alex_willson85
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2019 1:53 pm

Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Wed Jul 17, 2019 2:27 pm

Hi :D

I am building a smart student entrance counter for my university as a graduate project.
Currently, I am using 3 pis zero w, each one of them is connected to the university wifi and placed in each building entrance.

To constantly manage and update my software code I am using https://www.upswift.io/ and it’s doing great. The next step is to place more counters
at every entrance of class rooms. upswift.io allows up to 3 pis for free, and unfortunately the university doesn’t pay for software, they only pay for the pis :roll:

Does anyone know other management solution that is free and can be integrated in a second for 15-30 pi's ?

Thanks !
Last edited by alex_willson85 on Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
neilgl
Posts: 648
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:36 pm
Location: Near Aston Martin factory

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Wed Jul 17, 2019 7:39 pm

That link does not work. Anyway, maybe add more pis and communicate between them using mqtt, with one pi acting as the mqtt server (aka broker). All free.

Andyroo
Posts: 3864
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2018 12:49 am
Location: Lincs U.K.

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:18 pm

You could have a look at Mender https://mender.io/overview/what-is-mender or Balena Open (well openBalena :lol: ) https://www.balena.io/open/

MQTT could be used to control the updates but you would find it hard as you would have to write all the software and still sort out how you get the code over, restarts etc. It greats for messages but not for updates.

Edit: link should be to https://www.upswift.io like this https://www.upswift.io/ - does not fit on an iPad.
Need Pi spray - these things are breeding in my house...

User avatar
neilgl
Posts: 648
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:36 pm
Location: Near Aston Martin factory

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:26 pm

Presumably the updates to your “software code” is just a new python script or java/other code, not a full OS upgrade?

epoch1970
Posts: 3364
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 9:33 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:00 pm

I didn't knew this one. I know other OTA systems, but none that I could "integrate in seconds".
Must be me.
"S'il n'y a pas de solution, c'est qu'il n'y a pas de problème." Les Shadoks, J. Rouxel

alex_willson85
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2019 1:53 pm

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:22 am

neilgl wrote:
Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:26 pm
Presumably the updates to your “software code” is just a new python script or java/other code, not a full OS upgrade?
Sending python code, removing/creating directories and sometimes installing packages with apt-get and pip. These features exist at upswift.io as part of their update tool and working perfectly for me. I couldn't find any other platform which provide that...

I have tried implementing MQTT update script but it's not as robust as a dedicated platform.
I also tried using mender but it was too complicated to integrate it. They also don't have a remote ssh function that works behind firewalls.

epoch1970
Posts: 3364
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 9:33 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:43 am

I think what you’re looking for is an overlay network and the ability to execute an arbitrary payload (!) in a secure (?) environment. That is not the typical definition of an OTA system.

Overlay network is a fancy name for VPN. There are things like dataplicity (cited in the official RPF docs) and multiple other services, their names elude me right now.
A reasonable DIY option might be using wireguard.

To ride over potential network disruptions perhaps something like Fabric could augment SSH?
"S'il n'y a pas de solution, c'est qu'il n'y a pas de problème." Les Shadoks, J. Rouxel

alex_willson85
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2019 1:53 pm

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Thu Jul 18, 2019 3:20 pm

epoch1970 wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:43 am
I think what you’re looking for is an overlay network and the ability to execute an arbitrary payload (!) in a secure (?) environment. That is not the typical definition of an OTA system.

Overlay network is a fancy name for VPN. There are things like dataplicity (cited in the official RPF docs) and multiple other services, their names elude me right now.
A reasonable DIY option might be using wireguard.

To ride over potential network disruptions perhaps something like Fabric could augment SSH?
Thanks! i will take a look on Fabric.
Looks like there is no platform that has software update ability + remote ssh feature in one place...maybe I will try to contact upswift.io for educational discount.

epoch1970
Posts: 3364
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 9:33 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Thu Jul 18, 2019 4:08 pm

alex_willson85 wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 3:20 pm
Looks like there is no platform that has software update ability + remote ssh feature in one place...
Depends on what you run on your platform, and on the level of control you have over the network (incl. firewalls and NAT).

Also, SSH (or VPN) access is not always desirable. Imagine I place machines within your network at home. I have SSH access to "my" machines. I have no control over your network, of course.
Suddenly there is an attack and your home network is compromised, including "my" machines. Did the attacker come in via your router, or from mine, then through SSH/VPN?

OTA agents "call home" and besides that the machines accept little incoming connections. They only execute verified, signed... payloads. Same scenario now: your network was attacked, "my" machines compromised. But I can prove the original OS and OTA packages the machines installed since were clean. So, the attackers had to come in from your router.
"S'il n'y a pas de solution, c'est qu'il n'y a pas de problème." Les Shadoks, J. Rouxel

joshwget
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2019 3:52 pm

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Fri Jul 19, 2019 7:47 pm

We're working on a service called Device Plane (https://deviceplane.io/) and I think we fit what you're looking for! We manage OTA updates with containers and support SSH access to devices among many other things. We're currently in beta and don't have any billing infrastructure yet so you could use our service for free. Our free tier will be somewhere near your device count so even when we do have billing you can continue using it for free.

If you (or anyone else reading this) would like to give Device Plane a try shoot us an email ([email protected]) and we'll help you get started!

alex_willson85
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Jul 17, 2019 1:53 pm

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Wed Jul 24, 2019 4:34 pm

Good news! I reached upswift.io over email and asked if it’s possible to get 30 devices free for my education project, thankfully they accepted! Can’t wait to deploy my application on all the 30 pi's at once :D :D :D

DavidPi123
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:25 am

Re: Cool project looking for OTA software update and remote ssh (behind firewall) solution

Thu Jul 25, 2019 4:21 pm

They are great! I am using upswift.io too, controlling my smart home project from work :)

Return to “General discussion”