MDC
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Thu Jul 28, 2011 9:58 pm

What would happen if you connected a load of rasberry pi's together, what could you do with them then?

I was thinking of a kind of super Rasberry pi

amiga65
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Thu Jul 28, 2011 11:33 pm

hehe I was just thinking the same thing. I'm going to have to build a cluster with these. Probably look like a porcupine.

Richard
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 8:25 am

Super computer made from $25 boards :)

Maybe this opens up the world of could computing for small communities...

weirdeidolon
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 4:21 pm

this is exactly what i plan on doing with it

TreacleWelding
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 4:39 pm

I'm thinking along these lines, but I need to understand some things first.

If I purchase say 10 model A's would there be any way to get them all to work with the same USB hub? If yes to the hub question, would there be a way to get them to share a single network connection?

Hmmm, basically I want to come up with a design that allows me to effectively use them as a cluster of servers, but I'm thinking at the moment I would really need

7 x Model B Computers @ $35 each = $245
7 x Short network cables @ $0.75 each = $5.25
1 x 10/100 Network Switch @ $20 each = $20
1 x KVM switch 7+ port @ $600 each (ouch!) = $600
7 x KVM cables @ $40 each (ouch!) = $280

Total cost $1150.25

Plus whatever it is I need to provide the power...

So that's not a good design, the KVM takes up 77% of the cost

Any better ideas how to achieve what's needed?

amiga65
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:03 pm

Quote from TreacleWelding on July 29, 2011, 17:39
I'm thinking along these lines, but I need to understand some things first.

If I purchase say 10 model A's would there be any way to get them all to work with the same USB hub? If yes to the hub question, would there be a way to get them to share a single network connection?

Hmmm, basically I want to come up with a design that allows me to effectively use them as a cluster of servers, but I'm thinking at the moment I would really need

7 x Model B Computers @ $35 each = $245
7 x Short network cables @ $0.75 each = $5.25
1 x 10/100 Network Switch @ $20 each = $20
1 x KVM switch 7+ port @ $600 each (ouch!) = $600
7 x KVM cables @ $40 each (ouch!) = $280

Total cost $1150.25

Plus whatever it is I need to provide the power...

So that's not a good design, the KVM takes up 77% of the cost

Any better ideas how to achieve what's needed?

I'm by no means an expert on clusters or even linux. That being said, You shouldn't need a kvm switch. You should be able to monitor the nodes from the server through a proggie like vnc. As for using a usb hub to network them I'll leave that question for Someone Who does in fact know what There talking about curious about that Myself now. :)

marked
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:11 pm

What exactly are you trying to accomplish?

1 master model A or B running to a 2 port USB / HDMI, with a floating hdmi to the relevant model-B, about 200$ plus 8 USB cables for KB/mouse. at most a further 80$, unless you REALLY need permanently connected video.
Otherwise X11/VNC/SSH/telnet/any other random remote access solution.

Should take you down to about 600$.

You are also missing the boot media (sd card), and any data storage. Depends on whether you can network boot, PXE, dhcp etc.

marked
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:14 pm

Thinking about it further just look at any information regarding beowulf clustering, as this is largely similar in processing power/memory capacity to early cluster members. However it is largely academic until we know how the boot process occurs.
It might also be worth raspberry investigating the cost of the removal of the HDMI interface for this type of requirement.

TreacleWelding
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:28 pm

I kinda assuming these devices can boot all by themselves, otherwise how does the included software and OS ship? I'm also assuming I will be able to modify (i.e. add and remove) installed software, so I'm not expecting (but could be wrong) to have to build in my own boot mechanism.

Storage is something I've currently got lots of, so I would expect the computers to access existing storage over the network. Although I have thought about including perhaps one USB HD as a permanent storage device for the "cluster".

I guess I don't need permanent video on the devices, just nice to have. Even though I migrated to Linux from Windows slightly over a year ago, I'm still mired in the Windows thinking.

As to what I would use these for, well partly to run a range of permanently on service to my LAN such as DHCP, DNS. On top of that there are a number of tasks that I need for pulling down data from the internet on a frequent basis and then parsing it into the formate I need (it's not stock market data, but if you think stock market data you will have a good idea what I'm thinking of) and then 2 or 3 device just for playing with, devices which much like a VM I'm able to make a hash of, or experiment on, and then just reset back and try again or try something else.

On top of that, and depending how sophisticated I get (in terms of network hardware), I would like to run a proxy server and firewall/UTM device.

TreacleWelding
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:30 pm

worth raspberry investigating the cost of the removal of the HDMI interface for this type of requirement. Yeah, now I come to think about it, headless server would be cool, but obviously need a way to unbrick a headless computer.

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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:57 pm

Quote from TreacleWelding on July 29, 2011, 18:28
I kinda assuming these devices can boot all by themselves, otherwise how does the included software and OS ship?
From what I gathered it boots from an SD card. I'm still looking to see what in the way of firmware booting it does.

I'm also assuming I will be able to modify (i.e. add and remove) installed software,
Standard package management on ubuntu.

so I'm not expecting (but could be wrong) to have to build in my own boot mechanism.
ahh -- i was under the impression you were looking at multiple raspberrys doing distributed tasks, ie. a beowulf type config, where booting from a network and obtaining tasks is the normal method.

Storage is something I've currently got lots of, so I would expect the computers to access existing storage over the network. Although I have thought about including perhaps one USB HD as a permanent storage device for the "cluster".
You might need to look at 512Mb - 4/8Gb SD cards as well within this type of cluster.

Doable using NFS, or NAS style storage, or standard Windows networking through CIFS/SMB sharing.

As to what I would use these for, well partly to run a range of permanently on service to my LAN such as DHCP, DNS.
Just one raspberry will suffice for these tasks, though these are cheap enough that you can run failover solutions with a duplicate. realise that the computing power in these is equivalent to a system that was capable of supporting 100s of users 10 years ago, in the age of isdn and leased lines.

On top of that there are a number of tasks that I need for pulling down data from the internet on a frequent basis and then parsing it into the formate I need (it's not stock market data, but if you think stock market data you will have a good idea what I'm thinking of) and then 2 or 3 device just for playing with, devices which much like a VM I'm able to make a hash of, or experiment on, and then just reset back and try again or try something else.

On top of that, and depending how sophisticated I get (in terms of network hardware), I would like to run a proxy server and firewall/UTM device.
one of these can easily support complex firewall rules - don't know about the extent of UTM, depends on whether you go for complete packet dissection, snort analysis, etc. remember that you are dealing with limited ram space for parsing rules at peak loading.

Mark

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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:04 pm

Yeah, now I come to think about it, headless server would be cool, but obviously need a way to unbrick a headless computer.

there is some talk about a reset toggle as it is extremely likely that devices would get hammered by kids let alone us responsible adults... :-)

Mark

Scottland89
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:08 pm

I was wondering the last few weeks what would happen about connecting 2 or more Raspberry Pis via USB myself. Lets say using:
A Model B Raspberry PI ("Master Pi"),
2x usb hub (may be able to try one if you have a keyboard with USB slots like mine),
1 hub full of raspberry pis ("slave pis", either or for model)

One USB Hub has the "slave pis" connected to each other and the other end of the hub is connected to the "Master Pi". The 2nd hub has all the esential stuff such as keyboard and mouse, connecting to the "Master Pi" as well. How would the Master and slaves react to each other?

I would imagine I'd be disappointed and find out the would act like Mass Storage, or not at all, if I had to put my 2 cents worth in.

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liz
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:13 pm

Mark - I think that rather than having a physical toggle, we're looking at the thing resetting when the power is interrupted. Sorry if I didn't make that clear earlier!

Scottland89 and others - we're not going to support device mode USB out of the box, but we may do subsequently.
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:21 pm

I don't think there's anything to be gained by doing this.

But since you asked... connect them through a router onto the same network and connect a monitor to one of them and monitor the rest of them through that one. Linux has excellent remote access options, so you don't need to worry about that.

You could then run MySQL, Postfix, Apache, ftpd and whatever else you might need on the different nodes.

Again, you will not gain anything by doing this. You would never use this in a production environment and chances are that a single pi raspberry would handle your home server needs without any problems anyway.

MDC
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:23 pm

Question to the people who are making and selling the pi. If you bulk buy does that do anything to the price and what about postage is that included?

Just thought I would ask

TreacleWelding
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:53 pm

Quote from marked on July 29, 2011, 18:57
one of these can easily support complex firewall rules - don't know about the extent of UTM, depends on whether you go for complete packet dissection, snort analysis, etc. remember that you are dealing with limited ram space for parsing rules at peak loading.My network consists of me and errr me. My internet connection is 20mbits up and 1mbit down, I do watch quite a lot of online TV etc, but I again was expecting that this device running as a full UTM with snort etc would be fine because of the fact its only me.

TreacleWelding
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:54 pm

Quote from liz on July 29, 2011, 19:13
Mark - I think that rather than having a physical toggle, we're looking at the thing resetting when the power is interrupted. Sorry if I didn't make that clear earlier!Can you explain how we can unbrick a device that's totally screwed up?

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liz
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 7:06 pm

MDC - we simply can't offer any discount on the device itself - the price is already as low as we can get it (again, we're a non-profit-making charity and we're trying to make the thing as accessible to the education market as possible). We certainly will be able to offer shipping discounts for bulk purchases, though.
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liz
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 7:06 pm

Quote from TreacleWelding on July 29, 2011, 19:54
Quote from liz on July 29, 2011, 19:13
Mark - I think that rather than having a physical toggle, we're looking at the thing resetting when the power is interrupted. Sorry if I didn't make that clear earlier!Can you explain how we can unbrick a device that's totally screwed up?

You'll have to reflash the SD card.
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MDC
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 7:56 pm

Thats all I wanted to know, as it would have helped a college or school if there was a bulk buy saving, especially if they were buying a schools worth.

P.S I did know you were a charity

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liz
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 8:09 pm

Quote from MDC on July 29, 2011, 20:56
Thats all I wanted to know, as it would have helped a college or school if there was a bulk buy saving, especially if they were buying a schools worth.

P.S I did know you were a charity

No probs - I'm guessing that all the people both mailing us and asking here for free devices haven't quite twigged about the charity thing yet, though! 8-)
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MDC
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 9:35 pm

I'm guessing that all the people both mailing us and asking here for free devices haven't quite twigged about the charity thing yet, though!

Maybe you should do something about that as you are going to have to put up with it for the next 3-4 months and it is only going to get worse the closer you get to the release date.

NO FREE SAMPLES

Svartalf
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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Fri Jul 29, 2011 9:52 pm

Quote from TreacleWelding on July 29, 2011, 19:54
Quote from liz on July 29, 2011, 19:13
Mark - I think that rather than having a physical toggle, we're looking at the thing resetting when the power is interrupted. Sorry if I didn't make that clear earlier!Can you explain how we can unbrick a device that's totally screwed up?

Unless you're going to put eMMC onto the thing, I don't think you're going to brick it up so bad you can't push out a new SD image either onto a new SD or the booting one, and then "unbrick" it.

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Re: Question: Super Rasberry pi

Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:41 pm

Where Buy a RaspBerryPi board?
Tulio Adriano Muniz

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