with them over years, when they did not stock Zero yet, and never had an issue. I made second Zero related order today just to test it again and get second pair of Zero + W and verify it was not a coincidence earlier. And they cancelled my whole order and told me this is strictly one per customer. Not one per order but one per customer, period. I asked if I bought it too soon (14 days) and whether when cancelled now I can buy another one let's say next month. I got no direct answer to this but was told that if I want second Zero from them I should buy the one with presoldered header. Or some kit. They claim that by wanting second set of bare Zero and W I am abusing the system because the price of Zero without header is subsidized and I am taking money away from charity by ordering this.

Is this OK? Did they misunderstood something or is this the way it is now? They are really not supposed to sell me another bare Zero? Ever? What are the rules? Should I really feel bad for wanting second Zero and Zero W from them?

I told them I got few Zeroes over year(s) from Pimoroni and it wasn't a problem and they explained that I was not supposed to get more and they just failed to check my previous orders properly.

I understand I should not resell them or base business on this. But having only one ever - this is not just limitation for personal use, this is more like one time promotional gift. One point of having cheap Zero is making something with it and then keeping it there. Then getting another one and doing something else.

Well, I could still get the one with presoldered headers. They even told me they will sell me twenty of them. And I just tried to put more of them in the basket for single order and it seems to work (up to five per order). But, well, apart from being more expensive (130CZK/5EUR difference for one plain Zero, i.e almost twice the price) I really rarely want the straight male header soldered. I often want nothing, or female, or angled one. Soldering one is easy but desoldering one is a pain. So paying extra just to do such extra work and possibly damage the board does no sound so great to me.

So well, I am not happy again. When the stock was limited due to slow production it was understandable but this is yet another level. I still hope this is some misunderstanding.

EDIT: now when reading this part from jamesh
jamesh wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:06 pm
The profit margin on the Zero is so low that we can afford to sell it with a discount in one offs* to those people who really cannot afford the Pi3, but not in quantity to industrial buyers.
I think I maybe missed the right meaning of the phrase "one-off". So by wanting another one later I am industrial buyer?
EDIT2:
When checking pimoroni page https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/raspberry-pi-zero
it clearly says "THIS PRODUCT IS LIMITED TO 1 PER ORDER."
Last edited by fanoush on Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Heater
Posts: 13908
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 3:02 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:01 pm

I think the message is clear enough. We are all only supposed to get one Pi Zero each.

If we want more, placing multiple orders with the same or multiple suppliers, then we are draining the resources of the Pi Foundation. There is little or no mark up, profit, on the Pi Zero for them. Manufacturing Pi Zero diverts manufacturing supply from the other models.

Think of it like those free toys that fall out of corn flake packets in the morning (Do they still do that?) Or the free toys you get when buying a Big Mac.

Don't be greedy. I don't know what is so hard to understand about this.

Perhaps, maybe, some suppliers limit to one per order while others might limit to one per customer, ever. I guess that is down to how much effort they want to put into tracking you and your purchases.

If you want more toys, buy more Big Macs. As it were.

Having said that, I'm not sure what the deal is with suppliers that will let you buy as many as you like as long as you have header pins soldered on. Of course they can charge for the extra work they do. But do they also pay more to the Foundation for the Pi Zero they start from?
Memory in C++ is a leaky abstraction .

ejolson
Posts: 3820
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:47 am

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:14 am

Heater wrote:
Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:01 pm
I think the message is clear enough. We are all only supposed to get one Pi Zero each.
If you live near MicroCenter you can fetch another Zero on the way home from grocery shopping every week, but once in the store be careful to not buy too many other things.

As a learning environment for teaching programming, the total ownership cost of a Pi Zero is not much different from the other Pi models. However the Zero excels in being small and light weight. The observation that less is more applies very clearly: adding even a GPIO header makes it less suitable for some applications.

The Zero is small, easily broken and easily lost if sent up in a balloon. The idea that once you have purchased a Zero you are never allowed another is in direct contraction to the kind of experimental leaning the Pi is supposed to encourage by being cheap and easily replaceable if broken.

Some people who are wanting multiple Zeros are setting up computing clubs or involved in some sort of advocacy activity for learning programming. Others want to create commercial IoT projects like computerized doorbells, security and entertainment systems. The Pi would not be useful for education if it wasn't useful for other things. The danger with charity and entitlement programs is corruption, greed and disparity. A competitive free market works well to provide people with high quality items at low prices, subsidies and rationing not so much.

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24149
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:22 am

The rules as I understand them is one per order. That's enough of a gateway to prevent individual large purchases. If you want large numbers, approach us and pay more.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

fanoush
Posts: 491
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:37 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:27 am

jamesh wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:22 am
The rules as I understand them is one per order.
Thanks, so is this official enough so I could point the shop owner to this? Well, I'll just do it and see what happens.

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24149
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:40 am

fanoush wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:27 am
jamesh wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:22 am
The rules as I understand them is one per order.
Thanks, so is this official enough so I could point the shop owner to this? Well, I'll just do it and see what happens.
I'll double check, but the guy I need to talk with is on the phone right now, so will get to it sometime today.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24149
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:16 am

jamesh wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:40 am
fanoush wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:27 am
jamesh wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:22 am
The rules as I understand them is one per order.
Thanks, so is this official enough so I could point the shop owner to this? Well, I'll just do it and see what happens.
I'll double check, but the guy I need to talk with is on the phone right now, so will get to it sometime today.
OK, I was wrong. The official statement is ONE per customer, not one per order. However, some re-sellers are not that strict and will let you buy one per order, but they do have systems in place to prevent large scale ordering and scalping, which is the reason for the rule in the first place.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

User avatar
B.Goode
Posts: 8987
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:03 pm
Location: UK

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:44 am

The official statement is ONE per customer, not one per order.
That appears to be what the 'Sticky' post on this topic says.

viewtopic.php?f=63&t=188011#p1184894
Pi 0 and Pi 0 W are still under a one unit per customer sales limit due to high demand, and the need for production capacity to build other models.

This limit is not likely to change in the near future, although efforts are being made to improve the supply situation.
(That was supposed to be the post that put an end to the need for further posts on the subject. About as successful as The Great War being "the War to End All Wars".)

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24149
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Buying More Than One Pi Zero

Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:49 am

That last paragraph is superseded. We now have the production capacity to build large batches, and if you want to buy large batches, you can at a higher unit price.

And that is about all I can say on the matter now, there will probably be more information available the next few weeks, but for the moment I'll close this thread.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

Return to “General discussion”