OSIAS
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2014 2:40 pm

Small Rant / Feature Request

Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:30 pm

So I have been meaning to post this for quite some I wanted to gather all my thoughts on this and place it here for replies. I would have done it sooner but you know life.

Rant on

When I heard about the Pi2 Hitting I was ******. They made this sticky at the top of the forum about how they were not coming out with anything new for quite some time so don't worry about it. So I have 6 Pi's, 4 in a stack and 2 stand alone at my house and I have another 4 at my parents house all stand alones. I only invested in this 4 months ago tops now. I am running berry boot with raspbian, XMBC & RetroPie all on one image and quickly deploy-able. I have got all sorts of hosting, cross platform communication, data storage & streaming etc throughout the houses all setup, spent quite some time getting all the features working as intended and bug free. I just locked it all down about month ago. You can even see my historical posts in here asking for help as I went along. Lets not even talk referrals I just had two friends but two each just last month.

Then Oh BTW we didn't preview anything or notify or I dunno perhaps change our posts or you know perhaps generally be honest with our customers, we said nope not gonna don't worry about it. Oh Wait BOOM here is the new PI. All for what? a revenue stream that wouldn't dry up for last 5-6 months while everyone waits for the new deal. I just don't get it, is it really about the money?

About the money, well I guess I got about 650 bucks into it when its all said and done, that's for me not a god awful amount but its still 600 bones I would wait to spend till the new model hit. Heck I waited this long to make sure all the software I needed was out there developed and stable. That now lets ultimately be honest I am going to go out and upgrade all of them, still going to wait a little longer for all the transition issues to be resolved. So that's gonna be a chunk of change.

Why do I mention it this way, well because the pi is only $35, that's freaking amazing !!! So in the big scheme of things that ain't crap. So why cry, its only a couple bones. Well because lets be honest who just owns one of these things? They are like Doritos's do you really open the bag and only eat 1 chip and close it up and set it down. No you are going to refer and buy more for different tasks and give them out as gifts etc. Thus 650 bucks later.

Now I want to be clear I am not unhappy that they came out with a new product, I am GLAD they have a new and improved, I am just unhappy about them not being a little more honest about there business practices, as so many companies seem to do these days. It just stinks imho /rant off.


Feature Requests


The Above has been I guess is highly negative so I am attempting to keep this section more positive. I was also attempting to be sarcastic and funny to an extent to. Heck I said I was gonna buy even more I think I can speak my peace. So lets go onto feature requests and perhaps someone can explain to me why these are already just not included. ( There is probably a reason I just don't understand why you wouldn't include it and figure out how to solve any issues that arrive form it ) So I guess the only way they will get implemented is if people ask for it and this is why I am posting it.

The Pi is so close to being a PC replacement on so many levels as long as its not attempting to do high end gaming graphics it can handle it, however sometimes slowly depending on the task. With just a little more umpfh it would be a major competitor in so many categories. Just think about all the daily activities that we conduct with electronics that don't need a beefy machine to get the job done. The energy reductions along make it amazing again compared to the alternatives. With the newer model its that much closer to a true contender however I think two items are holding this back and it really all comes down to Data, its Storage & Transfer of said.

USB 3.0 & or Sata / E-Sata

USB 3 This has been the standard for quite some time now and speed of information transfer is king. Yes you can buy a bigger Micro SD card say 64gb. But that's really not going to do it when a average quality move is 5gb's. Its like today standard Solid State Drives, they only need to be big enough to house the operating system and offload all your data to a external standard HD. So even say 10gb Micro SD card is all you really need.

Which means you need to be able to connect something else to the device that houses all your data and makes it quickly accessible and usb 2.0 is not fast. Moving 5gb's across my network from external HD to external HD with pi's take a couple hours, when in comparison other devices with the same externals can do it in 20 mins.

So lets just say a Sata port is out of the question, why not USB 3 at least then? This one really baffles me. But moving onto Sata. So why not include a dedicated HD port. Doesn't have to give the unit a bois or anything or even make it live at start keep the micro SD and structure the way it is. Just let OS's get drivers to power it for use after there up and running. Okay so maybe power is a concern so Sata is out because that takes power from the Pi. Why Not E-Sata and make the drive provide its own power source. Ding Ding Ding Winner Winner Chicken Dinner.

I get they are trying to keep the power consumption low and unit costs low. Again I am extremely impressed with what they have done, really I am. I just don't understand why you would not do the above. If its worth doing its worth doing right ( at least in my book ). If its attempting to keep costs down then have a few different models it still wouldn't make the price go up to much.

Maybe I am just a grouch of the IT World I could go on how ISP's need to provide more upstream bandwidth. Either way these have been the thoughts and rants My family, Friends & Myself have been having over the past couple weeks and I was like I should post this rant up.

Cheers

Heater
Posts: 13275
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 3:02 pm

Re: Small Rant / Feature Request

Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:42 pm

This has all been discussed a dozen times over. Do browse back through the threads of the last week.

Keep in mind that the Pi was never intended to be a PC replacement, it was intended to be a gateway to computer and software education for children. It was intended to be so cheap that it was no big deal if it got trashed in the process of that education.

Ergo it does not have USB 3 and SATA. There are plenty of other little ARM boards in the market that do have those things if you really need them.

BMS Doug
Posts: 3824
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Location: London, UK

Re: Small Rant / Feature Request

Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:52 pm

Hi,

A number of other people have made similar complaints, you aren't alone in that.

I am of the opinion that the comments that were made were made in good faith, The Foundation truly did not expect to be able to release the Pi2 anywhere near this soon.

This is what I have been able to piece together:
When the B+ was released it was designed to be ready for the new processor that Broadcom were just starting to work on, a quad core version of the existing pi chip. This pre design meant that the foundation would be ready to quickly roll out the pi2 when the chip was released.


I am told that when developing a complex new chip you can expect to spend a lot of time looking at what went wrong with the last prototype, designing a solution and creating a new prototype, this can take a long time sometimes several years.

The new processor for the Pi2 worked first time, no redesign was needed so years of expected development suddenly dropped to nothing, the chip was ready, the board was ready add chip to board and test.


When you add the Osbourne effect you account for the lack of pre-announcement from when the chip was ready to the release date.
(It is likely that RS and Farnell would dislike any announcement that resulted in them having large amounts of stock left over, this probably had an influence of some kind, possibly contractual).
Doug.
Building Management Systems Engineer.

Ravenous
Posts: 1956
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 1:01 pm
Location: UK

Re: Small Rant / Feature Request

Tue Feb 10, 2015 5:02 pm

OSIAS wrote:So lets go onto feature requests and perhaps someone can explain to me why these are already just not included. ( There is probably a reason I just don't understand why you wouldn't include it and figure out how to solve any issues that arrive form it )
Cost. (Short answer to a very long post!)

Adding just a few pounds/dollars/euros to the cost is likely to reduce the number of kids who buy it. Grownups like us with money are not in the target market, sadly :)

Even making the board slightly bigger to accommodate extra chips adds to the PCB cost, which is why the board is so small physically. This is the sort of detail that was discussed in detail when the first models came out.

EtonMess
Posts: 51
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:32 pm

Re: Small Rant / Feature Request

Tue Feb 10, 2015 5:05 pm

I wonder if everybody realises that the main aim of Raspberry Pi Foundation is education, and that it is a charity.
It's not about the money, it's about the cause.
So the way I see it, it is something I support (rather than be a customer of) and a movement that I can be part of.
Most of the other charities that I give money too don't actually give anything tangible in return.

The actual purchase of inexpensive little computer boards as commodities is almost secondary.

There are those with a different perspective, particularly those that use a Pi because it brings computing within reach. But most of those posting here are not those.
.G6FIR

gkreidl
Posts: 6090
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2012 1:07 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Small Rant / Feature Request

Tue Feb 10, 2015 5:16 pm

OSIAS wrote:So lets go onto feature requests and perhaps someone can explain to me why these are already just not included. ( There is probably a reason I just don't understand why you wouldn't include it and figure out how to solve any issues that arrive form it )
[/quote]

No, you really don't understand, but that's your own fault, because this has been discussed many times. The features you request would need a completely different SOC and that would mean to throw away all investments into software for the current SOC, give up compatibility with older models and so on. And there are not so many SOCs available which are cheap enough to keep the price at 35$.
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jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
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Re: Small Rant / Feature Request

Tue Feb 10, 2015 5:18 pm

Since every single point of the OP has actually been addressed either in the follow ups or elsewhere on here, I'm going to lock the thread. No point in going over old ground.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
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