prankstare
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Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Wed Feb 25, 2015 10:28 pm

Hello! First I'd like to say that I have been waiting for a hardware upgrade before buying a Raspberry Pi and as such, now have a few basic questions about how the device works in terms of compatibility and how it performs under certain circumstances or software:

1 - I'm aware it is a ARM-based CPU but is it possible to install x86-64 operating systems such as Windows 7/10 or Linux? What would be the "ideal" OS to be used?

2 - Does it perform well as a NAS server + torrenting 24/7 on wired network? Asking because it only has 1GB of RAM. How about stability? Are there any advantages to buying a dedicated NAS instead?

3 - How much power does it draw normally?

Thanks!

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mikronauts
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Wed Feb 25, 2015 11:28 pm

1: NO

2: Ok on 100Mbps network
Slow for 1Gbps network (compared to 1Gbps capable NAS)

3: Depends on what is plugged into it, use 2A 5V power supply
prankstare wrote:Hello! First I'd like to say that I have been waiting for a hardware upgrade before buying a Raspberry Pi and as such, now have a few basic questions about how the device works in terms of compatibility and how it performs under certain circumstances or software:

1 - I'm aware it is a ARM-based CPU but is it possible to install x86-64 operating systems such as Windows 7/10 or Linux? What would be the "ideal" OS to be used?

2 - Does it perform well as a NAS server + torrenting 24/7 on wired network? Asking because it only has 1GB of RAM. How about stability? Are there any advantages to buying a dedicated NAS instead?

3 - How much power does it draw normally?

Thanks!
http://Mikronauts.com - home of EZasPi, RoboPi, Pi Rtc Dio and Pi Jumper @Mikronauts on Twitter
Advanced Robotics, I/O expansion and prototyping boards for the Raspberry Pi

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AndyD
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Wed Feb 25, 2015 11:59 pm

prankstare wrote:1 - I'm aware it is a ARM-based CPU but is it possible to install x86-64 operating systems such as Windows 7/10 or Linux? What would be the "ideal" OS to be used?
No, it is not possible to install an x86-64 operating system on the Raspberry Pi. Use Raspbian, it is a Debian/Linux targeted for the Raspberry Pi.

prankstare
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Thu Feb 26, 2015 2:52 am

Alright thanks! But what about NAS+torrenting? Is it possible to do both things at the same time? Can the hardware keep up? I intend to keep it running 24/7.

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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Thu Feb 26, 2015 4:45 am

prankstare wrote:Alright thanks! But what about NAS+torrenting? Is it possible to do both things at the same time? Can the hardware keep up? I intend to keep it running 24/7.
On a Pi2B, certainly. On a Pi1, probably.

prankstare
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Fri Feb 27, 2015 2:22 am

mikronauts wrote:2: Ok on 100Mbps network
Slow for 1Gbps network (compared to 1Gbps capable NAS)
I'm still kinda undecided about standard 100Mbit Vs. Gigabit network speeds. Like, do you guys think it's really necessary to go the extra mile and get a gigabit-capable NAS for like only 2 or 3 devices at home? I mean, it's only storage right? Not like internet connection or gaming or whatnot. Besides, streaming bluray content on standard LAN is more than enough. And I would have to buy a new router-switch in this case too. So for NAS purposes only, is gigabit really necessary?

I have another question regarding cluster computing with the Raspberry Pi: is it too difficult to set up like 2 RPi's together to work as a NAS server and thus enhance performance? Would that still be slow for gigabit network as you say? Would that solve the network speed problem? Cause even then it would be much cheaper solution for NAS.

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mikronauts
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Fri Feb 27, 2015 2:38 am

If and only if a 100Mbps network is sufficient for your needs, an RPi can make an ok server.

You can forget about streaming more than about 50Mbps worth, combined, and don't be surprised if there is buffering whenever a new stream is started, or resumed. (SMB on FAT, with Ethernet on the same USB host channel, is NOT an ideal situation for streaming, people reportedly get about 7MB/sec read speeds from an RPi server)

You CANNOT just add multiple 100Mbps Pi's to a network, and magically get much higher performance. Perhaps there is some clustered file serving software, that could distribute the load from multiple clients to different Pi's, but that brings the headache of multiple copies of the files on the different servers, and synchronizing them.

With all due respect, go and do some research on the following concepts:

- what a bottleneck is bottlenecks
- Ethernet overhead
- USB overhead
- USB 2.0 speed limit (480Mbps)
- SAMBA overhead
- FAT overhead
prankstare wrote:
mikronauts wrote:2: Ok on 100Mbps network
Slow for 1Gbps network (compared to 1Gbps capable NAS)
I'm still kinda undecided about standard 100Mbit Vs. Gigabit network speeds. Like, do you guys think it's really necessary to go the extra mile and get a gigabit-capable NAS for like only 2 or 3 devices at home? I mean, it's only storage right? Not like internet connection or gaming or whatnot. Besides, streaming bluray content on standard LAN is more than enough. And I would have to buy a new router-switch in this case too. So for NAS purposes only, is gigabit really necessary?

I have another question regarding cluster computing with the Raspberry Pi: is it too difficult to set up like 2 RPi's together to work as a NAS server and thus enhance performance? Would that still be slow for gigabit network as you say? Would that solve the network speed problem? Cause even then it would be much cheaper solution for NAS.
http://Mikronauts.com - home of EZasPi, RoboPi, Pi Rtc Dio and Pi Jumper @Mikronauts on Twitter
Advanced Robotics, I/O expansion and prototyping boards for the Raspberry Pi

prankstare
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Fri Feb 27, 2015 6:37 pm

mikronauts wrote:You can forget about streaming more than about 50Mbps worth, combined, and don't be surprised if there is buffering whenever a new stream is started, or resumed. (SMB on FAT, with Ethernet on the same USB host channel, is NOT an ideal situation for streaming, people reportedly get about 7MB/sec read speeds from an RPi server)

You CANNOT just add multiple 100Mbps Pi's to a network, and magically get much higher performance. Perhaps there is some clustered file serving software, that could distribute the load from multiple clients to different Pi's, but that brings the headache of multiple copies of the files on the different servers, and synchronizing them.
I'm aware about protocol overhead, but what I'm asking is why exactly an RPi doesn't make a good "gigabit" server. Would it be because of the USB ports or overall hardware performance? I also heard that if you attach a USB 2.0 gigabit ethernet adapter like this one (http://plugable.com/products/usb2-e1000) it could increase transfer speeds by double what the 10/100Mbit ethernet can even on the RPi itself. Can you confirm this?

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mikronauts
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Fri Feb 27, 2015 6:59 pm

prankstare wrote: I'm aware about protocol overhead, but what I'm asking is why exactly an RPi doesn't make a good "gigabit" server. Would it be because of the USB ports or overall hardware performance? I also heard that if you attach a USB 2.0 gigabit ethernet adapter like this one (http://plugable.com/products/usb2-e1000) it could increase transfer speeds by double what the 10/100Mbit ethernet can even on the RPi itself. Can you confirm this?
USB 2.0 480mbps total bandwidth, less overhead - so total usable bandwidth is <50Mbytes/sec, ie <400Mbps, to be shared between USB gigabit Ethernet adapter and USB hard drive.

Assuming perfectly fast hard drive without latency, assuming perfect file service software, ie everything unrealistic, best possible theoretical performance would be less than 25MB/sec ... it is literally impossible to even reach that.

So even in an impossible, unrealistic world, you could get no more than 200Mbps of file traffic

In the real world, it is likely that the real maximum is less than 20MB/sec, ie less than 160Mbps on the wire, which is still better than the theoretical maximum of about 11MB/sec with 100Mbit Ethernet.

480Mbps USB2 limit means it is IMPOSSIBLE to make anything but a poor gigabit server from an RPi.

(I do not consider a theoretical ceiling of 25MB/sec on a gigabit network theoretically capable of about 110MB/sec good)

My latest article is about the limits to how fast USB hard drive enclosures can work with a Raspberry Pi 2, you will see some real-world numbers in it that may help you understand.

http://www.mikronauts.com/raspberry-pi/ ... ter-tests/

The Pi 2 was designed to be a great little educational computer / inexpensive desktop / hobby computer.

The design decisions driven by the need to keep the cost low means that it cannot be a high-performance server.

That does not mean it cannot be an adequate small server for a small home network that does not expect high bandwidth server use - ie for documents, photos etc - where 100Mbps-200Mbps is sufficient.
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Advanced Robotics, I/O expansion and prototyping boards for the Raspberry Pi

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cherrypi27
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Sat Feb 28, 2015 6:26 am

There is a future promise of Windows 10 for late this year, but it will be Arm-based and not Intel-based code.

java
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Sat Feb 28, 2015 6:36 am

On my RPi model B, I run Sabzbd, and Deluge, for downloading files - RPi, has 2 attached 32Gig. memory sticks, it works very well, connected to a 2mbps ADSL line. I typically get a few 10-12 kbps slower downloads on my RPi, than I do on my i7 desktop rig, only time I get a performance hit, is when I copy completed downloads from the5 RPi to my desktop.

Edit:

I also run lighttpd on the RPi to server static pages, using a Blackberry 1amp charger as power source.

I will be ordering a RPi2 B with 2x 2amp power supplies, one of which will replace the Blackberry unit.

All in all, taking it's design parameters into consideration, I am very chuffed with what the little device does.

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mikronauts
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Sat Feb 28, 2015 3:58 pm

Exactly!

Within its limits, the Pi 2 can make a good server for those with modest bandwidth needs. I never said otherwise.

What the Pi 2 cannot do - regardless of unrealistic hopes - is make a good gig-e file server

In your case, I am guessing that your internet download speed is 100Mbps or lower, and as such, the Pi 2 can handle it fine The Pi 2's limitations do not come in to play.

I *REALLY* like my Pi 2's ... but just like I would expect a screw driver to work well as a hammer, I cannot expect Pi 2 to work well for tasks that require gig-e's bandwidth.

It does rather nicely on 100Mbps Ethernet though :)
java wrote:On my RPi model B, I run Sabzbd, and Deluge, for downloading files - RPi, has 2 attached 32Gig. memory sticks, it works very well, connected to a 2mbps ADSL line. I typically get a few 10-12 kbps slower downloads on my RPi, than I do on my i7 desktop rig, only time I get a performance hit, is when I copy completed downloads from the5 RPi to my desktop.

Edit:

I also run lighttpd on the RPi to server static pages, using a Blackberry 1amp charger as power source.

I will be ordering a RPi2 B with 2x 2amp power supplies, one of which will replace the Blackberry unit.

All in all, taking it's design parameters into consideration, I am very chuffed with what the little device does.
http://Mikronauts.com - home of EZasPi, RoboPi, Pi Rtc Dio and Pi Jumper @Mikronauts on Twitter
Advanced Robotics, I/O expansion and prototyping boards for the Raspberry Pi

user007
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Sat Feb 28, 2015 4:57 pm

prankstare wrote:Hello! First I'd like to say that I have been waiting for a hardware upgrade before buying a Raspberry Pi and as such, now have a few basic questions about how the device works in terms of compatibility and how it performs under certain circumstances or software:

1 - I'm aware it is a ARM-based CPU but is it possible to install x86-64 operating systems such as Windows 7/10 or Linux? What would be the "ideal" OS to be used?

2 - Does it perform well as a NAS server + torrenting 24/7 on wired network? Asking because it only has 1GB of RAM. How about stability? Are there any advantages to buying a dedicated NAS instead?

3 - How much power does it draw normally?

Thanks!
1. It works with different ARM versions of Linux: Raspbian, Fedora, Kali, Arch Linux, Lubuntu, OpenElec Media Center, etc. We need to wait for Windows 10 version for RPI2 to come later this year.
2. Google is your friend: just Google "torrent client raspberry pi" and you will find different solutions like this one http://geeks.noeit.com/use-your-raspber ... rrent-box/ :)
3. Power Supply 5V 1A 5W should be sufficient. It works for me with PS 5V 600mA 3W however it depends of the running applications and the devices connected.

prankstare
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Sat Feb 28, 2015 8:07 pm

java wrote:On my RPi model B, I run Sabzbd, and Deluge, for downloading files - RPi, has 2 attached 32Gig. memory sticks, it works very well, connected to a 2mbps ADSL line. I typically get a few 10-12 kbps slower downloads on my RPi, than I do on my i7 desktop rig, only time I get a performance hit, is when I copy completed downloads from the5 RPi to my desktop.
Well thanks for the statistics, that's what I wanted. But have you bother to check the actual transfer speeds you get by copying-moving files from the RPi to your desktop machine over standard LAN? Also, when you say you get 10-12Kbps slower performance on your Pi it kinda worries me because it's only from a 2Mbit ADSL connection? I have 30Mbit cable, so does that mean the performance hit will be even worse? Can you tell us the actual downloading numbers please? I hope the new RPi2 hardware solves those performance issues a little bit.

And so just to make it clear, it's not like I'm unrealistically expecting too much from the RPi2 in terms of performance anyway. It's just that I have never used one or seen actual performance figures working as a NAS Server. I'm running a little bit out of money right now and need a cheap yet good NAS solution and came across this D-Link DNS-320L, which has gigabit ethernet. But I still like the customization options and flexibility of the Raspberry Pi, just not so sure about performance yet.

user007
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:49 pm

prankstare wrote: I have 30Mbit cable, so does that mean the performance hit will be even worse?
I also have 30Mbps cable modem (Cisco) Internet connection and don't need any NAS server - the cable modem has USB port where I can attach any USB drive and the cable modem is acting as a NAS server. Easy and simple.

java
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Sun Mar 01, 2015 9:05 am

What you are asking for is difficult to provide, as I only have a single line. My main box is connected directly to the router, my RPi is connected to the same router via a 100mbps netgear switch, which could easily account for the noted download speeds. There are just too many variables involved to give a definative answer. If you are convinced that the advertised gigabit ability of the NAS device is accurate, and you have a neef for that speed. Then buy that device.

I accept that the minor speed discrepancy, is because I have chosen to save my downloads onto usb memory sticks, and not to a HDD.

The reason for this is mainly due to my resavations about the advertised ability of the 1 amp Blackberry charger I am currently running my RPi from.

Also it makes for a neat little setup, which appeals to me. Maximum speed of data transfer is of no consequence.

Because where I live 2 mbps ADSL is the normal basic service available, my news server is not terribly fast, the majority of the torrents I download will not downloaded any faster on a faster connection, due to lack of constant seeders, etc.

What the RPi gives me, is a cheap, energy efficient, reliable device that serves my needs adequately.

I can speed up disk reads/writes and network transfer speeds by "optimising" the device in various ways - a stock RPi operating on USB memory sticks works for me, whether it will do the same for you I cannot judge, for myself and family, the RPi works.

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mikronauts
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Re: Raspberry Pi 2 - A few basic questions

Tue Mar 03, 2015 5:05 pm

prankstare,

Here is a lot more RPi2 NAS performance statistics for you:

http://www.mikronauts.com/raspberry-pi/ ... ent-howto/

I'd started work on that article right after my USB hard drive tests, as many people were curious as to how the RPi2 would perform.

I knew that theory said it would not perform well, and that holds when compared to proper gigabit Ethernet implementations, but it does quite well on a 100Mbps Ethernet, and can still get a nice little boost from a USB Gigabit adapter. It just can't compete with real gigabit capable NAS though.
prankstare wrote:
java wrote:On my RPi model B, I run Sabzbd, and Deluge, for downloading files - RPi, has 2 attached 32Gig. memory sticks, it works very well, connected to a 2mbps ADSL line. I typically get a few 10-12 kbps slower downloads on my RPi, than I do on my i7 desktop rig, only time I get a performance hit, is when I copy completed downloads from the5 RPi to my desktop.
Well thanks for the statistics, that's what I wanted. But have you bother to check the actual transfer speeds you get by copying-moving files from the RPi to your desktop machine over standard LAN? Also, when you say you get 10-12Kbps slower performance on your Pi it kinda worries me because it's only from a 2Mbit ADSL connection? I have 30Mbit cable, so does that mean the performance hit will be even worse? Can you tell us the actual downloading numbers please? I hope the new RPi2 hardware solves those performance issues a little bit.

And so just to make it clear, it's not like I'm unrealistically expecting too much from the RPi2 in terms of performance anyway. It's just that I have never used one or seen actual performance figures working as a NAS Server. I'm running a little bit out of money right now and need a cheap yet good NAS solution and came across this D-Link DNS-320L, which has gigabit ethernet. But I still like the customization options and flexibility of the Raspberry Pi, just not so sure about performance yet.
http://Mikronauts.com - home of EZasPi, RoboPi, Pi Rtc Dio and Pi Jumper @Mikronauts on Twitter
Advanced Robotics, I/O expansion and prototyping boards for the Raspberry Pi

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