Heater
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Thu Oct 03, 2019 4:57 am

chwe,
IMO if someone isn't able to read a tutorial how to do something on linux in a terminal he or she'll have a hard time anyway, better to learn it from the beginnings...
Very true but if that someone is a Windows user and has never seen Linux they do not have a Linux machine to follow such a tutorial along with in the first place. You see the chicken and egg problem here.

The whole point of the Raspberry Pi was to get kids and others who have no programming experience interested in it and make it dead easy for them to get started with a "real" computer that they can trash to their hearts content. That brings us to the fact that they will need to get familiar with Linux to some extent.

If that someone is a Windows users and has never seen Linux then the above requirement calls for a super super simple way of getting them set up with a Linux system, which they will then use to learn some Linux.

Hence Etcher.
Last edited by Heater on Thu Oct 03, 2019 8:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
Memory in C++ is a leaky abstraction .

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PeterO
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Thu Oct 03, 2019 6:26 am

chwe wrote:
Thu Oct 03, 2019 3:50 am
IMO if someone isn't able to read a tutorial how to do something on linux in a terminal he or she'll have a hard time anyway,
I believe we now have a things called "The Web" and "Web Browsers" that can be used to read tutorials :lol:
About the only thing that is still command line based are the "man pages" and most of them are available as web pages as well.
There is (and should be) no need for a beginner to have to use the command line.
PeterO
Discoverer of the PI2 XENON DEATH FLASH!
Interests: C,Python,PIC,Electronics,Ham Radio (G0DZB),1960s British Computers.
"The primary requirement (as we've always seen in your examples) is that the code is readable. " Dougie Lawson

hippy
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Thu Oct 03, 2019 10:10 am

chwe wrote:
Thu Oct 03, 2019 3:50 am
The validation is the only point to recommend etcher compared to other tools.
No it is not, as I and others have pointed out.

Moonmarch
Posts: 543
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:58 pm

I have used open source software since I started using Linux which would be this year, and as far as I can tell you no other software contains ads I have to admit I'm not familiar with Balena software Balena Etcher is a large program the install size is over 400 MB compared to Firefox which is about 65 MB or even VLC media player which is 40 MB, I would say this is the reason why Etcher is expensive open source software even though the purpose of Etcher is to flash memory storage for the RPI computer more specifically the SD card which is where all the computer data will be stored, based on videos I saw on YouTube the best replacement for Etcher would be Win32 Disk Imager which appears almost identical to Etcher, according to the Win32 Disk Imager SourceForge we page this is the description of the software, "A Windows tool for writing images to USB sticks or SD/CF cards."

Here is a link to the Win 32 Disk Imager SourceForge website:

Win32 Disk Imager
https://sourceforge.net/projects/win32diskimager/

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rpdom
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Oct 05, 2019 4:14 am

Moonmarch wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:58 pm
based on videos I saw on YouTube the best replacement for Etcher would be Win32 Disk Imager which appears almost identical to Etcher
Win32 Disk Imager was the tool that used to be the recommended one before Etcher.
It had various disadvantages, such as requiring the image files to be uncompressed manually before writing them, and not verifying that the data had been written correctly.
Unreadable squiggle

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B.Goode
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:59 am

rpdom wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 4:14 am
Moonmarch wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:58 pm
based on videos I saw on YouTube the best replacement for Etcher would be Win32 Disk Imager which appears almost identical to Etcher
Win32 Disk Imager was the tool that used to be the recommended one before Etcher.
It had various disadvantages, such as requiring the image files to be uncompressed manually before writing them, and not verifying that the data had been written correctly.

Another significant disadvantage (for me) was that it offered [may have changed since] no protection against specifying the Windows System Disk as the target device to be overwritten. Which it then did, with predictably fatal results for the said Windows system.

balenaEtcher only offers removable devices as potential targets, avoiding that potential for user error.

For me that protection alone justifies the download bandwidth and storage space on my system.

Andyroo

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Oct 05, 2019 1:50 pm

B.Goode wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:59 am
...
balenaEtcher only offers removable devices as potential targets, avoiding that potential for user error.

For me that protection alone justifies the download bandwidth and storage space on my system.
The Mac version also warns you if it is a 'large disk' - a pain if you are imaging to a SSD / HDD but I would rather have that than lose a removable archive disk :D

bzt
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:45 pm

Hi,

You could try viewtopic.php?f=63&t=265251. It is experimental now, only tested under Linux.

It can write compressed images on-the-fly (no need to manually decompress them), it can verify writes, and it has protection against writing to your system disk.

Cheers,
bzt

alphanumeric
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:35 pm

jamesh wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:07 am
TBH, nothing as good as Etcher.
I'm not so sure about that? It imaged and verified as Ok on a defective Micro SD card for me? Multiplt times.
Win32diskinmager figured out the card was no good though.
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=258676
I'm still using it, just don't 100% trust it anymore as a reliable means of imaging my cards.

pica200
Posts: 219
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sun Feb 16, 2020 9:59 pm

Etcher can only verify the image has been written correctly. It doesn't verify unused space and there are quite clever fake microSDs out there which use caches and other techniques to pass basic checks but h2testw or f3 will always detect them.

alphanumeric
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:41 am

It "was" a good card bought from a reputable source. I have other cards bought from that retailer in use with no issues. I had been using it for a while. It failed but etcher didn't pick up on it which left me scratching my head for a while. Anyway, just passing on my experience with that particular utility.

pica200
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:25 pm

Did you test it directly after you got it? If no then you can't be sure it's a good one. There are sellers which mix original and fake cards either accidentally or on purpose.

Or the card is just worn out and corrupts data.

alphanumeric
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:52 pm

It was a good working card. It had been imaged several times with no issues. It just failed during use.
It was purchased from Adafruit.

PiLabs
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:39 pm

I love raspberry pi and Windows 95 and Macintosh

bzt
Posts: 589
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Fri Feb 21, 2020 1:05 pm

Gavinmc42 wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:10 pm
Every time I use Etcher to write a Pi image I have to go through three level of permissions in Win10.
I am so sick of that.
Try USBImager. It does not collect anything on you, so it does not need no network connection at all. It's still in early stage, but it is reported to be working on Windows by at least 5 different users (Win7 and at least 2 Win10 users), I tested it heavily under Linux, and MacOSX port is also working (but there the progress bar is lagging). Can decompress RPI ZIP64 images on-the-fly. You should give it a try.

Cheers,
bzt

Moonmarch
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 1:03 am

I have downloaded BalenaEtcher recently here is what I have to say about the ads there are only 2 ads being displayed these are ads that do not have videos or any sound effects, I will say the ads you will see when you use the software are not the same advertisements you would see on YouTube or Android apps on Android OS you need to watch several 30 second video clips, the advertisements you will see with the balenaEtcher program are not intrusive or unusual at all you are not going to see random movie trailer advertisements if anyone needed to know the truth.

I noticed balenaEtcher does not need to be installed on a Windows PC the program runs when you use the program there is no installer.

GlowInTheDark
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 1:14 am

I think people are upset about the fact that it (apparently) requires a network connection to run - and can be seen to be doing network communication while running (if you use something like Wireshark or tcpdump on it).

Given what the program does, there is no reason for it to be doing any network communication at all. That fact rankles people.
GitD's list of things that are not ready for prime time:
1) IPv6
2) 64 bit OSes
3) USB 3
4) Bluetooth

Loves Linux; loves to dance.

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jahboater
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:27 am

GlowInTheDark wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 1:14 am
I think people are upset about the fact that it (apparently) requires a network connection to run - and can be seen to be doing network communication while running (if you use something like Wireshark or tcpdump on it).

Given what the program does, there is no reason for it to be doing any network communication at all. That fact rankles people.
Yes it rankles me!

I will never use it on any of my machines.

Thankfully I am able to type "cp" so its no loss.
Pi4 8GB running PIOS64 Lite

GlowInTheDark
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:51 am

Yes it rankles me!

I will never use it on any of my machines.

Thankfully I am able to type "cp" so its no loss.
I totally agree, in every respect.

Like you, I see no reason to use it, when, as you say, cp (or even cat) works just fine.

Code: Select all

# cat /path/to/image.img > /dev/sda
GitD's list of things that are not ready for prime time:
1) IPv6
2) 64 bit OSes
3) USB 3
4) Bluetooth

Loves Linux; loves to dance.

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jahboater
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:44 am

GlowInTheDark wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:51 am

Code: Select all

# cat /path/to/image.img > /dev/sda
or

Code: Select all

# unzip -p /path/to/image.img >/dev/sda
which does the unzip and copy in one go (like etcher).

To be fair, one must double check sda is the right disk.
Pi4 8GB running PIOS64 Lite

GlowInTheDark
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:31 pm

# unzip -p /path/to/image.img >/dev/sda
Yes. Or even:

Code: Select all

# gzip -dc < /path/to/image.zip > /dev/sda
Note that I'm never quite sure what is and isn't installed-by-default in Raspbian. Several perfectly obvious, for all practical purposes essential, utilities are not installed-by-default (I always have to manually install them when setting up a new system). So I'm not sure if "unzip" is always there. gzip, of course, will always be there.
GitD's list of things that are not ready for prime time:
1) IPv6
2) 64 bit OSes
3) USB 3
4) Bluetooth

Loves Linux; loves to dance.

pica200
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:35 pm

I prefer dd over cp/cat because you can control the block size. NAND flash has large pages these days so it's a good idea to write in blocks a multiple of the page size. It's faster and causes less wear.

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B.Goode
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:51 pm

GlowInTheDark wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:31 pm

Note that I'm never quite sure what is and isn't installed-by-default in Raspbian.



Raspberry Pi go to the trouble of providing a manifest of exactly what is installed in each Raspbian Operating System image.

For example -
https://downloads.raspberrypi.org/raspb ... -full.info

No need for any uncertainty...

GlowInTheDark
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Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 1:06 pm

No need for any uncertainty...
Nobody is going to go the trouble of checking that file before giving advice on the forum.
GitD's list of things that are not ready for prime time:
1) IPv6
2) 64 bit OSes
3) USB 3
4) Bluetooth

Loves Linux; loves to dance.

incognitum
Posts: 576
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:34 pm

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Sat Feb 22, 2020 1:48 pm

GlowInTheDark wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 1:14 am
I think people are upset about the fact that it (apparently) requires a network connection to run - and can be seen to be doing network communication while running (if you use something like Wireshark or tcpdump on it).
And does some "analytics", like phoning home the path of the image you are writing: https://github.com/balena-io/etcher/blo ... er.ts#L263

Like "c:\users\your name\Downloads\image.img"

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