gkreidl
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 9:11 am

prices on aliexpress range from 49 to 65$.
http://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?Sea ... 0420072100
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rmwebs
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:04 pm

Good luck to them. We need more Pi-style boards IMO. Whilst I hope they are 'original' clones that add extra functionality should be welcomed with open arms as long as they do it correctly.

I understand that there may be some (extremely minor) trademark issue with the Banana Pi, but the extra features they're adding are pretty decent:

- IR Receiver
- 1GB Ram
- Gigabit Ethernet
- SATA Port
- Option for DC or Micro USB Power
- USB OTG port


The extra RAM, gigabit ethernet and SATA port are a decent upgrade IMO.

The Hummingboard (if it ever launches) also has some nice upgrades - eSata, Gigabit Ethernet, 2GB RAM, etc. Hopefully we'll start seeing some decent options appear soon :)
Last edited by rmwebs on Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:08 pm

"Now, You real can do your daily works on it."

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MattHawkinsUK
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:17 pm

I think the fact their site is full of broken links says a lot about their quality control!
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gkreidl
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:22 pm

They're trying to hijack this community, e. g. by claiming that you can run Raspbian images on it (which is nonsense) in some of the offers. What about firmware, drivers, GPU supported media players, support etc.? I've not seen a single OS for download.
The hardware may look interesting, but who will get it to work? NOOBs? Children? Experienced hackers may be able to install Ubuntu or Debian on it, but it will require some work and experience. And will there be any support for the GPU then?
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GTR2Fan
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:25 pm

I would get one to play with myself, but then I'd feel as though I was betraying the Pi community and all that the foundation stands for. :oops:
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rmwebs
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:37 pm

GTR2Fan wrote:I would get one to play with myself, but then I'd feel as though I was betraying the Pi community and all that the foundation stands for. :oops:
Pretty sure that the community (should) stand for openness and education. Feel free to get one to educate the rest of us :P

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 3:01 pm

rmwebs wrote:
GTR2Fan wrote:I would get one to play with myself, but then I'd feel as though I was betraying the Pi community and all that the foundation stands for. :oops:
Pretty sure that the community (should) stand for openness and education. Feel free to get one to educate the rest of us :P
Quite. Although this product doesn't plough any money back in to education.

It's just rather galling when they are simply riding on the back of someone else's efforts with little or no acknowledgement. Still, there's no camera etc, so you get what you pay for.
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 3:52 pm

This thing reminds me a lot of the Hackberry board. Stats and price are about the same. Short summary of my opinion: I don't see why we're even discussing this. If you want something like this, buy the Hackberry.

I have one (a Hackberry) and its a reasonably good board, but pretty much unsupported. Most of the posts on their support board are at least a year old. I suspect that the HB support will end up looking good by comparison with the Banana (if it and/or support for it turns out to exist at all).

What makes the Pi special is the fact there actually is a real organization with real support behind it. Just as if it actually was a real product (not some shareware joke). As far as I can tell, all the bother boards are basically jokes in terms of software support - that is, there is no centralized organization, it's all left to the users to help each other. Which is great, of course, when it works.

Not so good when it doesn't…
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 3:54 pm

This seems a better website http://www.lemaker.org
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:18 pm

http://www.raspberrypaul.co.uk

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:31 pm

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:56 pm

It's a pity these Chinese have tried to copy the Pi board layout and name since spec wise it's quite a respectable piece of kit.
Sure the Mali400 GPU isn't going to blow goats vs the mighty VC4 but the CPU is much better than the Pi and that's what really counts.
But better processing power comes at a price and from what I can tell the BPI is a lot more demanding on power than the Raspberry Pi.

I for one won't be buying this board I would rather waste my money on a quad core Rockchip Android TV Box with Linux support or another Pi.

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 7:59 pm

I bought some electronics from dx.com few times (China) and that Banana Pi website is typical Chinese case - you can get the product from one of their international stores but don't expect cool documentation, tutorials and whatnot. It's up to the community outside China to make it live (like pcDuino).

As for performance comparison that may differ a lot. The CPU is faster, the RAM is faster and it's 1 GB, you have SATA so in general I/O operations should be very fast. I've tested few A10 (older, single core) boards (pcDuino, Cubieboard v1) in the past and in some phoronix benchmarks like phpbench or pybench Pi was 2-or-more times slower, but at other like dcraw - quite close. Mali400MP2 is dual core GPU unit. It's hard to compare it to VC4. It can run Android and Android apps and most of the non-demanding games. Raspberry Pi SoC is to old for Android. On classical X.org Linux Mali400 isn't cool and it's hard to get 3D acceleration etc. Like the Cubieboard v1 was quite nice on Android but classical Linux desktop wasn't much better than Pi in terms of responsiveness. Even quad or octa-core Samsung Exynos board may have super high performance and PC-alike desktop behaviour but if you go into graphics - Mali will fail. Drivers were written for Android, and more Linux GPU-demanding apps were written on x86 with Intel/AMD/nVidia graphics and X.org APIs (that's why things like minnowboard max will quite likely allow you to play OpenArena, Xonotic, UrbanTerror, Nexuiz etc.). Wayland may change something as it can use Android drivers, but those games and alike apps must take advantage of the new APIs (full screen apps like games don't actually use the display server AFAIK).

If I would want a Python scriptable board with GPIO stronger than Pi I would probably took PcDuino v2 (also A20). HummingBoard is interesting as it's going into quad core, no Mali but also "Android GPU" may hit it. It all depend what you want to do with them. It may be hard to make them a typical low power desktop PC, at bit more demanding server (database, dynamic website) load they will fail on RAM and partially computing power (or also I/O). They are best as media players, some as Android media "centres", but most of the fun is with hacking - hardware and electronics. For that you need docs, libraries and someone to port third party libraries if needed :D

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:21 pm

And at some point the Foundation will have to decide what is their new operation model. There are and there will be clones. Arduino likes them and wants them. That's why you can buy a Chinese version at a fraction of the cost or pick among many different boards that are Arduino platform compatible (like boards with networking built in, micro-boards and so on). The Arduino doesn't get money from clones, but clones make Arduino as a platform even more spread and available to more people.

Would it be ok for you if someone would do a Kickstarter for a Pi clone (100% clone) at like half or less price just to spread the Pi as a platform and idea (while Foundation would not have anything to do with it)? :)

This indiegogo campaign is quite interesting. Arduino Leonardo clone starting kit at a low price. They had to limit perks count due to... limited amount of microcontrollers on the global market. Insane amount of board went into the world.

If all Raspberry-clones will be ~100% API compatible then I'm all for it - you write once, run anywhere your GPIO using code (:mrgreen: JAVA slogan). If the Foundation would make some sort of software/API standard then more clones could be made, and bigger/better the platform would get. There is a lot of cheap and/or powerful (for its size) ARM hardware that can be used and to innovate. For me single board solution gets boring or annoying after some time (you are still facing the same problems, you see yet again power supply, powered HUB, SD card, under-powered-GPIO fixer project...).

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 9:12 pm

There is unlikely to be a "100% clone" of the Pi because of the foundations cozy relationship with broadcom.

gkreidl
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 9:32 pm

This gas become a typical hardware freak discussion. What made the RPi a large success are the concepts and ideas behind it (the foundation) and the group of people from the outside who supported it with their own work (e. g. the Raspbian development). If any company will really produce a clone, they'll only do it for the money. They won't spend it for education or software development, as the foundation has done. So why should we buy such a clone?
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:03 pm

"So why should we buy such a clone?"

The reason for purchasing is because the Pi does not do what people expect it do, as shown by every single post by people who want all the features which the Pi does not offer ie the whingers and whiners who still want to pay $35 for a $70 product

Personally I am glad that these products are offered, this will mean only people who can except the Pi is what it is will be part of the " community" and go forward and develop a bright future for helping the RPF achieve its goals and aims.........
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:16 am

riklaunim wrote:And at some point the Foundation will have to decide what is their new operation model. There are and there will be clones. Arduino likes them and wants them. That's why you can buy a Chinese version at a fraction of the cost or pick among many different boards that are Arduino platform compatible (like boards with networking built in, micro-boards and so on). The Arduino doesn't get money from clones, but clones make Arduino as a platform even more spread and available to more people.

Would it be ok for you if someone would do a Kickstarter for a Pi clone (100% clone) at like half or less price just to spread the Pi as a platform and idea (while Foundation would not have anything to do with it)? :)

This indiegogo campaign is quite interesting. Arduino Leonardo clone starting kit at a low price. They had to limit perks count due to... limited amount of microcontrollers on the global market. Insane amount of board went into the world.

If all Raspberry-clones will be ~100% API compatible then I'm all for it - you write once, run anywhere your GPIO using code (:mrgreen: JAVA slogan). If the Foundation would make some sort of software/API standard then more clones could be made, and bigger/better the platform would get. There is a lot of cheap and/or powerful (for its size) ARM hardware that can be used and to innovate. For me single board solution gets boring or annoying after some time (you are still facing the same problems, you see yet again power supply, powered HUB, SD card, under-powered-GPIO fixer project...).
A Pi at half the price is impossible. You can't even buy the parts for that. And anyone making a PI will need a lot of money up front. I also doubt a kickstarter would ever make any money, due to the very low margins on the Pi already.

As for API's the Raspi already uses standard API's - OpenGLES, OPenVG, EGL OpenMAX.
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:09 am

It doesn't look as interesting as the Pi. I still like the Pi, but it would be nice if the Pi's processor & RAM was removable, so that you could change it to a more powerful one. Still, the BananaPi would be a useful tool for gamers.
I'm happy to help.
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:06 am

mrpi64 wrote: it would be nice if the Pi's processor & RAM was removable
That idea has been flogged to death, Broadcom do not make a compatible SoC, there are other products which fill that niche !!

Not relevent to the BananaPi either......
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:15 am

mrpi64 wrote:It doesn't look as interesting as the Pi. I still like the Pi, but it would be nice if the Pi's processor & RAM was removable, so that you could change it to a more powerful one. Still, the BananaPi would be a useful tool for gamers.
There is no such thing as a removable SoC of this type. The sockets you CAN get for BGA are about £1000 each. But since all SoC use different pinouts, that wouldn't work anyway.
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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:47 pm

I don't see (nor think we need) any clones coming in at a lower price point than the Pi. I would however love to see some coming in at a higher price point offering 'extras' not offered on the pi. There would likely be a market for that, obviously outside the foundation's primary educational focus, hence why it'd be good for a clone/similar project to take that on.

It works well (and is very much accepted with open arms) for Arduino, so there's no reason it couldn't work well for the Pi (and I'm not suggesting the Pi and Arduino are alike here, just staring it as a comparison from a commercial development point of view).

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:57 pm

Raspberry Paul wrote:Only $76 delivered to uk :shock:
http://www.dhgate.com/product/new-banan ... 1701169613
Notice how the RCA video output jack is mounted crooked.
Is this poor build quality?

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Re: Banana pi, 1ghz duel core clone.

Wed Apr 23, 2014 1:10 pm

I followed this link and it's offered there as:
'Wholesale - New Banana PI Same as Raspberry Pi 1GB DDR3'
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