Parkle_Parkle
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:53 pm

Game Engine

Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:24 am

:mrgreen:
Hello everyone.

I am using Raspberry 3 B+

Now I'm thinking of creating a 3D game.
Developing models and scenes in Blender 2.78.

I don’t know which game engine to use.
The blender game engine is good, but it gets really hard for my Pi when I work with colors, materials and textures.

I really want to find an engine with which I can implement my ideas in the game and export to any device (Android, Linux, Windows). I was thinking of trying Godot after BlenderGE, but after the unsuccessful "apt-get install godot", I seriously wondered which engine to choose.
-------------------------------------------------------------
The engine of my dreams should be able to:
1. make complex sound constructions, maby sound synthes, support 3D sound, standard sampler manipulations (pitch, LFO, pan, transposit ...), sound effects and generally have powerful sound support.
2. The engine could make games for Android, Linux and Windows.
3. The engine can understand my 3D models from Blender. :D
4. And I can play with the physics and shading settings and make a beautiful picture.
5. And the main thing is that it works well on the Raspberry Pi 3B + :D
-------------------------------------------------------------
:?:
Now I think about Panda3d? or Uhro3D? or Pi3D? )))))))
maybe libraries will be needed and I don’t know which ones.
??????????????
Please tell me which engines and libraries are worth trying and comparing.
:?:

Moonmarch
Posts: 492
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:34 am

Re: Game Engine

Wed Jun 10, 2020 10:14 pm

I am under the impression the Raspberry Pi computer is not the best computer to build 3D games. I can imagine smaller projects will be more manageable on the RPI computer. Larger projects will involve longer rendering times or even freeze your computer. If you are using the RPI3 computer, then you are stuck with 1 GB of RAM. The RPI4 computer can be purchased with 8 GB of RAM, and the RPI4 has a faster CPU. Here are lists of programs you can use to create 2D, and 3D projects:

Best Painting Software for Linux
https://www.fossmint.com/best-painting- ... for-linux/

5 Open Source 3D Modelling & Rendering Apps For Linux
https://www.techdrivein.com/2011/08/5-o ... ering.html

I haven't used painting software or 3D modelling software in years. Paint software can be used to create 2D projects, and 3D modelling software can be used for creating 3D models. I don't have a list of 3D game engines you can use on the RPI computer. There are games that are completely open source, for example Doom 1993, Quake 1996, Return to Castle Wolfenstein 2001. You can consider building mods or practice map design using these open source game engines. These game engines are cross platform, not exclusive to Linux. There is a version of the Half Life GoldSrc engine, that can run on the RPI computer.

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leilei
Posts: 34
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2019 2:26 am

Re: Game Engine

Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:06 am

Have to chime in.... I'd suggest learning Godot at this point just for the fact it's not built on decades of legacy cruft.
Moonmarch wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 10:14 pm
There are games that are completely open source, for example Doom 1993, Quake 1996, Return to Castle Wolfenstein 2001. You can consider building mods or practice map design using these open source game engines.
For many idtech engines, there are very outdated, broken content pipelines and a high learning curve to run into old hard limitations (as well as strange upstream source port politics), and only the code portions are open source.
Moonmarch wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 10:14 pm
There is a version of the Half Life GoldSrc engine, that can run on the RPI computer.
This is based on the source leaks, dishonestly "GPL" and also the Half-Life SDK has strict usage rights to be only used with commercial versions of Half-Life. You cannot create a game with this without legal risks.

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Gavinmc42
Posts: 4547
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:31 am

Re: Game Engine

Thu Jun 11, 2020 2:15 am

5. And the main thing is that it works well on the Raspberry Pi 3B +
Nothing I have found can do this.
The 3B+ and OpenGL 2.1 is not bad but a bit limited, no fancy shaders.

The Pi4 with Vulkan should be a better for what you want, it is nearly working.
Most of the existing tools cannot use the OpenGLES 3.1 Compute Shaders.
2. The engine could make games for Android, Linux and Windows.
You are better off with a PC and Unreal if you want to make games for other platforms.
Unreal5 looks fantastic.

A Pi4 with 4GB or 8GB and Blender 2.79 works ok now.
I prefer Blender for Artists 1.0, it is a bit easier to use.
Default install Godot 3.0 does not work, 3.2 does.
I have some games that use Irrlicht, but that is a bit dated and does not use the new shader features.
4. And I can play with the physics and shading settings and make a beautiful picture.
Best to get a Pi4 and wait for Vulkan.
Or get a PC and Unreal 4 and start now.
1. make complex sound constructions, maby sound synthes, support 3D sound, standard sampler manipulations (pitch, LFO, pan, transposit ...), sound effects and generally have powerful sound support.
Sound of PI's is simple stereo, you will need an audio hat for fancy 5.1 sound.
3. The engine can understand my 3D models from Blender.
viewtopic.php?f=68&t=214695&hilit=star+citizen
I'm dancing on Rainbows.
Raspberries are not Apples or Oranges

Parkle_Parkle
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:53 pm

Re: Game Engine

Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:14 am

:mrgreen:
Hi
Today I watched a lot of different game engines. But not one was able to "apt-get install" through the terminal :lol:

I really want to study Godot, but I think to wait for official support as promised in the next version of Godot4.

Perhaps the right option for me is to continue to use the "Blender Game Engine". Raspberry 3B+ is my only computer now. It might be right to learn OpenGL and OpenAL. Maybe Quake or Morrowind(OpenMW) game engine, will be useful... Now I make models and scenes in Blender 2.78 and draw some textures in GIMP 2.8

I know a little Java and Python, if anyone can tell interesting libraries)))
--------------------
I have harsh conditions))) I need to make a logical spatial 3D game on RPi, where there is no violence. A bit like Q.U.B.E. but more interesting physics and geometry. A Blender can do almost everything I need except for sound effects and sound generations, I was thinking of trying to solve it with Python scripts.
--------------------
But I want to know about all the alternative implementation options so that the game works better.
;)
I would like the game engine to have an interactive interface, otherwise I will spend a lot of time on the code, which is certainly good))) but very long. Therefore, it will probably be right to continue to make content for the game and study OpenGL and OpenAL.
;)
There were even more engines than on this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_game_engines
maybe I'm wrong, but replacing the Blender Engine, I could not find

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Gavinmc42
Posts: 4547
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:31 am

Re: Game Engine

Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:28 am

This is interesting, uses kha and haxe
https://armory3d.org/

Kha works on Pi's
https://github.com/armory3d/iron

Plenty of OpenGL stuff works, interfaces with most languages.
I generally test stuff with Python first and started here
https://github.com/Blakkis/GLSL_Python

The mesa demos are good C simple examples
https://github.com/freedesktop/mesa-demos.
You will find the OpenGL Redbook examples etc here.

If you have the latest Raspberry Pi OS then the Code the Basics source and book are available and easy to install.
I'm dancing on Rainbows.
Raspberries are not Apples or Oranges

Parkle_Parkle
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:53 pm

Re: Game Engine

Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:34 am

I prefer Blender for Artists 1.0, it is a bit easier to use.
I have some games that use Irrlicht, but that is a bit dated and does not use the new shader features.
___________
I think about this! Thanks

Parkle_Parkle
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:53 pm

Re: Game Engine

Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:43 am

Gavinmc42 wrote:
Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:28 am
This is interesting, uses kha and haxe
https://armory3d.org/

Kha works on Pi's
https://github.com/armory3d/iron

Plenty of OpenGL stuff works, interfaces with most languages.
I generally test stuff with Python first and started here
https://github.com/Blakkis/GLSL_Python

The mesa demos are good C simple examples
https://github.com/freedesktop/mesa-demos.
You will find the OpenGL Redbook examples etc here.

If you have the latest Raspberry Pi OS then the Code the Basics source and book are available and easy to install.
Thanks, stuff looks like good, I think about it :!:

Parkle_Parkle
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:53 pm

Re: Game Engine

Thu Jun 11, 2020 7:43 pm

leilei wrote:
Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:06 am
This is based on the source leaks, dishonestly "GPL" and also the Half-Life SDK has strict usage rights to be only used with commercial versions of Half-Life. You cannot create a game with this without legal risks.
thanks for this warning)

Moonmarch
Posts: 492
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:34 am

Re: Game Engine

Thu Jun 11, 2020 9:58 pm

Actually there is truth to what leilei said about learning curves with old graphic engines. Quake does not have many user made mods available for download on the Mod database (ModDB) website. This usually means there are not a large number of people building projects for the Quake engine. The same with Return to Castle Wolfenstein, I do not see many mods for the game. This can be disappointing news for the people who are fans of these ID Software games. Not enough user made content for a game engine, means the game is difficult to program. The Half-Life engine has numerous user made mods being released every month. I would actually recommend the Half-Life engine (GoldSrc) for full 3D game engine development.

The problem with building games using the GoldSrc engine. I don't know which program you would use on the Raspberry Pi computer to build mods. The GoldSrc engine uses the Hammer Editor program. You would need to find a cross platform program that is similar to the Hammer Editor to build mods for the GoldSrc engine. Yes, Xash3D is based on leaked source code, the graphic engine still runs on the RPI computer. To use Xash3D, you would need a retail copy of Half-Life. Even though a game engine runs on the RPI computer, does not mean the map editor can be used on the RPI computer. I suppose you are stuck with the Godot Engine or the Blender program for now. Downloading, and installing map editor programs on the RPI computer seems complicated.

Parkle_Parkle
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:53 pm

Re: Game Engine

Fri Jun 12, 2020 2:01 am

Moonmarch wrote:
Thu Jun 11, 2020 9:58 pm
__________________________
:mrgreen:
---------------------------------------
At the moment, I liked the idea of ​​trying Armory3D. A blender is a great program, but I’m thinking of trying an alternative and comparing them. Now I think it’s to try easier. To Check what may "PyGame" with 3D and the ".obj" file.
I think this is an occasion to try "Сpython" or "Jpython".
This may not be a good idea, but I would like experimenting.
I liked what "Panda3D" is capable of, I memorized this project.

I'm afraid of the old engines to be honest)))

The Blender game engine sometimes crashes the operating system. Each time I think with how to make the project easier, but the more complex the project, the more unpredictable the behavior. Because of this, time is wasted. If I can take a photo of this moment I will post for a joke in this topic)))
I think this is a problem because of OpenGL and 1gb ram)))
But I really love my raspberry and my treat this as a trial)))

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Gavinmc42
Posts: 4547
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:31 am

Re: Game Engine

Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:36 am

I started with Pygame years ago.
Pi3D now has a Rust version.

I nearly got Vulkan working, which means it is very close.
Godot 4 is nearly here too, it is Vulkan capable.

But Pi4 and min 4GB is need to compile this stuff yourself.
I use my Pi4 as a desktop so it is very usable, the extra memory is very important.

The Pi4 2GB is not bad for the price now.
Probably ok for running any games.
Developing games means editing, coding, compiling and 4GB helps.

The Pi3 and the OpenGLES VC4 hardware is in the middle ground between Android and PC.
Not that many examples and many are old.
You are basically looking for code more than 8 years old.
I'm dancing on Rainbows.
Raspberries are not Apples or Oranges

Moonmarch
Posts: 492
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:34 am

Re: Game Engine

Sat Jun 13, 2020 12:07 am

Panda3d, Armory3d, Godot, if you have access to the source code to the software. You will be able to compile the programs from the source to run on the RPI computer. That is assuming you know how to compile software on Linux. A program that is open source is not guaranteed to compile successfully on a ARM computer. Compiling software to run on the RPI computer is all about trial, and error. At least that is the system that I use. I searched around the internet for graphic engines, more specifically map editors. The only map editor I found in the Debian repository is the Eureka Doom map editor. Here is a link to the Eureka Doom editor website:

Eureka DOOM Editor
http://eureka-editor.sourceforge.net/

Here is a map editor program for the Quake engine, this program is called TrenchBroom. Here is a link to the TrenchBroom GitHub website:

kduske/TrenchBroom
https://github.com/kduske/TrenchBroom/

The SLADE3 Doom Map editor is intended for Doom engine source ports. You can use SLADE3 to build maps for the Doom source port, GZDoom. The GZDoom is a modern, more advanced version of the original Doom engine that uses both software, and OpenGL rendering. Here is a link to the SLADE3 website:

SLADE Wiki - Ubuntu Step by Step Compilation
http://slade.mancubus.net/index.php?pag ... ompilation

Parkle_Parkle
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:53 pm

Re: Game Engine

Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:46 pm

Moonmarch wrote:
Sat Jun 13, 2020 12:07 am

Thanks)

Parkle_Parkle
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:53 pm

Re: Game Engine

Fri Jun 26, 2020 4:31 pm

:mrgreen:

Hi everyone)

I found a panda3D in the pip repository
https://pypi.org/project/Panda3D/
https://pypi.org/search/?q=panda3D

I updated the OS(Stretch-->Buster) incorrectly and lost all my data :lol: :lol: :lol:

Now I have a clean buster:
Blender 2.79
GIMP 2.10

I study python more and pygame
I will try to install a Panda3D later
I can’t install Armory3D, the Blender refuses and writes an error. I tried to install old versions of Armory3D that worked on Blender 2.79, but that failed.
I think it's possible to find something useful in the pip repository. If the pip is not enough then perhaps Anaconda will help.

When I can see and manage 3D objects(.obj) using python without Blender, I will try to install a Panda3D.
But if the Panda does not work, probably I will have to look for libraries with physics and other features for managing 3D objects. This story turned out to be longer than I thought :lol:

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