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piglet
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sat Jul 29, 2017 5:59 pm

davidcoton wrote:
Sat Jul 29, 2017 3:40 pm
the index pages do fall apart a bit. (Columns on the right side don't connect visually to the title on the left).

Hmmm. I don't use the indexes that much. "New posts" all the way for me. The CSS for the indexes is a little odd. Anything that ends up needing a margin-right of -440px, with other places setting margin-right to +440px is being too clever by half. I'm very much of the "kiss" school of design.

This *hacks* it about right on my wide screen for RIP and Prosilver. There's probably a better way of doing it but I'm not the farm animal for the job! Two legs good.

Code: Select all

ul.topiclist dt, li.header dt {
    margin-right: -70% !important; /* try -40% for Raspberry_Pi theme */
}

Martin Frezman
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sat Jul 29, 2017 6:07 pm

First of all, I get what you're saying about how one's particular reason for participation in the forum will affect which method of reading the forum will be preferred. You've made it clear that your primary reason for participation is moderation and that that affects your choice of methods. I think (and here I am guessing) that this means you have to see all the new threads as they come in - to see if each new post is offensive and/or spammy. I can understand that - but of course, that's not *my* main objective.

That said, here's what I don't like about "New posts" (as implemented in the "Prosilver" skin). It doesn't remove things from the list once I've read them. Instead, they stay on the list and when you hover over the little circle next to the thread title, two things indicate that there is "nothing new; nothing to see here":

1) The color is black (instead of red)
2) The "hover" message says "No new responses on this thread" (or something like that - don't have exact wording in front of me)

Well, it seems pretty obvious to me that if there's nothing new in the thread, it should be taking up space on the page. Based on the general design of Usenet newsreaders, the general idea is to not show you things that you've already read.

That said, here's the problem I have with saying "Well, it's there - just look under the 'hamburger' menu and ...". Yes, it is - at least in Prosilver. But I had to hunt around (and post to this thread looking for help) to find it. That took time, and most people won't do it. That's the basics of UI design - if you hide something under a menu, most people will never find it (unless they take the time to ask around and be led to it by more knowledgeable people - which, again, most people won't do).

And, as Peter O posted earlier, it is twice as much work - it is move, click, move, click instead of just move, click.

Finally, note that (as far as I can tell - and admitedly I haven't spent the many hours it would take to fully investigate and document it all) there isn't a "hamburger menu" in either of the skins whose name begins with an R. I could only find the "hamburger menu" (and, thus, the "Unread messages" click) on the "Prosilver" theme. If I am wrong about this, by all means let me know, so that I can try out the "R" skins some more (since I do generally like their look better than the "Prosilver" skin).
If this post appears in the wrong forums category, my apologies.

MrEngman
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sat Jul 29, 2017 6:13 pm

jamesh wrote:
Sat Jul 29, 2017 5:12 pm
Martin Frezman wrote:
Sat Jul 29, 2017 3:04 pm
MrEngman wrote:
Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:58 pm
Why doesn't the Raspberry_Pi skin have an unread posts button?
Yep. That's the question. That's what's preventing me from using that skin.

I think the answer is "Because James doesn't see any point in that option".
Wow, way to get banned (again). Did the last ban not teach you ANYTHING?

I have NOTHING to do with the reskin, I didn't design it, I haven't had anything to do with the implementation, and what input I have had hasn't been acted on yet.

Of course there is actually an unread posts button, but don't let that inconvenient fact get in a way of a whinge. It's behind the burger button, top left, click on that, click Unread Posts. If that is NOT the unread post button you actually want, PLEASE spend the time explaining exactly what you want. Because so far that has not been clear.

If you have read this thread, you will see that the Unread and New Posts options were already explained, twice.
As far as I'm concerned I do realise you are not responsible for the new skins. I would just like to be able to use the Raspberry_Pi skin but there is no Unread Posts button that I can find, so where is it?

Yes, there is an Unread Posts button in the RPI and Prosilver skins but not in the Raspberry_Pi skin. If I select the button at the top left in the Raspberry_Pi skin the User Control Panel is opened, and no other options.

If I had the option I would revert to the old skin. Far better as far as I'm concerned.
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Martin Frezman
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:06 pm

I would just like to be able to use the Raspberry_Pi skin but there is no Unread Posts button that I can find, so where is it?

Yes, there is an Unread Posts button in the RPI and Prosilver skins but not in the Raspberry_Pi skin. If I select the button at the top left in the Raspberry_Pi skin the User Control Panel is opened, and no other options.
Yes. +1 on this.

FWIW, I didn't know that there was a either the Unread posts button or the hamburger menu in the RPI skin; I thought they were just in "Prosilver". But as I said, I haven't throughly researched and documented it all (yet).
If this post appears in the wrong forums category, my apologies.

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scruss
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:37 pm

Martin Frezman wrote:
Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:06 pm
FWIW, I didn't know that there was a either the Unread posts button or the hamburger menu in the RPI skin; I thought they were just in "Prosilver". But as I said, I haven't throughly researched and documented it all (yet).
The RPI theme is missing the Quick menu hamburger on any of the Your, New, Unread, Unanswered and Active Posts pages (that is, all the entries in the hamburger menu itself) . But — hallelujah! — the RPI theme actually includes a favicon!
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davidcoton
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:58 pm

piglet wrote:
Sat Jul 29, 2017 5:59 pm
This *hacks* it about right on my wide screen for RIP and Prosilver. There's probably a better way of doing it but I'm not the farm animal for the job! Two legs good.

Code: Select all

ul.topiclist dt, li.header dt {
    margin-right: -70% !important; /* try -40% for Raspberry_Pi theme */
}
Working great, thanks.
Last edited by davidcoton on Sat Jul 29, 2017 11:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Thanks for saving my life." See https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1327656#p1327656
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DougieLawson
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sat Jul 29, 2017 8:22 pm

scruss wrote:
Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:37 pm
Martin Frezman wrote:
Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:06 pm
FWIW, I didn't know that there was a either the Unread posts button or the hamburger menu in the RPI skin; I thought they were just in "Prosilver". But as I said, I haven't throughly researched and documented it all (yet).
The RPI theme is missing the Quick menu hamburger on any of the Your, New, Unread, Unanswered and Active Posts pages (that is, all the entries in the hamburger menu itself) . But — hallelujah! — the RPI theme actually includes a favicon!
Eh?
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mattmiller
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:28 am

Eh?
The hamburger menu isn't there when you've used it
So if you use it to view your posts - it disappears and you have to click on board index to get it back
(well it does under Win10/Chrome at least)

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bensimmo
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:41 am

Same on Android mobile too, it's always there on prosilver though (the whole forum address part is a bit nicer on prosilver)

That and the Home need moving up a block to the darker grey are under the search, inline with the messages and profile.

Another problem that would solve is when you are in messages or profile, there is no way out easily.
Clicking on the Raspberry takes you to the main site, the other is a larger site section burger menu.
And just black in between.
There is no back to start of the forum bit.
(On mobile)

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PeterO
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:48 am

mattmiller wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:28 am
Eh?
The hamburger menu isn't there when you've used it
So if you use it to view your posts - it disappears and you have to click on board index to get it back
(well it does under Win10/Chrome at least)
This is the biggest reason why I've gone back to ProSilver.
PeterO
Discoverer of the PI2 XENON DEATH FLASH!
Interests: C,Python,PIC,Electronics,Ham Radio (G0DZB),Aeromodelling,1960s British Computers.
"The primary requirement (as we've always seen in your examples) is that the code is readable. " Dougie Lawson

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bensimmo
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:58 am

PeterO wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:48 am
mattmiller wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:28 am
Eh?
The hamburger menu isn't there when you've used it
So if you use it to view your posts - it disappears and you have to click on board index to get it back
(well it does under Win10/Chrome at least)
This is the biggest reason why I've gone back to ProSilver.
PeterO
Same for me, I switch back to check it hadn't been altered.

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Burngate
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:01 am

This is my morning.

Having got up, made some coffee, I open the forum and log on.
Hamburger, middle-button-click "unread posts" so it's on a new tab, then middle-button-click page 2, page 3, ... , so I've got multiple tabs of unread posts.
A quick scan of each tab earliest to latest gives me all the interesting ones. Open each in its own tab. If it needs some thought, grab its title and drop it on the desktop.
Once I've reached the latest tab of unread posts, F5 updates it to the present.
If nothing of interest is there, on the index page hit "Mark forums read". A quick middle-button-click check on "New posts" to be certain, then back to all those interesting posts.

None of this "I would select unread posts, then select the first post in the list and then when I returned to the unread posts the post I had just read had been removed from the list so I could then just select the next post"
Things stay on the list until I close the tab. I can look at them now, look at them again later, or ignore them.

None of this "The hamburger menu isn't there when you've used it. So if you use it to view your posts - it disappears and you have to click on board index to get it back"
It's still there on the first tab - the index stays where it is, for when you next want it.

None of this "If I click "Unread" posts, I again get a list, which is 40 pages long, but this will include unread posts I will already have passed over without reading."
I've already marked those "Read" yesterday, so they're not in the list, and I've only got five pages to scan through. But then, I'm not a mod.

I don't understand why other people don't do the same - my way is so much more reasonable.
But then, I don't understand why people want to live in London. Or go to watch a dozen horses run round a field at Ascot. Or twenty two men run round a field with a ball. Or twenty men drive silly-looking cars round a track in Hungary ... no ... wait ... I do understand that. Come on Vettel! You can do it!

mattmiller
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:15 am

I don't understand why other people don't do the same - my way is so much more reasonable.
If this is a joke, then its very funny and well executed but if not........ :)

How many open tabs did you have going just for the Pi Forum? :)

mattmiller
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:20 am

This is the biggest reason why I've gone back to ProSilver.
Oh - I didn't realise prosilver has been updated in all this

Thanks for pointing it out

I like the colour scheme of the RPi theme but as an engineer, I'll take functionality over appearance any day

I'm back on prosilver now

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Burngate
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:11 am

mattmiller wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:15 am
I don't understand why other people don't do the same - my way is so much more reasonable.
If this is a joke, then its very funny and well executed but if not........ :)

How many open tabs did you have going just for the Pi Forum? :)
I usually max out at about a dozen. Many more than that, the words get lost.
As of now, I've only got seven, including the index, but I've just gone through the "mark read" bit.

I'm glad to know my sense of humour isn't totally off the wall

jamesh
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:18 am

PeterO wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:48 am
mattmiller wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:28 am
Eh?
The hamburger menu isn't there when you've used it
So if you use it to view your posts - it disappears and you have to click on board index to get it back
(well it does under Win10/Chrome at least)
This is the biggest reason why I've gone back to ProSilver.
PeterO
Didn't the original prosilver also require you to go back to the index to get "New Posts"?
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PeterO
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:23 am

jamesh wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:18 am
PeterO wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:48 am
mattmiller wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:28 am

The hamburger menu isn't there when you've used it
So if you use it to view your posts - it disappears and you have to click on board index to get it back
(well it does under Win10/Chrome at least)
This is the biggest reason why I've gone back to ProSilver.
PeterO
Didn't the original prosilver also require you to go back to the index to get "New Posts"?
I don't remember, but I do know it wasn't hidden in a menu, it had its own button !
PeterO
Discoverer of the PI2 XENON DEATH FLASH!
Interests: C,Python,PIC,Electronics,Ham Radio (G0DZB),Aeromodelling,1960s British Computers.
"The primary requirement (as we've always seen in your examples) is that the code is readable. " Dougie Lawson

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rurwin
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 11:16 am

jamesh wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:18 am
Didn't the original prosilver also require you to go back to the index to get "New Posts"?
Yes. But "Your Posts" was always available.

mattmiller
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:27 pm

Didn't the original prosilver also require you to go back to the index to get "New Posts"?
You had to do a little dance with old prosilver - but now its just perfect :)
The hamburger menu is available at all times :-)
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mattmiller
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:29 pm

Sorry - perfection would be explicit buttons available at all times but this is better than before and better than current RPi theme

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DougieLawson
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:46 pm

Most of that stuff is available in RPI
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mattmiller
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:52 pm

its not the contents of the hamburger menu that's the issue here (but prosilver seems to have a lot more)

The hamburger menu itself is not available after you've used it

You have to re-click on board index to get it back again

in new prosilver - its there at all times

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davidcoton
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:53 pm

DougieLawson wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:46 pm
Most of that stuff is available in RPI
Yes but not all the time. The hamburger gets eaten on some pages, like after selecting a hamburger option.
Really shouldn't have gone to MacD* for Raspberry stuff :lol:
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grega
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:13 pm

davidcoton wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:53 pm
Yes but not all the time. The hamburger gets eaten on some pages, like after selecting a hamburger option.
Fixes incoming...
Software Engineer, Raspberry Pi Foundation

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DougieLawson
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Re: STICKY: NEW FORUM SKIN - Comments here please.

Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:36 pm

grega wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:13 pm
davidcoton wrote:
Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:53 pm
Yes but not all the time. The hamburger gets eaten on some pages, like after selecting a hamburger option.
Fixes incoming...
Thanks.

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