tffx
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:11 pm

Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:30 pm

Hi,
I have a few new user questions.
My nephew has asked for a Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas :D from looking you can buy it with it a MicroSD pre-installed with Raspbian OS and NOOBS installer.

Question 1.
If I'm reading it correctly with Raspbian you can then learn to code with either Phython or Scratch - is this correct?

The Kano kit looks good (https://kano.me/), however you do seem to be paying a bit more to get a kit.
It looks like you can download the Kano OS and add a keyboard for less.

Question 2.
Can you swap MicroSDs, for example have one with Raspbian OS (and code in either Phython or Scratch) and one with Kano OS?
I assume everything is loaded on the MicroSD card?

Question 3.
What do people recommend, he is 10 years old.

- Phython
- Scratch
- Kano

Thanks

Jason_25
Posts: 122
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 6:25 pm

Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:21 pm

1. Yes you can you the included Python to learn to program but you can also use Bash (shell scripting) or many others if Python looks too confusing.

2. Yes you can just swap Micro SD and you don't necessarily need an expensive kit. A good kit for a kid would include a small screen but then you have to worry about configuring that too.

3. I don't want to sound discouraging but I thought of putting together something for my niece but when I thought of her troubleshooting disk errors with fsck and wireless with wpa_supplicant I abandoned that idea pretty fast. There is a paradox here - if the OS gets any more usable it will be less suitable for education but if it is not any more usable then people have a hard time getting started using it for education.

jamesh
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:25 pm

Python is probably the easiest typed in language, and comes pre-installed. However, the Pi also comes with Scratch which is a visual programming language using blocks, which is a pretty good introduction.

I like the kits from places like Pimoroni or PiHut, much cheaper than Kano, and you can construct your own cases etc which gives a sense of ownership.

Setting up the SD card is pretty easy nowadays, and a Pi 3 running the Raspbian desktop is easy to network up using ethernet or Wifi.
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W. H. Heydt
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:55 am

My 9-year-old grandson has been doing things with Scratch for a couple of years so a 10-year-old shouldn't have any problems. You can learn programming on a Pi is pretty much every language you've ever heard of (though not every language *I've* ever heard of...or even some of the ones I've used).

While you can swap SD cards, just remember to shut down and remove the power from the Pi before doing so. (On a Pi that boots from the SD card, it's not "hot swap".)

The basics needed are: Pi, power supply, microSD card (at least 8GB), keyboard, mouse, monitor, and either wireless access or a "Cat-5" ethernet cable. A number of these items may be found around the house and available to be used. Monitors in particular can be obtained used as otherwise they can be far and away the most expensive part to buy if that is needed.

achrn
Posts: 437
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 8:40 am

W. H. Heydt wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:55 am
Monitors in particular can be obtained used as otherwise they can be far and away the most expensive part to buy if that is needed.
But note that it doesn't need to be a dedicated computer monitor - if there's a TV in the house with a spare HDMI socket you can use that.

Conversely, it's possibly worth buying a dedicated power supply - yes it might work with a phone charger you've got lying around, but you need to be confident it is properly up to specification, and lots of the cheap ones seem not to be. To avoid the anticipated-present-doesn't-work-on-the-day scenario, I'd buy a known good power supply.

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Gavinmc42
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:31 am

I can use just about any old power supply for every version except the Pi3.
I use the Official power supply for the 3's and I have not had any problems.

Old TV's with HDMI, old monitors with HMDI-DVI adapter/cable. $5 mouse and $5-10 keyboards.
Important is access to PC with SD card writer and more than one SD card.

If you know what you are doing, boot the 3 from 16GB or bigger USB stick.
With a 32GB USB stick just about every known computing language can be put on it.
I use tiny 32GB Lexar USB 3 sticks.
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Gythral
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:18 pm

Assuming access to a TV/Monitor with a spare HDMI port, I would look at a basic kit:-
Pi3, case, SDmicro with NOOBs pre-installed, official PSU & a HDMI cable
then add a cheap keyboard and mouse, a USB SDMicro card reader, 1 or 2 SDMicro cards (8,16, or 32 GB)

& lastly a prototyping bread board and both male-male & male-female wires, some LEDs, some Darlingtons or MOSFETs, & a camera module


Warning :
HDMI switches need to be powered - Pi does not provide it
64GB SDMicro cards need reformatting

fruitoftheloom
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:11 pm

tffx wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:30 pm
Hi,
I have a few new user questions.
My nephew has asked for a Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas :D from looking you can buy it with it a MicroSD pre-installed with Raspbian OS and NOOBS installer.

Question 1.
If I'm reading it correctly with Raspbian you can then learn to code with either Phython or Scratch - is this correct?

The Kano kit looks good (https://kano.me/), however you do seem to be paying a bit more to get a kit.
It looks like you can download the Kano OS and add a keyboard for less.

Question 2.
Can you swap MicroSDs, for example have one with Raspbian OS (and code in either Phython or Scratch) and one with Kano OS?
I assume everything is loaded on the MicroSD card?

Question 3.
What do people recommend, he is 10 years old.

- Phython
- Scratch
- Kano

Thanks

It is PI not PIE = https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pi

Regards a good kit, maybe: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/processor ... s/8968119/
Thinking outside the box is better than burying your head in the sand...

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bensimmo
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:47 pm

ttfx, what do you think so far.

My personal way would be to either buy the official Pi3 kit as it looks nice as a present and will work*
Or buy a Pi3 & the official PSU. Spend the money on the official one as it will work and has a nice long lead and no usb cable to faff around with.
If you know a bit about computers and use Windows/Mac
Buy a nice SD card 16 or 32GB
Samsung Evo Plus do very well here and are not overly expensive.
And you can easily put NOOBS on with etcher** (edit see below for correction, minor error by me, you just copy it across following the instructions on the main site)

Buy a HDMI cable, longish so it'll reach the TV easily if that is what you'll be using.
Get a nice keyboard and mouse. Logitech MK270 kit is a nice one, a bit smaller mouse than normal so comfy with smaller hands too.
It's £20 or less, it's wireless and it works.
No wires to worry about and getting in the way or restricting where you sit.

Not sure what Jason is on about with fsk and wpa blah blah, they will not even touch that in a normal setup.

/Me with a 9 and 12 year old using Pi since your younger than that.
Any Code Club/Jam person will know they will be fine at whatever they are given in front of them.in Raspbian.

The hard part is interest and stuff for them to do.


-----
*I don't like the fact the keyboard/mouse are wired and do they provide a UK keyboard for us in the UK yet?

**NOOBS as then they can follow some 'install and setup' . Makes them feel that wasn't too bad and a sense of achievement.
Also an easy way to wipe and reset if thing get messed up, they are kids ;-)
Look at PINN for an alternative too.
Last edited by bensimmo on Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

tffx
Posts: 3
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:37 pm

Thanks everyone for your comments, this a great active forum.
I can see this beginning a useful resource for anyone learning.

First thanks @fruitoftheloom for spotting my typo: Pi not Pie :D

The Pimoroni kits looks good (https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/rasp ... tarter-kit) for a present, as everything is included.
I might just upgrade to a wireless keyboard/mouse.

Quick question:
Does a wireless keyboard/mouse work straight away or do you need a wired one to set up the wireless first?

Thanks again everyone.

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procount
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:48 pm

bensimmo wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:47 pm
And you can easily put NOOBS on with etcher**
@Bensimmo - just to correct you slightly to avoid any invalid expectations from newbies...

Etcher is a nice tool to easily put a raw image on of most OSes, but NOOBS is not one of them. As far as I know, there is no official raw image of NOOBS. It exists as a zip file that needs to be extracted to a FAT32 formatted SD card. But again this is still relatively easy.
There is, however, a version of PINN that can now be installed by Etcher. ;)
PINN - NOOBS with the extras... https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=142574

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bensimmo
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:09 pm

procount wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:48 pm
bensimmo wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:47 pm
And you can easily put NOOBS on with etcher**
@Bensimmo - just to correct you slightly to avoid any invalid expectations from newbies...

Etcher is a nice tool to easily put a raw image on of most OSes, but NOOBS is not one of them. As far as I know, there is no official raw image of NOOBS. It exists as a zip file that needs to be extracted to a FAT32 formatted SD card. But again this is still relatively easy.
There is, however, a version of PINN that can now be installed by Etcher. ;)
You are absolutely correct.

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bensimmo
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Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:15 pm

tffx wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:37 pm
Quick question:
Does a wireless keyboard/mouse work straight away or do you need a wired one to set up the wireless first?

Thanks again everyone.
With the one I mentioned
It uses its own wireless usb dongle, you just stick that in.
Boot and it works.

W. H. Heydt
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Location: Vallejo, CA (US)

Re: Raspberry Pie 3 for Christmas - Recommendations

Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:24 pm

bensimmo wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:47 pm
Get a nice keyboard and mouse. Logitech MK270 kit is a nice one, a bit smaller mouse than normal so comfy with smaller hands too.
It's £20 or less, it's wireless and it works.
Logitech is good, though I prefer the K120 keyboard. If you want a really good keyboard, take a look at Unicomp...but they aren't cheap. For mice, I go to Monoprice, but what I personally use is a Logitech Trackball.

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