no picture with latest image


16 posts
by fcapri » Fri May 19, 2017 8:12 am
I accidentally formatted the wrong SD card and lost my working raspbian image. so i decided to download the latest version so i also can use it with my raspberry zero W.
after trying several hours and downloading different images, i cannot get the latest version working.
downloaded version: both 2017-04-10-raspbian-jessie and lite version.
using 4GB (lite only) and 16GB micro SD card: not working
tryed w32disk imager and etcher: not working

i see the power led red working, and the green one blinking at random. i don't get any images, not even the rainbow thing. tryed several monitors, changed the config.txt file (force hotplug, hdmiboost, hdmigroup...).
if i put the card in my older rpi1 its working fine. tryed different power adapter, still nothing on the rpi3.

after i tryed the noobs installer, same problem. it works on the rpi1, not on the rpi3 .
then i looked for and older image on my hard drive and found the 2016-09-23-raspbian-jessie. i've put this one on my sd card and its working like a charm.

what is wrong with the 2017april image? or what am i doing wrong using this image?
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by pcmanbob » Fri May 19, 2017 10:35 am
Hi.

So I have a copy of 2017-04-10-raspbian-jessie-lie which I down loaded some time last week for my latest project on a pi 2. and it works fine.

So I have just set up a spare SD to test it in my Pi3. and again it works fine.
just for clarity, this is what I did and is how I normally do it.
unzip image using 7-zip > use win 32 disk imager to put image on SD card > at windows command line use "echo.>K:\ssh" to make ssh activation file on SD card > eject SD card from card reader.
put SD card in Pi3 and boot > boots OK > use raspi-config to change user password > reboot > working fine.
SD card is 4gb

It seems strange that the image will work in an older pi and an old image will work on your Pi3.
with all you have tried you seem to have eliminated all possibilities, what happens if you do a apt-get update and apt-get dist-upgrade on your older image ?
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by fcapri » Fri May 19, 2017 1:16 pm
the older image was also a rpi3 image.
i recently bought a raspberry zero rpi but i don't have the small HDMI adapter. my idea was to prepare the 8GB sd card in my RPI3 with the latest image and enable the wifi.
after i just put the sd card in the zero and can access it with ssh.

the problem: i put the 8GB card in my windows pc (older card with working image on it from my rpi3), i downloaded the new image from april17, unzipped it and put it on the SD card with W32diskimager.
after i put the card in my rpi3 and have no picture. i do see the activity led blinking, so the image is working. i just don't have image.
i put the card back in my computer and edited the config.txt file in the boot partition to force HDMI. again no image.
i changed some other settings in config.txt wich al resulted in a black screen (i don't have a message with "no signal", there is just a black screen).
i downloaded the image again, same problem.

next test: i put my 16GB with working OS in my RPI3 and boot it up. everything working fine. so hardware is OK. i put the 16GB in my computer to verify the config.txt settings of this working card. everything looks default.

step3: i formatted my SD card in computer and put the noobs network install V2.4 on it. BIG problem, i have 16GB free space (i expected 8GB). I just formatted the wrong SD card :x
oh wel, i put the SD card in the RPI3, again no image. i took my rpi1, put the 16GB SD card with noobs install in this one, and everything is working.
this new downloaded image doesn't work on my rpi3, i does work on an older rpi. also the newly noobs installer V2.4 doesn't work in my rpi3

here i already know something is wrong with the 2017 image. i took my external drive and found an raspbian image from september 2016. I unzipped it, put it on my 8GB sd card with W32diskimager and after i put it in my rpi3.
everything worked fine from the first try. i performed an apt-get update and apt-get upgrade. took a while but all worked fine. i configured the wlan and put the sd card in my rpi zero.
everything is working now.

after i opened this topic askind wat is wrong with the new image as my rpi doesn't have any picture on my screen. i tried 2 differend screens (philips 19" and philips 22")
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by pcmanbob » Fri May 19, 2017 6:19 pm
So I have now connected screen keyboard and mouse to my Pi3.

using jessie lite SD card I used before Pi boots to command line as expected and works OK so image on web site must be good

download jessie with pixel , not something I normally use, used same process as before but with 32gb SD card boots to desktop as expected , changed hostname and user password , reboots still OK so again image from web site must be good.

so the problem must be at your end of the process, bad download, bad SD card, incorrect SD card write process, hardware fault, wrong image download or written. may be something else I just don't know without actually being there to see how and why it fails but its not the images on the web site.

and a final note , if the web site images were bad in some way then with the 100's or 1000's of downloads that people make everyday, there would have been many many people on here complaining that the images were no good and I have not seen that.

Edit. just to clarify this is the 32gb SD card I used, and my multi card reader/writer all though mounted in my desktop pc it connects to an internal usb port
Image
Last edited by pcmanbob on Fri May 19, 2017 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by fruitoftheloom » Fri May 19, 2017 6:32 pm
fcapri wrote:the older image was also a rpi3 image.


The Raspbian Jessie Full and Lite .IMG latest version are for all RPi models...

...providing you are using an .IMG dated newer than the release of a specific model the neccessary boot files will be included.
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by FTrevorGowen » Fri May 19, 2017 6:39 pm
@fcapri, What "hardware" are you using to write the uSDHC card - a built-in card slot in your Windows PC (not all card slots are fully uSDHC compatible and some cards are more sensitive to this**) or an external, USB-stick like card reader/writer (they're usually more reliable). If the latter, what happens if you use your working Pi to write the latest image rather than Windows tools?****
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** I've recently come across (and ordered a sample of) a Kingston that's explicitly stated to need a true uSDHC card reader/writer (When I get it I'll log my findings in my webpages eventually)
**** something like I did here:
http://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi ... lPi3B.html
Usually running Raspbian Jessie on up to 13 Pi's (an A, B1, 2xB2, 2xB+, A+, P2B, 3xP0, P3B, P0W). See: https://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi/raspiidx.htm
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by fcapri » Fri May 19, 2017 8:42 pm
just an external SD card reader/writer. a big thing with a usb cable on it, not a little usb stick.
what could the sd card reader change on the sd card, that makes it booting on a raspberry but doesn't give the image on the screen? while that same card works perfectly on an older rpi?
i used the same usb device to write my september2016 image on the same SD card (8GB and 16GB cards) and these also work without problems?

i forgot the rpi3 at work, so can not test this weekend, i'll try downloading a fresh image and re-imaging the SD card next week with another computer and another SD-USB tool
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by FTrevorGowen » Sat May 20, 2017 11:54 am
fcapri wrote:just an external SD card reader/writer. a big thing with a usb cable on it, not a little usb stick.
what could the sd card reader change on the sd card, that makes it booting on a raspberry but doesn't give the image on the screen? while that same card works perfectly on an older rpi?
i used the same usb device to write my september2016 image on the same SD card (8GB and 16GB cards) and these also work without problems?
i forgot the rpi3 at work, so can not test this weekend, i'll try downloading a fresh image and re-imaging the SD card next week with another computer and another SD-USB tool

O.K. How old is it? Are any of these similar?: http://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi ... aders.html
(I mainly use ones supplied by an SDHC card manufacturer)
What make, type of uSDHC cards? (Again, just in case I have a similar sample, these are the ones I've used: http://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi ... cards.html )
Your issue is "rare and unusual" in that partial booting appears to be taking place (normally a "poorly written" card fails to boot or eventually becomes "read only"). Finally, on which Pi do you boot first? You have mentioned a P1 (which version?), P0 (likewise?) and the "problem" P3.
Trev.
Usually running Raspbian Jessie on up to 13 Pi's (an A, B1, 2xB2, 2xB+, A+, P2B, 3xP0, P3B, P0W). See: https://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi/raspiidx.htm
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by fcapri » Sat May 20, 2017 3:02 pm
i wanted to make a pi zero dashcam recorder, so i bought a pi zero W. then i noticed i don't have the smaller HDMI connector, so my plan was to prepare the whole image on a rpi3 and then swap the SD card to my zero.
i'm running my website on an old raspberry. for testing purposes i have a clone of this server on another old rpi. this is the 'old one' i used to test the image on. don't know which model this is. i think a model B (512MB ram, 700MHz, 2x usb port)
Image

1) I wrote the 2017 image with my win32disk imager with my sd card reader i already used for 5years. this didn't work on the rpi3. there was booting activity but just a black screen.
2) I changed soms screen settings in config.txt but never got any further (rpi3)
3) I tested my rpi hardware by using my old 16GB sd card with working image= worked fine (rpi 3 with 16GB SD card and raspbian image sep 2016)
4) i wrote the noobs network installer 2.4 on my SD card and plugged it in, same activity, no image on the screen (rpi3 4GB card)
5) I put this noobs SD card in my rpi1 and worked fine.
6) I verified the settings of the config.txt of the 16GB card i my computer. all the same as on my newly sd card
7) I formatted the WRONG sd card in my computer and had an empty 16GB SD card :roll: . I now used this one to test the raspbian 2017 lite and raspbian 2017 image again: unsuccesfull (rpi3)
8) I put the september2016 image from my backup disk on the SD card (raspbian lite on 4GB card) and this one worked out of the box.
SAME SD card, SAME computer, SAME SD card reader, SAME raspberry.
somewhere around step 6 or 7 I also used "etcher" to write the images to my SD cards, same result.

the cards used: 16GB micro SD card with a raspberry logo on it, deliverd with my rpi3. 8GB HC micro SD card (don't know wich one, i just saw i only have my 4GB card with me now)
all of the cards had working images of raspbian on them (4GB-8GB-16GB), but the older image from end 2016 and noobs 2.1 I think. none of them work with a new image (raspbian april2017 and noobs 2.4). written the same way as i always do for the last 3-4 years.
i don't know the manufacterer of the SD card reader as the housing died several years ago. i just use the naked PCB
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by FTrevorGowen » Sat May 20, 2017 5:17 pm
Thanks for the clarifications. From the 'photo and your reference to "512Mb" your "old Pi" appears to be a Pi 1 B2 (w/o the USB polyfuses - I too have one of those). Hopefully you're not attempting to power the P3B in the same way! Given the apparent age of the card reader/writer and that it's now uncased, I suspect that when it's writing to a much newer uSDHC card (in a uSDHC-->SDHC adapter?) something is happening when the P3B is reading and switches from the SoC's very basic, relatively slow, "raw", fat16/32 format only, bootloader to one which, on the P3B, maybe is "too fast" or using a "less well supported" method for those older cards. SD card capabilities, on-board "ware-leveling" controls etc. have changed significantly since the "first Pi". You haven't mentioned (unless I've missed the info.) how you're powering the various Pi's during "testing" - power supplies that were O.K. for a B1/B2/A will not be "good enough" for a P3B (but probably O.K. for a zero).
Trev.
Usually running Raspbian Jessie on up to 13 Pi's (an A, B1, 2xB2, 2xB+, A+, P2B, 3xP0, P3B, P0W). See: https://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi/raspiidx.htm
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by fcapri » Sat May 20, 2017 6:35 pm
i always use a 5.0V 2.0A power supply.
before i always powered it from a usb cable on my computer, but the RPI3 always shows a lightning logo blinking on the upper right corner of the screen
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by FTrevorGowen » Sat May 20, 2017 6:51 pm
fcapri wrote:i always use a 5.0V 2.0A power supply.
before i always powered it from a usb cable on my computer, but the RPI3 always shows a lightning logo blinking on the upper right corner of the screen

That's one of the "low-voltage" warning indicators (introduced with the B+), the other is a flashing red PoWeR led. The recommended, and current "official" PSU for a P3B (and all other Pi's) is rated at 5.0V 2.5A (esp. if you intend to use any "power-hungry" USB devices - 1200mA is available, shared between the four USB ports). A "good" 5.0V 2.0A supply (similar to the original, B+/P2B timeframe, "official one"** which I still use) should be O.K. but, unless it also has a good quality uUSB lead (which the "official" one did), may still give problems during high transient currents, some of which may occur during the initial boot cycle (eg. WiFi powering up).
Trev.
** FWIW, some static "loading" measurements are here:
http://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi ... _Models.29
Usually running Raspbian Jessie on up to 13 Pi's (an A, B1, 2xB2, 2xB+, A+, P2B, 3xP0, P3B, P0W). See: https://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi/raspiidx.htm
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by fruitoftheloom » Sun May 21, 2017 10:57 am
fcapri wrote:i always use a 5.0V 2.0A power supply.
before i always powered it from a usb cable on my computer, but the RPI3 always shows a lightning logo blinking on the upper right corner of the screen



https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentati ... g-icons.md

https://www.raspberrypi.org/help/faqs/#powerReqs
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by fcapri » Wed May 24, 2017 9:16 am
today another test.

16GB SD card from raspberry itself, april 2017 jessie image, my old NC6220 HP laptop (i always used before form imaging SD cards), my older external HMC sd card writer (I used at home before).

put the image on, inserted it in my rpi3, i can see activity, but nothing on the screen.
I inserted it in my rpi zero and this one works fine, it boots into the GUI.
if I disconnect the HDMI cable on my rpi3 and connect a screen with composite input, I do see image on the screen. the card and the images have been written correctly, the rpi is booting fine, just not with hdmi

so something strange is going on. EVERY SD card I use (4GB-8GB-16GB) with the older image from 2016 on it works everytime. it doesn't matter which PC I use or which SD card writer. al these images work on my rpi1 as my rpi3 and rpi zero.
the newer 2017 images doesn't work on my rpi3, no matter what SD card I use. this image does work on my rpi1 and rpi zero W.

last week i updated and upgrades my 2016 image on my rpi3, configured wlan and then inserted the SD in my rpi zero. everything worked fine.
if I insert this SD card in my rpi3 today, i don't get any image anymore. so it seems like soms update is disabling my HDMI output

what changed in the new image, that makes my rpi3 lose his hdmi connection? first I tought it would be a hardware fault in my rpi, but this would not explain why i always works with older images?
just verified the test again, i put the 2016image on the same SD card again, on the same way with the same computer and TADA, I have image...
confirmed, something has changed in the image and this change is not compatible with my rpi3
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by pcmanbob » Wed May 24, 2017 12:06 pm
How strange.

did some more testing.

pi3 same image as before full jessie with pixel, 2A psu

old pc monitor with HDMI to DVI cable . works perfectly.

TV Toshiba 21" switched to HDMI input before powering pi HDMI to HDMI Cable . works perfectly

So there must be something about the cable or your monitor that is resulting in no HDMI output.

have you tried forcing HDMI on using

hdmi_force_hotplug=1

in /boot/ config.txt
Last edited by pcmanbob on Wed May 24, 2017 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by FTrevorGowen » Wed May 24, 2017 3:28 pm
fcapri wrote:...
put the image on, inserted it in my rpi3, i can see activity, but nothing on the screen.
I inserted it in my rpi zero and this one works fine, it boots into the GUI.
if I disconnect the HDMI cable on my rpi3 and connect a screen with composite input, I do see image on the screen. the card and the images have been written correctly, the rpi is booting fine, just not with hdmi
...

If a Pi does not detect the presence of a HDMI connection, or detects one, but insufficient/incorrect/unsupported EDID info. is "reported back" from the monitor/screen/TV's internal EEPROM it will "fall back" to composite mode. Whilst the most common cause is a broken or poor HDMI connection it could be just "too slow" for the Pi3 cf. the Pi Zero. (W.r.t. what the timing constraints actually are, and whether they have changed, IJDK but you could be experiencing a variation of the issue in this thread: https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/view ... 8&t=178447)
Trev.
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