nick_theboatman
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 2:55 pm

Re: Raspberry pi-esqe. The new breed of computers

Fri May 25, 2012 2:57 pm

I just sent this mail to VIA:

I think that you missed the point on 3 counts:

1 Raspberry Pi is a training platform built by a charity (ie non-profit-making); so are
you going to make APCs on a non-profit-making basis?
Didn’t think so....

2 Raspberry Pi was developed to promote coding, not to be a net-book on the cheap.

3 Raspberry Pi has bit-wide IO with buffered ports (ie not USB) making the Raspberry
Pi the only modern day machine I’ve seen (apart from the Arduino) that can do real
embedded computing. So are you going to do this as well?
Didn’t think so either....

I think that there is something a little insidious about a commercial corporation trying
to make a product that seeks to usurp something that is for training purposes, and to
be doing so for a profit (in comparison with the training platform which is being built
on a not-for-profit basis). Unless you are going to really do like-for-like, why cant you
just "leave alone". There are clearly no limits to the extent that capitalism will go
to score a fast buck at someone elses' expense...

By the way, this is a complaint....

Rek
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:16 pm

Re: Raspberry pi-esqe. The new breed of computers

Fri May 25, 2012 3:52 pm

I definately see a use for this. One thing the Pi won't be good for is DRM protected content, not being able to use Hulu+ and Netflix certainly limits the Pi's usefulness as a media streaming device. The VIA APC will work fine for that and free up my Pi for other uses. And cost should be darn close considering it comes with a power supply and the sd card is optional. Not a replacement for me, I want both. Now.

Narishma
Posts: 151
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 1:29 pm

Re: Raspberry pi-esqe. The new breed of computers

Fri May 25, 2012 11:47 pm

nick_theboatman wrote:I just sent this mail to VIA:

I think that you missed the point on 3 counts:

1 Raspberry Pi is a training platform built by a charity (ie non-profit-making); so are
you going to make APCs on a non-profit-making basis?
Didn’t think so....

2 Raspberry Pi was developed to promote coding, not to be a net-book on the cheap.

3 Raspberry Pi has bit-wide IO with buffered ports (ie not USB) making the Raspberry
Pi the only modern day machine I’ve seen (apart from the Arduino) that can do real
embedded computing. So are you going to do this as well?
Didn’t think so either....

I think that there is something a little insidious about a commercial corporation trying
to make a product that seeks to usurp something that is for training purposes, and to
be doing so for a profit (in comparison with the training platform which is being built
on a not-for-profit basis). Unless you are going to really do like-for-like, why cant you
just "leave alone". There are clearly no limits to the extent that capitalism will go
to score a fast buck at someone elses' expense...

By the way, this is a complaint....
I'm not sure why you felt the need to send that to VIA. They aren't trying to compete with the Raspberry Pi as far as I know, it's just the media that's jumping on that as usual. Going by the website they put in place, they're targeting Internet-based media consumption rather than creation like the Pi.

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Lob0426
Posts: 2198
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 4:30 pm
Location: Susanville CA.
Contact: Website

Re: Raspberry pi-esqe. The new breed of computers

Sat May 26, 2012 12:09 am

hippy wrote:
Lob0426 wrote:You are going to need a pretty hefty PSU if it starts out at 13.5 watts for the board alone. If it does have 6 USB that is a potential draw of 3 amps plus the 13.5 watts at another 1.2 amps or so. I would guess you would want at least a 2.5 amp PSU for normal use.
But such supplies are pretty common in mini-ITX and similar worlds. I have a Belkin powered hub that has a switch mode 5V 4A (20W) wallwart.

10W and upwards supplies are pretty easy to come by for routers, laptops and the like which is why some regretted the R-Pi having on-board regulation replaced by a micro-USB input which could never support the SoC, LAN, plus two 500mA USB devices directly connected.
I agree with you Hippy. I like the Alpha board a lot better. That is water under the bridge now. I asked in a post if the Alpha could be produced. I never go a definitive answer as whether it could or could not. I bet no one ever asked Broadcom if it could be, as the Alpha was funded by Broadcom from my understanding. It would be nice if someone put the question to Eben, then we should get an answer either way.

As to the power issue I think you can do most of what you want to do with the VIA with a 3 to 3.5 amp PSU. Most USB devices do not eat 500ma anyway. I am surprised at the number that draw more than the 140ma. The RasPi foundation should have the poly fuses bumped up some in future models.

Overall the VIA is at the right price point and really only needs a distribution of Linux to be a great rather than a good deal.
512MB version 2.0 as WordPress Server
Motorola Lapdock with Pi2B
Modded Rev 1.0 with pin headers at USB

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AndrewS
Posts: 3625
Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2012 4:50 pm
Location: Cambridge, UK
Contact: Website

Re: Raspberry pi-esqe. The new breed of computers

Sat May 26, 2012 12:12 am

Narishma wrote:I'm not sure why you felt the need to send that to VIA. They aren't trying to compete with the Raspberry Pi as far as I know, it's just the media that's jumping on that as usual. Going by the website they put in place, they're targeting Internet-based media consumption rather than creation like the Pi.
I agree, it looks to me like a net-top that just happens to have a similar price and similar CPU to the Raspberry Pi. Journalists like jumping to conclusions that aren't always correct - why let the truth get in the way of a good headline? :roll: I guess it's similar to the way that every touch-screen phone used to be referred to by the media as a "iPhone rip-off". Nobody even knows for sure yet if it'll be possible for this APC device to run anything other than an old version of Android - depends how tightly locked down the BIOS is. *shrug*

obarthelemy
Posts: 1407
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2011 10:53 pm

Re: Raspberry pi-esqe. The new breed of computers

Sat May 26, 2012 7:46 am

nick_theboatman wrote:I just sent this mail to VIA:

I think that you missed the point on 3 counts:

1 Raspberry Pi is a training platform built by a charity (ie non-profit-making); so are
you going to make APCs on a non-profit-making basis?
Didn’t think so....

2 Raspberry Pi was developed to promote coding, not to be a net-book on the cheap.

3 Raspberry Pi has bit-wide IO with buffered ports (ie not USB) making the Raspberry
Pi the only modern day machine I’ve seen (apart from the Arduino) that can do real
embedded computing. So are you going to do this as well?
Didn’t think so either....

I think that there is something a little insidious about a commercial corporation trying
to make a product that seeks to usurp something that is for training purposes, and to
be doing so for a profit (in comparison with the training platform which is being built
on a not-for-profit basis). Unless you are going to really do like-for-like, why cant you
just "leave alone". There are clearly no limits to the extent that capitalism will go
to score a fast buck at someone elses' expense...

By the way, this is a complaint....
If think this a bit off the mark.

1- whether the supplier makes a profit or not is irrelevant. What counts is the value proposition to the end user. Following your reasoning, a $100 Pi would be OK if the supplier were not making any profit, but a $30 Pi where the seller makes profit wouldn't be. Profit is OK, it's actually what makes the economy run.

2- A lot of people *are* trying to make uses of the Pi outside of its original "teach kids to program" goal. 99.9% of customers right now, I'd guess. Plus I have a feeling the APC would be about as competent as the Pi at the "teach dev" stuff, with the right distro.

3- Are they even pretending to do that ? Mentioning it anywhere ? Does it matter to most people, except those who know to check for it ?

your final rant seems to argue that because Pi released a PC below $50, nobody is allowed to anymore ? Even if the thing has VGA out, some storage onboard, a case, and a PSU, a different OS, mounting holes, and a standard form factor, all of which the PI doesn't offer ?

I'm all for people getting invested in the Pi, but this is over the top. The Foundation has stated several times that they welcome competition, even copycats (which the APC isn't quite), maybe even clones (which the APC certainly isn't). It actually furthers the foundation's goals.

I don't see the need, nor justification, to hate on VIA for the APC.

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