tobyayre
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:38 am
Location: Manila, Philippines

RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:49 am

I have 4 RPi4/4GB... I have done a fresh install of the NOOBs distro, and only run update & upgrade. No overclocking, no extra software, nothing. Plain vanilla install.

Every minute or so my pi will freeze for about 5 seconds (the only thing that seems to work is moving the mouse, clicking will not work, scrolling Chrome will not work, typing will not work). Then after 5+ seconds it will just continue as if nothing happened. So, OK, somehow I damaged a Pi, I will switch to a different one (I have 4 anyway), same thing, every minute or so, hang, then resume... with clean installs. Only common elements are power supply, monitor, mouse, and keyboard... but those haven't changed since it worked great. Did actually try a different power supply, but same thing.

A month ago, everything was fine, and I don't remember exactly when it started. But I do know that I am not a newbie (I have done this stuff for 40+ years) and this one is about to bring me to tears. One day it just started.

Does anyone have a brilliant suggestion of what is possibly wrong that is causing this to happen?

Thank you in advance

User avatar
Botspot
Posts: 1232
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 9:47 pm
Location: Texas
Contact: Website

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:45 pm

Strange. Does this occur regardless of what you're running on the Pi4? On your taskbar (panel) add "resource monitors". Ensure it shows you both the RAM usage and the CPU usage.
See if the freezing happens only when the RAM is maxed out, or if it happens when the CPU is maxed out.

You may also want to flash Raspbian directly to your SD card instead of using buggy NOOBS.
This is a good tutorial showing how to use the balenaEtcher program.
Want to make your own Raspbian image?
  • Hard way: Mess with confusing terminal commands.
  • Easy way: Let Pi-Power-Tools do it all for you!
Boot your image in a VM, Flash from the Internet at top speed, Mount (to drop files in), Edit partitions, Shrink/Expand, Repair, and more. Enjoy! :)
https://github.com/Botspot/Pi-Power-Tools

User avatar
TheMindVirus
Posts: 164
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2019 12:38 am
Location: Cornwall, UK

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:10 pm

Odd question, what's the manufacturer of your monitor?
Some manufacturers with non-standard HDMI ports / EDIDs are causing problems for the Pi Engineers.
Could it be that your display is freezing for 5 seconds and not actually the Pi? Could you try another monitor or TV?
I could be wrong, it could be heat related but it would show the icon.
Alastair Cota
Embedded Firmware Developer
[ERR]: Sense of Humour Failure

drgeoff
Posts: 10620
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:39 pm

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:23 pm

Botspot wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:45 pm
.. buggy NOOBS.
@Botspot

What evidence do you have that NOOBS is buggy? If none, cease and desist.

Buggy or not, it is very unlikely that NOOBS is responsible for the OP's issue. When an OS is running, NOOBS is not.

User avatar
Botspot
Posts: 1232
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 9:47 pm
Location: Texas
Contact: Website

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:46 pm

TheMindVirus wrote:
Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:10 pm
Odd question, what's the manufacturer of your monitor?
Could you try another monitor or TV?
Yes, the monitor could be the issue, and it would explain why the rest of us don't have the issue. But I have doubts about it since the OP has stated that during a freeze, the mouse pointer can still move.
Want to make your own Raspbian image?
  • Hard way: Mess with confusing terminal commands.
  • Easy way: Let Pi-Power-Tools do it all for you!
Boot your image in a VM, Flash from the Internet at top speed, Mount (to drop files in), Edit partitions, Shrink/Expand, Repair, and more. Enjoy! :)
https://github.com/Botspot/Pi-Power-Tools

User avatar
davidcoton
Posts: 4872
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 2:37 pm
Location: Cambridge, UK
Contact: Website

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:56 pm

@tobyayre,

EDIT: On remembering more of the earlier incident, your Pi symptoms do not match. Please disregard the following suggestion.

You don't by any chance live near an airport with a high power radar? Years ago, I had to diagnose a similar problem on a BBC Computer. It misbehaved for the customer, but worked perfectly on the test bench. Turned out the radar froze the computer every time the beam swept over their location. IIRC an earthed metal screen on the wall solved the problem.
Last edited by davidcoton on Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Signature retired

User avatar
PeterO
Posts: 5820
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 4:14 pm

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:01 pm

When it freezes, is the green LED turned on ?
PeterO
Discoverer of the PI2 XENON DEATH FLASH!
Interests: C,Python,PIC,Electronics,Ham Radio (G0DZB),1960s British Computers.
"The primary requirement (as we've always seen in your examples) is that the code is readable. " Dougie Lawson

User avatar
Botspot
Posts: 1232
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 9:47 pm
Location: Texas
Contact: Website

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:07 pm

Oh, why didn't I think of this before? :o Heavy disk usage tends to freeze the desktop with the exact same symptoms the OP describes. This morning while copying a bunch of data, my desktop froze for short periods several times. Latest Buster on Pi 4.

I think the OP's issue is caused by a slow or bottlenecked SD card. Tobyayre, please reply with the make and model of your SD card.

Edit: added underlined portion
Last edited by Botspot on Mon Mar 02, 2020 6:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Want to make your own Raspbian image?
  • Hard way: Mess with confusing terminal commands.
  • Easy way: Let Pi-Power-Tools do it all for you!
Boot your image in a VM, Flash from the Internet at top speed, Mount (to drop files in), Edit partitions, Shrink/Expand, Repair, and more. Enjoy! :)
https://github.com/Botspot/Pi-Power-Tools

Technocolour
Posts: 119
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2019 6:23 pm

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 02, 2020 5:38 pm

@OP Ignore the below, unless you like random unrelated tales.

I still, unironically, like the "high powered radar", tilt. No matter what the true error cause may be.

It reminds me of a case were cellphones stopped working in hospitals. The reason? The MEMS clock had helium, leaked from the MRI machines, change the resonance frequency of it by getting stuck in the silicon crystal matrix. (They self healed after leaving them be for a while, too)

*Edit should be helium ofc*
Last edited by Technocolour on Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
TheMindVirus
Posts: 164
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2019 12:38 am
Location: Cornwall, UK

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:56 am

The radar suggestion may not be that far off.
When WiFi networks get flooded with data it sometimes leads the PC to think there is a stable internet connection when it isn’t.
Applications which depend on it may hang waiting for a response.
Two main things to check:
1. Does it work with the network adapter turned off?
2.1. Can you check certain files like /etc/resolv.conf, /etc/hosts, /etc/hostname to check for correctness?

I remember now my original Pi1 had a sudo problem when trying to resolve the hostname every time you used it. It used to almost brick the Pi but the mouse would still move.
Alastair Cota
Embedded Firmware Developer
[ERR]: Sense of Humour Failure

haaldemir
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 2:46 pm
Location: Istanbul, Turkey

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:02 am

Same problem i have . A green led shows arround 5 sec freeze no mouse no click allow. I have 2 raspberryi pi 4 one is connected Waveshare screen another one Asus monitor both have this issue on rasbian. Fresh instal same problem again. Not ribreelec and one is also Gentoo dont have this issue

User avatar
Botspot
Posts: 1232
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 9:47 pm
Location: Texas
Contact: Website

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Tue Mar 03, 2020 1:56 pm

haaldemir wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:02 am
Same problem i have . A green led shows around 5 sec freeze no mouse no click allow. I have 2 raspberry pi 4 one is connected Waveshare screen another one Asus monitor both have this issue on Raspbian.
As mentioned above, I have this issue sometimes too. Usually happens while doing something IO-intensive, but not always.
Want to make your own Raspbian image?
  • Hard way: Mess with confusing terminal commands.
  • Easy way: Let Pi-Power-Tools do it all for you!
Boot your image in a VM, Flash from the Internet at top speed, Mount (to drop files in), Edit partitions, Shrink/Expand, Repair, and more. Enjoy! :)
https://github.com/Botspot/Pi-Power-Tools

haaldemir
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 2:46 pm
Location: Istanbul, Turkey

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Wed Mar 04, 2020 3:02 pm

Botspot wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 1:56 pm
haaldemir wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:02 am
Same problem i have . A green led shows around 5 sec freeze no mouse no click allow. I have 2 raspberry pi 4 one is connected Waveshare screen another one Asus monitor both have this issue on Raspbian.
As mentioned above, I have this issue sometimes too. Usually happens while doing something IO-intensive, but not always.
Yes not always sometime, thanks for information.

User avatar
TheMindVirus
Posts: 164
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2019 12:38 am
Location: Cornwall, UK

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:24 am

There is a new tool available for testing whether your SD card will perform well or not, called "agnostics".
https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/sd-card-speed-test/

If your SD card is the problem, it is likely that it will FAIL sequential write/read tests.
The tool will generate a file called "rpdiags.txt" which looks something like this:

Code: Select all

Raspberry Pi Diagnostics - version 0.1
Mon Feb 24 09:44:16 2020

Test : SD Card Speed Test
Run 1
prepare-file;0;0;12161;23
seq-write;0;0;4151;8
rand-4k-write;0;0;3046;761
rand-4k-read;9242;2310;0;0
Sequential write speed 4151 kb/s (target 10000) - FAIL
Note that sequential write speed declines over time as a card is used - your card may require reformatting
Random write speed 761 IOPS (target 500) - PASS
Random read speed 2310 IOPS (target 1500) - PASS
Run 2
prepare-file;0;0;8526;16
...
Alastair Cota
Embedded Firmware Developer
[ERR]: Sense of Humour Failure

tobyayre
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:38 am
Location: Manila, Philippines

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Thu Mar 05, 2020 4:23 am

OK, OP here. I am SO sorry. Right after I posted the question, I got sent away to two days of meetings with no internet access...

Trying to answer everything in one message:

Monitor is Samsung, but... it is the same monitor in the same configuration I have been using for months with my Pi, before this ever started, and I am using a HDMI to VGA converter to connect to the monitor.

I am not terribly near an airport, but on a similar but unrelated topic, I have had radiology department machines in hospitals reek havoc with all type of computers and motors in the past causing really weird stuff (I am old, so lots and lots of years for strange experiences). Have also seen microwave dishes cause strange computer glitches when near a railroad.

Also, not using wifi... wired directly to my router via ethernet cable.

The SD Card is a good guess... before answering I have tested the card using the agnostics code as suggested by the last poster, and ding ding ding we have a winner... the card that before worked just fine, fails the test. Sequential write speed declines over time. FWIW, it is a 32GB 2 week old Samsung EVO Plus MicroSD card, replacing an old one that I suspected was the problem because it was old. When it didn't get better with the new card, I ticked it off the list as tried and not the issue. I will go buy a replacement, and post in a day or so, but I am giving this the best chance to be correct. Thank you to whomever wrote the agnostics code, and to TheMindVirus for suggesting it.

Back in a few days with the results (everything is harder and takes longer in Manila).

tobyayre
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:38 am
Location: Manila, Philippines

Re: RPi4/4GB Freezes Frequently PLEASE help...

Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:38 pm

To finish out this topic:

The new SanDisk Extreme Pro Card works flawlessly.

I am going to assume at this point that:

1) The first SanDisk card that I had and replaced was really just beginning to fail.

2) The replacement Samsung card that I used was bad from the box (with a similar type of failure).

No more freezes with the new card in place.

Thank you everyone for the help and suggestions. The agnostics app goes into my toolbox now as essential Raspberry Pi kit for all installations.

Cheers!

Return to “General discussion”