daggs
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which rpi should I get?

Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:37 pm

Greetings,

I'm looking for a rpi that will serve me as tvheadend server, I'm looking proper hw encoding support, stability, proper support for my dvb-t2 card (http://www.hauppauge.com/pages/webstore ... _euro.html) and not to pay a lot.
I had the rpi2, should I get the same one again or should I go with another board?

inputs appropriated.

Thanks,

Dagg.

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Re: which rpi should I get?

Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:47 pm

If your Pi2B (either version) is doing what you want, then a second one should also work. If you are planning a heavier load on the Pi, then you should look at the latest offering the Pi4B. Pick the RAM size depending on what you're planning to do with it. If you don't have a way to choose the memory size and you've been using prior models of Pi, then you might start with the 2GB model (aka Pi4B2) as that will boost all specs you're used to dealing with. Others will probably suggest the Pi4B4.

daggs
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:25 pm

Greetings,

I had an rpi2, it wasn't stable at all, I had to replug it's power supply at least twice a day, I thought that maybe with the advancement of the kernel it will be stable

W. H. Heydt
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:41 pm

daggs wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:25 pm
Greetings,

I had an rpi2, it wasn't stable at all, I had to replug it's power supply at least twice a day, I thought that maybe with the advancement of the kernel it will be stable
In that case, start by bringing the OS on your Pi2B up to date. Probably best to write burn a new SD card. General recommendation is to use A1 class cards.

daggs
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:44 pm

as said, I had an rpi2, I passed to my grandfather so he can watch iptv

W. H. Heydt
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:57 pm

daggs wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:44 pm
as said, I had an rpi2, I passed to my grandfather so he can watch iptv
Okay...given the history, just get a P4B. Your choice of 1, 2, or 4GB RAM. Start with Raspbian Buster or LibreElec.

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Imperf3kt
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:07 pm

W. H. Heydt wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:57 pm
daggs wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:44 pm
as said, I had an rpi2, I passed to my grandfather so he can watch iptv
Okay...given the history, just get a P4B. Your choice of 1, 2, or 4GB RAM. Start with Raspbian Buster or LibreElec.
Don't forget to get a new Pi4b power supply (your old one doesn't have the correct adaptor and may not supply enough current to use an a micro usb to usb c adaptor) and a Micro HDMI to HDMI cable.

Otherwise, a Pi3b+ should work with your current accessories, assuming you have spares.
55:55:44:44:4C
52:4C:52:42:41

W. H. Heydt
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:21 pm

Imperf3kt wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:07 pm
W. H. Heydt wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:57 pm
daggs wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:44 pm
as said, I had an rpi2, I passed to my grandfather so he can watch iptv
Okay...given the history, just get a P4B. Your choice of 1, 2, or 4GB RAM. Start with Raspbian Buster or LibreElec.
Don't forget to get a new Pi4b power supply (your old one doesn't have the correct adaptor and may not supply enough current to use an a micro usb to usb c adaptor) and a Micro HDMI to HDMI cable.

Otherwise, a Pi3b+ should work with your current accessories, assuming you have spares.
A jump from a Pi2B to a Pi3B+ should trigger getting a new PSU as well. The Pi2B is spec'd at about 2A, where the Pi3B/Pi3B+ are spec'd for 2.5A.

jahboater
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:09 am

daggs wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:25 pm
I had an rpi2, it wasn't stable at all, I had to replug it's power supply at least twice a day, I thought that maybe with the advancement of the kernel it will be stable
The Pi2 was/is very stable just like all Pi's. I don't recall any unplanned reboots with any of mine.

Perhaps you had an inadequate power supply.

Always use the "official" PSU, especially for the Pi4. They are very cheap.

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Re: which rpi should I get?

Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:44 am

One of my test cases for the pi4 was tvheadend with a pair of wintv dualhd dingles, and two dvb-s2 tuners, saving to a usb3 hdd. It was quite happy recording off all 6 tuners simultaneously.
I keep on meaning to swap from my x86 box to a pi4 - just a matter of inertia and needing to transfer existing recordings that is stopping me.
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rpdom
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Tue Oct 08, 2019 8:16 am

6by9 wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:44 am
One of my test cases for the pi4 was tvheadend with a pair of wintv dualhd dingles, and two dvb-s2 tuners, saving to a usb3 hdd. It was quite happy recording off all 6 tuners simultaneously.
I keep on meaning to swap from my x86 box to a pi4 - just a matter of inertia and needing to transfer existing recordings that is stopping me.
That's impressive. I used to run an x86 box with 4 DVB-T cards and MythTV. I set it to only power on when it needed to record something. When I got my first Pi 1B I changed it to move the recordings to a NAS which the Pi could access and just used the Pi and omxplayer for watching. It saved me a fortune on electricity bills. Much more than the cost of the Pi.

Now I just use a Pi3B with the TV HAT for recordings. It can't handle many simultaneous recordings like the x86 could (up to 24 at a time, in theory), but it's fine for what I use it for. A second tuner, or at least the ability to record more than one program on the same multiplex would be nice, but that is down the tvheadend developers to consider, not RPT.

daggs
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Tue Oct 08, 2019 11:27 am

Greetings, thanks for the info.
W. H. Heydt wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:57 pm
daggs wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:44 pm
as said, I had an rpi2, I passed to my grandfather so he can watch iptv
Okay...given the history, just get a P4B. Your choice of 1, 2, or 4GB RAM. Start with Raspbian Buster or LibreElec.
from what I can see, the pi4 is stronger than my current streamer I don't think that it worthwhile to get one unless the 1GB flavour is enough. I have no intention to replace the streamer because I'll stay with a paper weight and gain nothing.

I intend to install a buildroot image on it.
Imperf3kt wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:07 pm
W. H. Heydt wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:57 pm
daggs wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:44 pm
as said, I had an rpi2, I passed to my grandfather so he can watch iptv
Okay...given the history, just get a P4B. Your choice of 1, 2, or 4GB RAM. Start with Raspbian Buster or LibreElec.
Don't forget to get a new Pi4b power supply (your old one doesn't have the correct adaptor and may not supply enough current to use an a micro usb to usb c adaptor) and a Micro HDMI to HDMI cable.

Otherwise, a Pi3b+ should work with your current accessories, assuming you have spares.
I have no accessories at all.
jahboater wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:09 am
daggs wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:25 pm
I had an rpi2, it wasn't stable at all, I had to replug it's power supply at least twice a day, I thought that maybe with the advancement of the kernel it will be stable
The Pi2 was/is very stable just like all Pi's. I don't recall any unplanned reboots with any of mine.

Perhaps you had an inadequate power supply.

Always use the "official" PSU, especially for the Pi4. They are very cheap.
it would end up in a freeze all the time, I got the entire board for pihut.com
6by9 wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:44 am
One of my test cases for the pi4 was tvheadend with a pair of wintv dualhd dingles, and two dvb-s2 tuners, saving to a usb3 hdd. It was quite happy recording off all 6 tuners simultaneously.
I keep on meaning to swap from my x86 box to a pi4 - just a matter of inertia and needing to transfer existing recordings that is stopping me.
that is indeed impressive but I'm not sure I need such power, with which ram flavour did you used?

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Re: which rpi should I get?

Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:33 pm

daggs wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 11:27 am
6by9 wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:44 am
One of my test cases for the pi4 was tvheadend with a pair of wintv dualhd dingles, and two dvb-s2 tuners, saving to a usb3 hdd. It was quite happy recording off all 6 tuners simultaneously.
I keep on meaning to swap from my x86 box to a pi4 - just a matter of inertia and needing to transfer existing recordings that is stopping me.
that is indeed impressive but I'm not sure I need such power, with which ram flavour did you used?
4GB, but mainly because that was the version we generally had in the office for testing (those who needed to test out the memory configurations obviously had all flavours).
I did use a powered USB3 hub to connect all the tuners. The DVB-S2 tuners all have external power supplies as they have to be able to generate the supply for the LNBs. The USB3 HDD went into the other USB3 port on the Pi4 to avoid USB contention (yes, there will be PCI-e contention).
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I'm not interested in doing contracts for bespoke functionality - please don't ask.

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Re: which rpi should I get?

Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:39 pm

rpdom wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 8:16 am
That's impressive. I used to run an x86 box with 4 DVB-T cards and MythTV. I set it to only power on when it needed to record something. When I got my first Pi 1B I changed it to move the recordings to a NAS which the Pi could access and just used the Pi and omxplayer for watching. It saved me a fortune on electricity bills. Much more than the cost of the Pi.

Now I just use a Pi3B with the TV HAT for recordings. It can't handle many simultaneous recordings like the x86 could (up to 24 at a time, in theory), but it's fine for what I use it for. A second tuner, or at least the ability to record more than one program on the same multiplex would be nice, but that is down the tvheadend developers to consider, not RPT.
I've got an HP MicroServer N40L running Ubuntu as my x86 tvheadend server. Whilst I do have a DVBSky S952 dual DVB-S2 PCIe card in it, it's been a tad unreliable so it's generally been using the USB tuners for the last N years.
Pi3 with LibreElec attached to the main TV for viewing purposes.

Needing more than 4 Freeview muxes is very uncommon, and the DVB-S2 is mainly used for picking up the things that aren't on Freeview. When I reinstall I'm hoping the bouquet stuff all works (it didn't when I did the last install), and I'm not looking forward to matching up the DVB-S and DVB-T channels again - that's just tedious.
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echmain
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:01 pm

6by9 wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:44 am
One of my test cases for the pi4 was tvheadend with a pair of wintv dualhd dingles,
Is a dingle different than a dongle?

Or is the plural for dongle dingle?

I suppose it sounds funny to say you had a single dingle.

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Re: which rpi should I get?

Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:57 pm

echmain wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:01 pm
6by9 wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:44 am
One of my test cases for the pi4 was tvheadend with a pair of wintv dualhd dingles,
Is a dingle different than a dongle?

Or is the plural for dongle dingle?

I suppose it sounds funny to say you had a single dingle.
:-P
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I'm not interested in doing contracts for bespoke functionality - please don't ask.

daggs
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:14 pm

continuing on topic, is there any gain for getting the pi4 or a pi3 instead of pi2?
the pi2 is the cheapest of all and from what I can understand, it is enough for my needs.
from my point of view:
  • the ney for the rpi3 is the wireless card which I don't need and I heard it tend to overheat.
  • the ney for the rpi4 is the spec which is way more than I need and the price.

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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:32 pm

Depends on how much USB traffic you are intending to throw around.

On the Pi 0-3, ethernet, USB HDD, and your DVB-T tuner will all share the one USB2 interface via a hub. There are known limitations to the USB controller, and it can struggle with certain loads.

The Pi4 uses a totally different USB interface on the end of a 1xPCIe lane (5Gbps), and ethernet is on a dedicated interface out of the SoC.
1GB of RAM is sufficient for tvheadend, therefore there is no need to splash out on the 4GB version.

I wouldn't want to try and hook up my multiple tuners and HDD on a Pi0-3. One dual tuner, and only a single viewing client on the end of the ethernet you will probably get away with.

Based on CPC's current prices:
- a 2B will cost you £35.27.
- a 3B is £35.27.
- a 1GB Pi4 is £33.60
No, don't ask me to explain those pricings! You may find them available at lower prices elsewhere.
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:42 pm

6by9 wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:32 pm
The Pi4 uses a totally different USB interface on the end of a 1xPCIe lane (5Gbps), and ethernet is on a dedicated interface out of the SoC.
I think this is not fully correct, the single PCI Express Gen 2 lane in the Pi4 providing a total of 4 Gbps of bandwidth. :)

daggs
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:54 pm

6by9 wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:32 pm
Depends on how much USB traffic you are intending to throw around.

On the Pi 0-3, ethernet, USB HDD, and your DVB-T tuner will all share the one USB2 interface via a hub. There are known limitations to the USB controller, and it can struggle with certain loads.

The Pi4 uses a totally different USB interface on the end of a 1xPCIe lane (5Gbps), and ethernet is on a dedicated interface out of the SoC.
1GB of RAM is sufficient for tvheadend, therefore there is no need to splash out on the 4GB version.

I wouldn't want to try and hook up my multiple tuners and HDD on a Pi0-3. One dual tuner, and only a single viewing client on the end of the ethernet you will probably get away with.

Based on CPC's current prices:
- a 2B will cost you £35.27.
- a 3B is £35.27.
- a 1GB Pi4 is £33.60
No, don't ask me to explain those pricings! You may find them available at lower prices elsewhere.
the usb connections will be the actual dtv dongle and usb thumbdrive used for recordings.
I don't record alot, haven't tried the timeshift yet.
I see such pricing for the pi4 in my local vicinity too, but the pi4 is only at pre-order stage
that makes me wonder, what is the level of support? I had issues with the pi2 when he just came out

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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:22 pm

daggs wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:54 pm
the usb connections will be the actual dtv dongle and usb thumbdrive used for recordings.
I don't record alot, haven't tried the timeshift yet.
I see such pricing for the pi4 in my local vicinity too, but the pi4 is only at pre-order stage
that makes me wonder, what is the level of support? I had issues with the pi2 when he just came out
Let's go round in a circle then, shall we?

What level of support? It's the headline product, therefore there is significant resource behind fixing any things that do crop up. For such a significant shift in the hardware, it has been an incredibly smooth launch.

If you can't get hold of the Pi4 (and you don't say where you are), then why didn't you say that before?

All 3 models are at approximately the same price, therefore don't bring price in as a criteria for your selection. The second half of your comment
the ney for the rpi4 is the spec which is way more than I need and the price.
is totally bogus.

Make your own call - you haven't given enough information to really work with.
tvheadend should work on the Pi2, but very few people will have exactly the hardware you're looking at, so don't expect a definitive answer.
I'm out.
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:26 pm

daggs wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:14 pm
continuing on topic, is there any gain for getting the pi4 or a pi3 instead of pi2?
the pi2 is the cheapest of all and from what I can understand, it is enough for my needs.
Actually...no. I was checking on the Pi2Bv1.2 (list price is $35). Newark/Element14 wanted $42 and change. In theory, a Pi2B, Pi3B, Pi3B+ and Pi4B1 should all be the same price.

daggs
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 4:26 pm

fair enough, I'll look into the 1GB flavour of the Pi4, I hope I'll find some.

Thanks.

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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 4:52 pm

daggs wrote:
Wed Oct 09, 2019 4:26 pm
fair enough, I'll look into the 1GB flavour of the Pi4, I hope I'll find some.

Thanks.
You don't have a location shown, but here is a US supplier I'm happy to have dealt with: https://chicagodist.com/collections/ras ... odel-b-1gb

daggs
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Re: which rpi should I get?

Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:07 pm

I'm not in the U.S., however, I've looked into the local reseller and found out that what is marked as pre-order is the 4GB flavour, the 1GB is in stock

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