kalehrl
Posts: 350
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:49 am

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Wed Oct 10, 2012 2:53 pm

This is your order number - 164815.
According to the post above, you should receive your raspi around 20th November.

User avatar
Lob0426
Posts: 2198
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 4:30 pm
Location: Susanville CA.
Contact: Website

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:41 pm

I E-mailed Allied. They could not tell me when my order would be fulfilled. I guess the U.S. customers are taking a back seat again here. When the last orders are filled in December maybe the U.S. can finally get a Pi from them. I really should just cancel the order. It is now 14 weeks. 5 to 6 months to get a $35 product is just ridiculous! Good thing Farnell had the foresight to order more SoC's than RS.

Poor planning and poor business practices, e.g. Not keeping your customers informed (Allied and RS). They should be embarrassed!

Edit: this is exactly what I was told by Allied;
"We are not getting any updates on the Raspberry Pi’s. I have been telling my customers 12-14 weeks. Sorry for delay with them".

It has already been 14 weeks for me. But RS has been fulfilling orders in europe!
512MB version 2.0 as WordPress Server
Motorola Lapdock with Pi2B
Modded Rev 1.0 with pin headers at USB

http://rich1.dyndns.tv/
(RS)Allied ships old stock to reward its Customers for long wait!

kenshen
Posts: 54
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:23 pm

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:22 pm

Hey i would like to know when my pi is going to ship order reference number: 1129044784

W. H. Heydt
Posts: 11118
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:36 pm
Location: Vallejo, CA (US)

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:22 pm

kenshen wrote:Hey i would like to know when my pi is going to ship order reference number: 1129044784
If I understand RS' scheme correctly...that's not a UK order, so there is no telling when it will ship. (And it's not US, either.)

kenshen
Posts: 54
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:23 pm

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:57 am

It's a US order..

W. H. Heydt
Posts: 11118
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:36 pm
Location: Vallejo, CA (US)

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:12 am

kenshen wrote:It's a US order..
Interesting. All the orders for Pis I've had with Allied started with "2500", where all the ones from RS(UK) started with "1010".

Ttalos
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:33 am

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:47 am

I think I should take it as a bad sign that my order starting 302 isn't even on the shipping list. I've had so many good interactions with Allied over the years. This has really soured me on them as well as the Foundation. I guess I will just be sending my component business to Digikey. I definitely won't be encouraging anyone to deal with the Foundation. They made a very bad choice in supply partner.

User avatar
Casalor
Posts: 67
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:14 am
Location: Nantwich, UK
Contact: Website

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 8:26 am

Ttalos wrote:I definitely won't be encouraging anyone to deal with the Foundation. They made a very bad choice in supply partner.
That's harsh and pretty unfair in the extreme. I'm willing to bet that they're just as annoyed about the delays as anybody else.

Ttalos
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:33 am

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 1:20 pm

Casalor wrote:
Ttalos wrote:I definitely won't be encouraging anyone to deal with the Foundation. They made a very bad choice in supply partner.
That's harsh and pretty unfair in the extreme. I'm willing to bet that they're just as annoyed about the delays as anybody else.
They're probably more annoyed. However, they are the ones who chose the supplier and negotiated the contracts. From the few posts I've seen in the forum they did not leave themselves any recourse should the suppliers fail. They also have not established new supply lines. I know those type of things take time to work out but they have had months. If you approach a company and say "We have orders for a 200k units and climbing but we can't supply them, will you help us?". What company will turn you down? The users aren't seeing much true communication either. It's all just "we're working on it". Look at the response NewIt is getting just by being honest with people and quick to ship.

Overall, it speaks to a very poorly run, from the business side, foundation. Since I was interested in it for use in a product, why would I suggest a partner that isn't business savvy? The RPi may be an amazing innovation but if you can't organize a supply, so what? I will still attempt to get one for my own interest. In a year or so I will re-examine it and if the supply chain is stable and it is useful for another product perhaps I will suggest using it.

User avatar
RaTTuS
Posts: 10507
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:12 am
Location: North West UK
Contact: Twitter YouTube

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 1:29 pm

Ttalos wrote:.....snippy

Overall, it speaks to a very poorly run, from the business side, foundation. Since I was interested in it for use in a product, why would I suggest a partner that isn't business savvy? The RPi may be an amazing innovation but if you can't organize a supply, so what? I will still attempt to get one for my own interest. In a year or so I will re-examine it and if the supply chain is stable and it is useful for another product perhaps I will suggest using it.
please do a modicum of research before spouting
the foundation does not do manufacturing
the supply is do by both farnell and rs
broadcom ran out of SOC because of the demand - and they have a large lead time [you don't just order a couple of hundred k of them] - which is / has been sorted now - so things are moving
if you want them fast then go to farnell.

there are going to be model a's by Christmas [which Christmas we have not been told]
How To ask Questions :- http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
WARNING - some parts of this post may be erroneous YMMV

1QC43qbL5FySu2Pi51vGqKqxy3UiJgukSX
Covfefe

Ttalos
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:33 am

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:39 pm

RaTTuS wrote:
Ttalos wrote:.....snippy

Overall, it speaks to a very poorly run, from the business side, foundation. Since I was interested in it for use in a product, why would I suggest a partner that isn't business savvy? The RPi may be an amazing innovation but if you can't organize a supply, so what? I will still attempt to get one for my own interest. In a year or so I will re-examine it and if the supply chain is stable and it is useful for another product perhaps I will suggest using it.
please do a modicum of research before spouting
the foundation does not do manufacturing
the supply is do by both farnell and rs
broadcom ran out of SOC because of the demand - and they have a large lead time [you don't just order a couple of hundred k of them] - which is / has been sorted now - so things are moving
if you want them fast then go to farnell.

there are going to be model a's by Christmas [which Christmas we have not been told]
I never said that the foundation does manufacturing. I said they CHOSE the suppliers and negotiated the contracts.
Are there only two companies capable of supplying the product? Why not keep finding more suppliers if there are more than two?

From the Broadcom Wiki: "Broadcom is known as a fabless company. It outsources all semiconductor manufacturing to Asian merchant foundries, such as GlobalFoundries, Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corporation, Silterra, TSMC, and United Microelectronics Corporation."
It looks like the Foundation ordered from Broadcom who ordered from one of their suppliers. I know that a fab schedules their runs very far in advance. Somewhere someone miscalculated the demand. I'm sure whoever orders for Broadcom based their order off of information provided by the Foundation. How well they applied that info is another question.

But, where is the clause in the contract that provides recourse when the supplier fails to meet demand? Why has the foundation not plastered it far and wide that no orders should be placed with RS/Allied? Instead it has been up to the user community to let each other know. Will they continue to deal with RS after this? It seems that they designed a great product and just handed off production without leaving a way for them to have any input.

plugwash
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3477
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 11:45 pm

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:58 pm

When forming a contract there are two parties involved. Usually one of those parties is in a stronger position than the other. When you are the weaker party in a contract negotiation you can be pushed into accepting very one-sided terms or not taking the contract at all. For buisness to consumer contracts there is some legal protection against one-sided terms but afaict there is little to no such protection for buisness to buisness contracts. I don't know and I don't want to know the specifics of the foundation's contracts with farnell and RS but anyone with a modicum of intelligence should be able to guess the kind of terms such a contract is likely to contain given the relative bargining positions of the players.

Also aside from contractual issues there is the problem that if too many people move supplier we would just end up with two suppliers badly backordered rather than just one.

sinapsi
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:58 pm
Contact: Website

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:36 pm

at last, my rasbperry pi (ordered from RS on may, as written above in this topic) arrived :)

kenshen
Posts: 54
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:23 pm

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:51 pm

Can any one help me with my posts above?

robin850
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 1:45 am

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Sun Oct 14, 2012 2:44 am

Summer has left, Autumn has arrived, Winter is right around the corner. Perhaps my Raspberry Pi will be a Christmas present? ;)

User avatar
Cotard
Posts: 67
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:26 pm

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Sun Oct 14, 2012 7:40 am

robin850 wrote:Summer has left, Autumn has arrived, Winter is right around the corner. Perhaps my Raspberry Pi will be a Christmas present? ;)
Winter is coming!

Lord Eddard Stark

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24201
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Sun Oct 14, 2012 8:40 am

Ttalos wrote: I never said that the foundation does manufacturing. I said they CHOSE the suppliers and negotiated the contracts.
Are there only two companies capable of supplying the product? Why not keep finding more suppliers if there are more than two?

From the Broadcom Wiki: "Broadcom is known as a fabless company. It outsources all semiconductor manufacturing to Asian merchant foundries, such as GlobalFoundries, Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corporation, Silterra, TSMC, and United Microelectronics Corporation."
It looks like the Foundation ordered from Broadcom who ordered from one of their suppliers. I know that a fab schedules their runs very far in advance. Somewhere someone miscalculated the demand. I'm sure whoever orders for Broadcom based their order off of information provided by the Foundation. How well they applied that info is another question.

But, where is the clause in the contract that provides recourse when the supplier fails to meet demand? Why has the foundation not plastered it far and wide that no orders should be placed with RS/Allied? Instead it has been up to the user community to let each other know. Will they continue to deal with RS after this? It seems that they designed a great product and just handed off production without leaving a way for them to have any input.
There some factual inaccurancies here. The Foundation does not order any chips at all. That is entirely down to the manufacturer. The Foundation does give advice to the manufacturers who do not have to follow that advice if they don't want to. The manufacturers then order from Broadcom who schedule accordingly.

As another poster said, when the contracts were originally signed, The RaspberryPi foundation was a tiny charity with no clout whatsoever, which makes contract negotiations difficult, or at the very least means the larger companies can ask for a lot in the contract. The contracts are currently with the two companies RS and Farnell, both very large and reputable multinationals. At the time of signing, there was every expectation they would be able to meet the demand. However, demand was much MUCH higher than any predictions, and that has turned out to be a slightly wayward expectation. These contracts also limit what the Foundation can say or do to remedy the situation.

The Foundation has a LOT of input in to the way the product is developed - in fact they have all of it. What they don't have is much sway in how the manufacturers go about their business, or any leeway to recommend one manufacturer over another.

Now of course, any one with perfect hindsight can claim the contracts are too one sided (but you also don't know the details on the contracts either), but when you are a small charity with a new product, you simply don't have the benefit of writing a contract exactly how you want. With that 20:20 hindsight a lot of people have, it's easy to criticise, but these people were not there during the negotiations, and are showing a lack of comprehension of the difficulties involved.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

User avatar
Burngate
Posts: 6104
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 4:34 pm
Location: Berkshire UK Tralfamadore
Contact: Website

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Sun Oct 14, 2012 9:47 am

jamesh wrote:
Ttalos wrote:From the Broadcom Wiki: "Broadcom is known as a fabless company. It outsources all semiconductor manufacturing to Asian merchant foundries, such as GlobalFoundries, Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corporation, Silterra, TSMC, and United Microelectronics Corporation."
The Foundation does not order any chips at all. That is entirely down to the manufacturer. ... The manufacturers then order from Broadcom who schedule accordingly...
Just an aside here ... The Foundation were originally given a high volume price break despite having only a small volume order.
If RS / Farnell are ordering the SoCs themselves, do they get that price break, or are their orders large enough to get the price break anyway?

{-0-}
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2012 8:28 am

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Sun Oct 14, 2012 10:25 am

Um...

I work in a non-related field but in a company that is in the same position as RS, ie between overseas manufacturer and uk customer.

I'm also the unlucky blighter that has to work out how many to order and when - we typically have a 20 week lead time between placing order and stocks arriving at our warehouse.

This time comprises of time for the manufacturer to source materials, have local holidays, make the items, send the items to port, get delayed at port, get put on a ship, get to the uk, get delayed at customs etc etc.

That covers to a degree the decision of when and is relatively easy, the decision on how many is not.

Salesmen lie, all salesmen lie, all salesmen lie without even realising they are lying. They do it as regularly as normal people breathe.

A supplier's salesmen will say this is the next big thing, it's bigger than big, this will sell better than sliced bread!
Our own salesmen will say I can sell 3 bazillion of these every day! (they have confirmed orders for 5, from 1 customer)

I sit between these two . Easy, order lots! In fact order more than lots!

I can't. The warehouse is full of the last thing that would sell in the bazillions, the last thing that would sell better than sliced bread but didn't, and the thing before that that didn't and the thing before that that didn't.

So how many do I order? I'll look at the forecasts (if I get any that is - and they are generally optimistic), I'll consider any contractual requirements, I'll use my past experience, I'll lick my finger and hold it to the wind.

And order as few as I can.

Sometimes I get it wrong and I'm losing us sales. No-one cares about the old crap blocking up the warehouses, no-one cares about all the cash tied up in that anymore. All anyone can see is that I am losing us sales today!

And wow, that's a whole new world of pain, now everyone wants my head on a stick.

Damned if I do and damned if I don't.

Anyway, rant over, order 1228** arrived Friday and I'm as happy as a pig in pooh. Until tomorrow at 9am and I go back to being that guy again.

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 24201
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Sun Oct 14, 2012 10:56 am

What he said....
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
“I think it’s wrong that only one company makes the game Monopoly.” – Steven Wright

W. H. Heydt
Posts: 11118
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:36 pm
Location: Vallejo, CA (US)

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:53 pm

Bravo, {-0-}. If this Forum has a reputation system, you'd get "+rep" from me.

What you said is what I've tried to tell the more...vigorous...complainers, without be the inside person, but you have done so wonderfully and to the point.

Ttalos
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:33 am

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Sun Oct 14, 2012 11:14 pm

jamesh wrote:
Ttalos wrote: I'm sure whoever orders for Broadcom based their order off of information provided by the Foundation. How well they applied that info is another question.
There some factual inaccurancies here. The Foundation does not order any chips at all. That is entirely down to the manufacturer. The Foundation does give advice to the manufacturers who do not have to follow that advice if they don't want to. The manufacturers then order from Broadcom who schedule accordingly.

As another poster said, when the contracts were originally signed, The RaspberryPi foundation was a tiny charity with no clout whatsoever, which makes contract negotiations difficult, or at the very least means the larger companies can ask for a lot in the contract. The contracts are currently with the two companies RS and Farnell, both very large and reputable multinationals. At the time of signing, there was every expectation they would be able to meet the demand. However, demand was much MUCH higher than any predictions, and that has turned out to be a slightly wayward expectation. These contracts also limit what the Foundation can say or do to remedy the situation.

The Foundation has a LOT of input in to the way the product is developed - in fact they have all of it. What they don't have is much sway in how the manufacturers go about their business, or any leeway to recommend one manufacturer over another.

Now of course, any one with perfect hindsight can claim the contracts are too one sided (but you also don't know the details on the contracts either), but when you are a small charity with a new product, you simply don't have the benefit of writing a contract exactly how you want. With that 20:20 hindsight a lot of people have, it's easy to criticise, but these people were not there during the negotiations, and are showing a lack of comprehension of the difficulties involved.
I think people are misinterpreting some of what I said. After all, tone doesn't translate well over the internet. If you look at the line I bolded above you will see that I realize that the Foundation is not completely at fault for all of this. Given that Farnell is having far fewer supply issues speaks to this. I've also negotiated a few B2B contracts, as the weaker party, and it's not fun. But we all must decide how far over the barrel to go. My original post simply said that I believe the Foundation could have done more. Even if their response was better communication. Who knows, maye RS is cold shouldering them as well. If they are, perhaps tell us that.

I also said that I wouldn't encourage anyone to deal with the Foundation right now. "not encourage" /= discourage. I just don't see what would be accomplished by telling everyone and anyone to buy a RPi at this point, other than create more disappointed people. Later I said that if things are changed in a year that I would change my position. I'm hoping that the RPi is as fantastic as I think it is and that supply issues will be worked out. Hopefully the interest shown in the RPi will give them a much stronger negotiation position in the future. Even better will be when the early adopters can look back and laugh at all this.

sn00zerman
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:42 pm

I'm beginning to worry ...

Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:06 pm

Hi all,

On july 4th, I ordered my second PI from RS Components.
In the confirmation email, it was stated that estimated delivery would be within 12 weeks.
In the meanwhile, 14 weeks have passed.
My OrderID = 146266 (delivery is to the same location as my first PI => Belgium)

Can anyone tell me if I need to contact RS, or is it "normal" that I still did not receive this PI ?

Best regards,
Kris

tinkertiler
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 6:47 pm

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:12 pm

My order number is 133740 Ordered June 30th. Still no conformation email, still no contact from them apart from a shipping delay. Bad service is a understatement from this company!!!

15 weeks from the time i ordered it with all the bits i.e memory card, psu ect and you was very quick to take my money you are not so keen to give it back with people reporting that it takes over a month to get back. Very difficult to get hold of anyone to help if there is a problem and just general pants service!

Ordered another PI of Farnel and had that well within a month and they didnt take any money until the PI was dispatched well i hadnt even paid for it when it arrived lol But payment went a day or so after it was here. Keeping money for something that hasnt even been dispatched or even close to dispatch is wrong and with no communication at all unless you go hunting around the net is just plain lazy on your behalf

User avatar
exartemarte
Posts: 373
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:51 pm
Location: Middle England
Contact: Website

Re: Latest Order and Shipping update from RS & Allied

Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:26 pm

tinkertiler wrote:Keeping money for something that hasnt even been dispatched or even close to dispatch is wrong and with no communication at all unless you go hunting around the net is just plain lazy on your behalf
Absolutely. I would have been prepared to accept that the supply problems might not have been the fault of RS. The unwillingness to communicate, however, is inexcusable, and taking money months before the goods are available, to me, is just sharp practice. That last point is why I cancelled my order with RS and is why I won't deal with them again.

Return to “General discussion”