mikerr
Posts: 2783
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:46 pm
Location: UK
Contact: Website

Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 8:08 am

Not my sale, but noticed discounted Pi are now appearing in quantities:

Normal price from CPC is £28.07 inc delivery
http://cpc.farnell.com/jsp/search/produ ... ku=SC12590

Ebay sellers:

UK:
512Mb Model B :£23.99 inc delivery
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Raspberry-Pi- ... 1222018397

International:
512Mb Model B + Case + heatsinks: $39.99 ( £24.98) inc delivery
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-512mb-Ras ... 0755895470
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-512mb-Raspb ... 0755895470
Last edited by mikerr on Fri Mar 21, 2014 12:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Dutch_Master
Posts: 362
Joined: Sat Jul 27, 2013 11:36 am

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:56 pm

If it looks too good to be true, that's because it probably is.... :roll:

Oakham
Posts: 366
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:11 pm

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 1:54 pm

Searching is easy, most questions have been asked before !

John Bean
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:25 pm
Location: Pennine Lancashire

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 2:24 pm

It doesn't look too good to be true, it looks like a realistic price.

We've been used to the prices imposed by the original distributors Farnell and RS, neither of which is known for low prices.

The market is now more open - and competition rarely has a bad effect on prices :-)

User avatar
jbeale
Posts: 3500
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2011 11:51 pm
Contact: Website

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 2:41 pm

In this ebay link, the text says "512mb Raspberry Pi Rev 2" but the top-down photo clearly shows the very the first version, 256M Model B Rev 1 board. Look at the two green polyfuses in the corner near the USB ports (F1, F2 on the schematic). That version of the board has been out of production for over a year; those parts do not exist on the current version of the board. Either it is very old stock (found a box of factory rejects?), or it is a clone from the original layout, or they just lifted the photos from some old webpage and who knows what they actually have. Not sure which, but given that discrepancy, I wonder what else doesn't add up about this item.

(I can't imagine it is a clone, because even if they were stuck with the original PCB layout they couldn't have resisted doing the first BOM change, replacing those polyfuses with 0-ohm jumpers; not only a more recent update but it would also would save cost.)

User avatar
mahjongg
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
Posts: 12357
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2012 12:19 am
Location: South Holland, The Netherlands

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 2:56 pm

John Bean wrote:It doesn't look too good to be true, it looks like a realistic price.

We've been used to the prices imposed by the original distributors Farnell and RS, neither of which is known for low prices.

The market is now more open - and competition rarely has a bad effect on prices :-)
you are aware that only farewell and RS are actually producing PI's are you.
You do realize then that all others are buying from them is it not?

If the prices are lower elsewhere, it might be they are buying bulk, but they still have to make some money to cover their costs, and I doubt the bulk price can be so much lower than they are when bought directly from the producer through a web-shop. In fact, these are the markup prices in Euro's used by farnell for a raspberry PI model A.
1 - 9 € 28,88
10 - 24 € 23,11
25 - 49 € 21,62
50 - 99 € 20,88
100+ € 20,72
You figure out why some are selling PI's below the purchase price. :mrgreen: :twisted:

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 23980
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 2:57 pm

John Bean wrote:It doesn't look too good to be true, it looks like a realistic price.

We've been used to the prices imposed by the original distributors Farnell and RS, neither of which is known for low prices.

The market is now more open - and competition rarely has a bad effect on prices :-)
But worthwhile remembering that Farnell and RS are the only manufacturers so the market isn't as open as you might think. So people still have to get their stock from them. Unless they are buying Chinese boards.

Also note that the prices are imposed by the Foundation ($25, $35), Farnell/RS add on postage and packing and tax. This is why the boards still cost $25 and $35, rather than something a lot more. The manufacturers/distributors make their money from the difference between manufacturing cost and $25/$35.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

John Bean
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:25 pm
Location: Pennine Lancashire

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm

Sellers can charge whatever they want in the UK, there is no price fixing.

As for the sourcing duopoly of Farnell/RS - well, perhaps. Surely grey market sources exist? Whatever.

Mine came in "element 14" packaging but was well below Farnell pricing, bought from a Cambridge company with free next day delivery. I don't really care what they paid for it :-)

Oh - and a pedantic nit-pick: Farnell/RS are not the manufacturers, they're the (official) distributors.

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 23980
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 5:05 pm

John Bean wrote:Sellers can charge whatever they want in the UK, there is no price fixing.

As for the sourcing duopoly of Farnell/RS - well, perhaps. Surely grey market sources exist? Whatever.

Mine came in "element 14" packaging but was well below Farnell pricing, bought from a Cambridge company with free next day delivery. I don't really care what they paid for it :-)

Oh - and a pedantic nit-pick: Farnell/RS are not the manufacturers, they're the (official) distributors.
To be really pedantic, RS and Farnell ARE the manufacturers. They manufacture under licence from the Raspberry Pi Foundation. Of course, they sub that manufacture out to Sony in the UK. RS and Farnell are required under that licence to sell the devices for $25 and $35. Of course, anyone else can sell them for whatever they want after they have bought in bulk from RS or Farnell.

There is no grey market as far as I know. The SoC (when bought for Raspberry PI's) is sold only to RS and Farnell, or the Chinese people who make the red ones for the far East market. Of course, it's also sold to other customers for other devices.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

masterdrain
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:44 pm
Location: Isle of Wight
Contact: Website

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 8:57 pm

Jamesh wrote:-
"To be really pedantic, RS and Farnell ARE the manufacturers. They manufacture under licence from the Raspberry Pi Foundation. Of course, they sub that manufacture out to Sony in the UK. RS and Farnell are required under that licence to sell the devices for $25 and $35. Of course, anyone else can sell them for whatever they want after they have bought in bulk from RS or Farnell."

The Pi is a British design, British made and marketed by British companies. Stone me, this is about the only success story we have had of late and puts the UK back at the front of micro-computing where we were before IBM brought out the PC. Please, can we price the Pi and the bits in Pounds and not US dollars or Euros, though the latter is marginally preferable to $$. International markets can just as easily convert to £ as to $, so this is not an argument in favour of $$.

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 23980
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Cheap model B's

Sun Oct 06, 2013 9:14 pm

masterdrain wrote:Jamesh wrote:-
"To be really pedantic, RS and Farnell ARE the manufacturers. They manufacture under licence from the Raspberry Pi Foundation. Of course, they sub that manufacture out to Sony in the UK. RS and Farnell are required under that licence to sell the devices for $25 and $35. Of course, anyone else can sell them for whatever they want after they have bought in bulk from RS or Farnell."

The Pi is a British design, British made and marketed by British companies. Stone me, this is about the only success story we have had of late and puts the UK back at the front of micro-computing where we were before IBM brought out the PC. Please, can we price the Pi and the bits in Pounds and not US dollars or Euros, though the latter is marginally preferable to $$. International markets can just as easily convert to £ as to $, so this is not an argument in favour of $$.
Afraid not. All the parts are purchased in $, so if we priced in £, the price would fluctuate with the exchange rate. No such problem if the price is quoted in $. That's the only reason.

All you other points are valid -ARM is UK, VC4 was designed in the UK, board designed in the UK, manufactured in the UK. It's shame the SoC is actually manufactured in Taiwan!
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

fanoush
Posts: 485
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:37 pm

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Oct 07, 2013 10:00 am

mikerr wrote: UK:
512Mb Model B :£23.99 inc delivery
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Raspberry-Pi- ... 1222018397
With EU shipping this is only £1 cheaper than getting same pi from modmypi.com (= site I get redirected to when trying to buy from Farnell). And modmypi gives 5% of profits to Pi fondation :-)
mikerr wrote: International:
512Mb Model B + Case + heatsinks: $39.99 ( £24.98) inc delivery
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-512mb-Ras ... 0755895470
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-512mb-Raspb ... 0755895470
Item location: Hong Kong - so most probably I will need to pay VAT on top of those $39.99.

In EU there is 22EUR (~=29USD) VAT free import limit. I hope one day model A will be sold on ebay below that price including EU shipping so there is officially no need to pay the VAT :-)

User avatar
RaTTuS
Posts: 10493
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:12 am
Location: North West UK

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Oct 07, 2013 10:14 am

you also forget about egoman as manufacturers... but they only produce red board ones
How To ask Questions :- http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
WARNING - some parts of this post may be erroneous YMMV

1QC43qbL5FySu2Pi51vGqKqxy3UiJgukSX
Covfefe

Oakham
Posts: 366
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:11 pm

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Oct 07, 2013 9:14 pm

Picked up a New Element 14 Raspberry Pi Model B for £20.00 inc P&P, it is a revision 000e, from Ebay !

http://elinux.org/RPi_HardwareHistory
Searching is easy, most questions have been asked before !

MikeDobson
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Nov 04, 2013 5:51 pm
Location: Mississippi, USA

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:11 pm

mikerr wrote:Not my sale, but noticed discounted Pi are now appearing in quantities
I wonder if any more knowledgeable denizens here might attempt to enlighten a prospective owner by offering an opinion of the following eBay listings ?

Item 141105208566 by eOurLife

Item 331058499958 by 2010KostCerda

Item 231088377097 by LeeCourage

All three (3) above have exactly the same title: "NEW 512mb Raspberry Pi Rev 2 Ultimate Kit - Model B Board with case heatsink" and price ($30.99) ...

Too good to be true ?
Somehow "hiding" extra shipping costs ? (dunno HOW, but I've heard rumors of same)

When I first started looking at Raspberry Pi "semi-seriously" on eBay recently (I just happen to have an eBay "$20 off" coupon - which expires soon, of course - and would probably not even consider "splurging" on a Pi otherwise), I noticed some for very close to the "published" price for "model B" ($34.99, $35.99) but INCLUDING shipping (from China of course). Most of the ~$35 listings are "gone" now, having sold a LOT (by my "standards" anyway); the "current" listings above have also already sold many (the first link, over a hundred in just a few days!).

However! By my estimation, NONE (or very few) of these "cheap Model B" sales have had time to arrive at their destination so far, therefore, no time for any honest feedback based upon them ...

This is my "usual" search on the subject ...
jbeale wrote:In this ebay link, the text says "512mb Raspberry Pi Rev 2" but the top-down photo clearly shows the very the first version, 256M Model B Rev 1 board. ... I wonder what else doesn't add up [emphasis mine] about this item.
I recall checking jbeale's link above, noting that the user alia8163 "has decided to make his/her Feedback comments private" (if I understand correctly, you can NOT sell on eBay with this setting ?) ... And that the majority of the user's "negative" feedback (for which you cannot see details of course!) are within the past month !

Also, you can see that the "original listing" was "ended by the seller because the item is no longer available" and that they apparently "sold" 322 of them!

Thanks for reading! As a "newbie" here, I hope I haven't "gone on" too long, or violated some other "unwritten" rule (much less any "written" rule that I've missed).

User avatar
jbeale
Posts: 3500
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2011 11:51 pm
Contact: Website

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Nov 04, 2013 9:31 pm

Your first link "Item 141105208566 by eOurLife" has several contradictions (and checking the other two links, they seem identical in every respect). Near the bottom under "Package Contains" it says the auction is for two items (R-Pi and case) and it shows a tiny picture of a RED colored R-Pi (Made in China, not FCC/CE marked, and licensed for sale only in China). Below that, under "Package Includes" it claims a R-Pi "latest made in UK version". And at the top, and the very bottom under "Package Include" (sic) it also claims some heatsinks are included. The various photos show no less than three, quite different cases (top/bottom only + corner standoffs, a lasercut 6-sided case, and a 2-piece molded case).

All this for a list price of $30.99 which is not much below the selling price from the normal outlets (minus tax/shipping though). Seller claims 124 sold but I do not see any feedback from users having bought this particular item. What can I say... buyer beware. If you do go for it, let us know how it turns out!

EDIT: Actually I'm curious enough about this to risk $31 to find the answer myself. "ePacket delivery from China - Estimated delivery: Fri. Nov. 15 - Thu. Nov. 21 " so I will know the answer then. If it is the Egoman (red colored CN-only version) they are selling, and they sell more than a few, I would expect action from the two licensed vendors outside of China, to shut them down.

Actually, as it seems to be fairly small lots being offered from any one seller- we may be seeing the cat-and-mouse game being played out live right now. One ebay username will offer a few hundred, which sell out in a few days. By the time Ebay is ready to take action, all sales are concluded and the seller will promise not to do it again (or will simply disappear). The same person then repeats the deal under a different name- wash-rinse-repeat. This is just my speculation, of course...

User avatar
MattHawkinsUK
Posts: 538
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:48 pm
Location: UK
Contact: Website

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:02 pm

Why would anyone buy a Pi from random eBay sellers when it's now easy to buy one from a proper reseller? Why take the risk?
My Raspberry Pi blog and home of the BerryClip Add-on board : http://www.raspberrypi-spy.co.uk/
Follow me on Google+, Facebook, Pinterest and Twitter (@RPiSpy)

SnowLeopard
Posts: 106
Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2013 6:10 am

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:11 pm

If the license Farnell/Newark have from the Raspberry foundation stipulates the retail price, does it also stipulate bulk discounts?
The North American site for Newark/Element14 does not show any discounts for Raspberry Pis nor the camera module, and I was surprised to read in this thread that the UK Farnell site lists bulk discounts.

MikeDobson
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Nov 04, 2013 5:51 pm
Location: Mississippi, USA

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:14 pm

Thanks for replying so quickly!
jbeale wrote:Your first link "Item 141105208566 by eOurLife" has several contradictions (and checking the other two links, they seem identical in every respect). Near the bottom under "Package Contains" it says the auction is for two items (R-Pi and case) and it shows a tiny picture of a RED colored R-Pi (Made in China, not FCC/CE marked, and licensed for sale only in China). Below that, under "Package Includes" it claims a R-Pi "latest made in UK version". And at the top, and the very bottom under "Package Include" (sic) it also claims some heatsinks are included. The various photos show no less than three, quite different cases (top/bottom only + corner standoffs, a lasercut 6-sided case, and a 2-piece molded case).
Yeah. I had noticed some of those contradictions as well; but I missed those "small" images! I had to re-load the page a few times to get ALL the images, to see that 6-sided case you mention!

Also:

"Linux System Board For asterisk uElastix FreePBX" ...
I *think* those are VoIP software(s), from my skimming ?

"Raspberry Pi Model B (CN Ver.) x 1" ...
"CN Ver" ?! "China Version" ?

"Extra case x 1 (ONLY available during the promotion period)"
What's the "promotion period" ?

I think I'm going to try "ask a question" and see if I get any response; I'm guessing NOT, since they don't seem to have any trouble getting buyers, probably not worth the effort to answer pesky queries - hopefully, too busy packing & shipping!
jbeale wrote:All this for a list price of $30.99 which is not much below the selling price from the normal outlets (minus tax/shipping though). Seller claims 124 sold but I do not see any feedback from users having bought this particular item. What can I say... buyer beware. If you do go for it, let us know how it turns out!
That's another thing: I don't think there's any real way to "know" WHERE all those "sold" are going, but, from the list of date/prices, I doubt if any have "arrived" just yet, so I wouldn't expect any feedback so far.
jbeale wrote:EDIT: Actually I'm curious enough about this to risk $31 to find the answer myself. "ePacket delivery from China - Estimated delivery: Fri. Nov. 15 - Thu. Nov. 21 " so I will know the answer then. If it is the Egoman (red colored CN-only version) they are selling, and they sell more than a few, I would expect action from the two licensed vendors outside of China, to shut them down.
Well, good luck to you as well! Unfortunately, I don't have time enough on my coupon to wait! I was kind of hoping someone had perhaps heard about one of the other (earlier) "identical" offers, maybe verified delivery anyway.
jbeale wrote:Actually, as it seems to be fairly small lots being offered from any one seller- we may be seeing the cat-and-mouse game being played out live right now. One ebay username will offer a few hundred, which sell out in a few days. By the time Ebay is ready to take action, all sales are concluded and the seller will promise not to do it again (or will simply disappear). The same person then repeats the deal under a different name- wash-rinse-repeat. This is just my speculation, of course...
Are you "implying" that they may be (or may not) be selling the "right" one, and/or that they may not be delivering them AT ALL ? Seems like eBay would "catch on" to something like that ... ;)

Also, I've read bits & pieces about the "red" board, and how it's not "really" any different, except perhaps not manufactured to the same "standards" and not "licensed" for export ? I've read of folks who report no functional differences at all, as well as those who report problems with boards of ANY source.

Thank you again for reading! I'll reply again if I get any response from the sellers!
Last edited by MikeDobson on Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

MikeDobson
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Nov 04, 2013 5:51 pm
Location: Mississippi, USA

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:27 pm

MattHawkinsUK wrote:Why would anyone buy a Pi from random eBay sellers when it's now easy to buy one from a proper reseller? Why take the risk?
Just a matter of cash, Matt. That's all. The rPi may be "cheap" in relation to most anything else (for the capability), but "cheap" is also "relative" ...

As I mentioned earlier, I just happened to have a discount coupon for eBay (which expires in a couple of days); as broke as I am, I'd probably never get one anyway, otherwise, just for curiosity's sake ("projects" like this usually work out where I either have the time but no cash, or I'm working & I have no time). I can convince myself to justify parting w/another $11 for something interesting like this (since I already have most of the necessary "accessories") ...

I notice some eBay buyers apparently getting as many as a half-dozen at a time; beyond my financial capability at the moment.

So, who/what exactly is a "proper reseller" ? The others that I've seen (on eBay & elsewhere) lately, prices seem to range from $55-65 (very often more) with shipping & case.

Thanks for reading and replying!

glossywhite
Posts: 129
Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2013 8:05 pm

Re: Cheap model B's

Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:41 pm

Lol.

Define "cheap". They're not cheap - they're cheapER. I call "cheap" £15-20.

mikerr
Posts: 2783
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:46 pm
Location: UK
Contact: Website

Re: Cheap model B's

Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:30 am

glossywhite wrote:Define "cheap". They're not cheap - they're cheapER. I call "cheap" £15-20.
Well the first link I posted was £4 cheapER than the cheapest official supplier.

If you want really cheap, buy the model A + camera bundle: £31.37
http://cpc.farnell.com/raspberry-pi/ras ... dp/SC13212
then sell the camera for £20 on ebay...

Result: Pi Model A for £11 :mrgreen:

User avatar
RaTTuS
Posts: 10493
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:12 am
Location: North West UK

Re: Cheap model B's

Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:46 am

JFYI - my red one I imported from china [via taobao ] came with a case [not like the ones in the images]
How To ask Questions :- http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
WARNING - some parts of this post may be erroneous YMMV

1QC43qbL5FySu2Pi51vGqKqxy3UiJgukSX
Covfefe

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 23980
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Cheap model B's

Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:28 am

MikeDobson wrote:Also, I've read bits & pieces about the "red" board, and how it's not "really" any different, except perhaps not manufactured to the same "standards" and not "licensed" for export ? I've read of folks who report no functional differences at all, as well as those who report problems with boards of ANY source.
There is no functional difference between the UK and Chinese made boards. They should work exactly the same. If the factory in China is any good, then there should be no manufacturing issues either. Since they are selling lots, I imagine that the huge majority of them work fine.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

User avatar
jbeale
Posts: 3500
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2011 11:51 pm
Contact: Website

Re: Cheap model B's

Wed Dec 04, 2013 5:17 am

In case anyone is wondering if you really can get a cheaper Pi from ebay... at least in my case, the answer is no.

Seller 'eourlife' marked item as shipped, but it did not arrive within promised timeframe. Contacted seller with no response. Notified ebay and Seller immediately offered refund. Refund also was no-show. Finally, escalated with Ebay and they decided in my favor. The whole thing was a rather pointless exercise- somewhat as I had expected. On the positive side, ebay did refund me the full amount. At any rate if you want a pi, I recommend buying one from a real vendor.

Return to “For sale”