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Doktor-X
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Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Sun Aug 07, 2016 6:07 pm

Hello world :lol: Now can we expect pi 4 to have hardware h265 decoder, i currently have original 256mb bord and wanted to upgrade for smoother video experience and wanted to buy cheap china android tv box but i was wondering if pi in it's new release will have hardware decoder

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kusti8
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Sun Aug 07, 2016 7:28 pm

Doktor-X wrote:Hello world :lol: Now can we expect pi 4 to have hardware h265 decoder, i currently have original 256mb bord and wanted to upgrade for smoother video experience and wanted to buy cheap china android tv box but i was wondering if pi in it's new release will have hardware decoder
Nobody knows. Why? Because 4K is probably going to be a long ways away.
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Sun Aug 07, 2016 7:34 pm

Doktor-X wrote:Hello world :lol: Now can we expect pi 4 to have hardware h265 decoder, i currently have original 256mb bord and wanted to upgrade for smoother video experience and wanted to buy cheap china android tv box but i was wondering if pi in it's new release will have hardware decoder
The pi 3 has just come out, and a pi 4 isnt going to be made till a long time. Noone knows what specs it will have. Theres been hundreds of threads like this and they all get locked.
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Sun Aug 07, 2016 8:13 pm

Per Dr. Upton's comments at the time of the Pi3B launch, the next version of the Pi is two to three years away.

I can think of a number of things that would be more useful on a Pi than h.265 hardware decode.

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Sun Aug 07, 2016 9:06 pm

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:22 pm

DougieLawson wrote:Image
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:47 pm

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Mon Aug 08, 2016 4:50 am

kusti8 wrote:Nobody knows. Why? Because 4K is probably going to be a long ways away.
Digital cinema cameras currently shoot 4K as do many consumer grade camcorders.

https://www.arri.com/camera/alexa/camer ... alexa-sxt/

http://www.red.com/products

http://www.panasonic.com/uk/consumer/ca ... 1000e.html

http://www.canon.ca/inetCA/en/products/ ... /pid/44258

Since h264 includes 4K profiles since level 5, then 4K is not about h265 versus h264, but rather encoding efficiency.

Having h265 in hardware would be great, especially if it worked. At the same time, good openGL drivers are probably more important for people using the Pi to learn programming.

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Mon Aug 08, 2016 5:20 am

AFAIK
h.265/HEVC is coming to the current set of rasperry pis, it will run on the gpu using decoding similar to GPGPU i.e it will be software decoding but will still be faster as it would be running on the gpu.
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Mon Aug 08, 2016 8:22 am

ric96 wrote:AFAIK
h.265/HEVC is coming to the current set of rasperry pis, it will run on the gpu using decoding similar to GPGPU i.e it will be software decoding but will still be faster as it would be running on the gpu.
I suspect that running H265 on the GPU (on the vector cores and the Quads) would actually be slower than running NEON optimised code on the ARMs. And of course, incompatible with the new graphics driver which would also need to be using the quads.

H265 decode is possible on the ARM cores right now. Not sure what resolution and framerate though.

H265 HW encode/decode is a big job, requiring extremely fast HW and RAM. Broadcom have no VC4 codec experts any more (well, maybe some in the settop box division, if they haven't canned them all as well), so it would be a big ask for them to produce H265 in HW.
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Mon Aug 08, 2016 9:08 am

Dom (aka popcornmix) has been doing lots of work on Kodi being able to play HEVC (aka H265) using a hybrid ARM and GPU implementation on a Pi3.
http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=266377
popcornmix Wrote:
It depends on many factors, but I can play ~10Mbit/s 1080p HEVC on overclocked Pi3 with no drops, which is very good quality.
Actually http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid ... pid2271695
It's true there's no h265 hardware decode support but there's been a lot of software optimisations recently from the RPi Foundation that have made 1080p h265 decode successful on RPi2 (particularly when sdram is overclocked) and on RPi3 (stock speeds), with more optimisations planned. This h265 argument is really getting a little old - try some of the recent OpenELEC/Kodi 17 builds.
So Pi2 is just about possible.

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Mon Aug 08, 2016 10:27 am

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Mon Feb 06, 2017 5:27 pm

what video player does kodi use for hevc videos? omxplayer?

can i also get this to work on normal raspbian somehow? that would be awesome. kodi is nice, but i would prefer to keep my raspberry pi 3 general purpose. :)

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Mon Feb 06, 2017 7:19 pm

spock wrote:what video player does kodi use for hevc videos? omxplayer?

can i also get this to work on normal raspbian somehow? that would be awesome. kodi is nice, but i would prefer to keep my raspberry pi 3 general purpose. :)
Get a second Pi....then you can have the best of both worlds. Then get a third, in case you think of another use, or you want to have a spare on hand....

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Mon Feb 06, 2017 8:18 pm

spock wrote:what video player does kodi use for hevc videos? omxplayer?

can i also get this to work on normal raspbian somehow? that would be awesome. kodi is nice, but i would prefer to keep my raspberry pi 3 general purpose. :)
I'll ask tomorrow how it works, if I remember!
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Tue Feb 07, 2017 9:16 am

W. H. Heydt wrote:Get a second Pi....then you can have the best of both worlds. Then get a third, in case you think of another use, or you want to have a spare on hand....

You've heard of "crazy cat ladies"? Welcome to land of "crazy Pi people."
i am a crazy pi person already. :) i have several pis for different purposes but at some point this also becomes a bit excessive and cumbersome. it would be more convenient for me if i could simply watch videos in raspbian (with the same formats supported as in kodi).
jamesh wrote:I'll ask tomorrow how it works, if I remember!
thanks! that would be nice! :)

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Tue Feb 07, 2017 11:19 am

W. H. Heydt wrote:You've heard of "crazy cat ladies"? Welcome to land of "crazy Pi people."
My Pis don't scratch me or sleep on my keyboard.
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Wed Feb 08, 2017 5:52 pm

Jednorozec wrote:
W. H. Heydt wrote:You've heard of "crazy cat ladies"? Welcome to land of "crazy Pi people."
My Pis don't scratch me or sleep on my keyboard.
I woke up this morning with a cat on me / because a cat was on me. My Pi's never do that. But I do have 5 times as many Pi's as cats, so yeah, crazy Pi person.

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:40 pm

CarlRJ wrote:
Jednorozec wrote:
W. H. Heydt wrote:You've heard of "crazy cat ladies"? Welcome to land of "crazy Pi people."
My Pis don't scratch me or sleep on my keyboard.
I woke up this morning with a cat on me / because a cat was on me. My Pi's never do that. But I do have 5 times as many Pi's as cats, so yeah, crazy Pi person.
One of my Pis wakes me up in the morning...but, then, it's programmed to do that.

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:10 pm

jamesh wrote:
spock wrote:what video player does kodi use for hevc videos? omxplayer?

can i also get this to work on normal raspbian somehow? that would be awesome. kodi is nice, but i would prefer to keep my raspberry pi 3 general purpose. :)
I'll ask tomorrow how it works, if I remember!
Forgot...soz. I'll try again tomorrow.
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:57 am

I hear people referring to 4K however thats not really the main concern. The Raspberry Pi is unlikely to be designed for running 4K. It is an enthusiast device not a high end video display. The driving factor for h.265 support is this will become the mainstream. Essentially everything will be encoded using this format in the coming years. The Raspberry Foundation will need to ensure that h.265 decoding is on the architectural radar for future editions of the product. Version 4 may need architecture changes which lay the foundations for h.265 decoding in say version 5 of the product. Right now hybrid software/hardware decoding is being written by enthusiasts to try and get some of the work performed by the GPU but in future their will need to be a hardware decoding path for the product as long as its affordable.

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:15 pm

spock wrote:what video player does kodi use for hevc videos? omxplayer?
No, omxplayer only handles pure gpu decoders.
HEVC is a hybrid using the 4 arm cores with NEON, plus two cores of VPU and 3D QPU hardware.
Its API is ffmpeg running on the arm but it offloads transform, intra, mot-comp and deblock to the GPU.

Kodi uses VideoPlayer with MMALFFmpeg acceleration for this.

Quite a lot of work was done on this early last year, but video acceleration for Chromium has taken precedence recently.
However HEVC work has now resumed.

It's hard to guarantee performance with a software decoder - it depends very much on the encoding options used.
Currently a stock Pi3 will play the vast majority of 720p24 8-bit HEVC files, and some 1080p24 files.
Overclocking increases the range of files that will play.

The aim is to increase the number of 1080p24 files that play as much as possible, but it's hard to predict how much further we can go.
We would also like to have some 10-bit HEVC support but the increased sdram bandwidth required will mean performance will be somewhat lower.

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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Fri Feb 10, 2017 3:14 pm

German DVB-T will switch to T2 with 1080p50 H265 in about 6 weeks. I think that's a job which the current RPi will not be able to do.
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Fri Feb 10, 2017 3:46 pm

gkreidl wrote:German DVB-T will switch to T2 with 1080p50 H265 in about 6 weeks. I think that's a job which the current RPi will not be able to do.
Really? Presumably they will support H264 as well, because much of the installed based of TV won't support H265.
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 possible h.265 decoder?

Fri Feb 10, 2017 4:01 pm

jamesh wrote:
gkreidl wrote:German DVB-T will switch to T2 with 1080p50 H265 in about 6 weeks. I think that's a job which the current RPi will not be able to do.
Really? Presumably they will support H264 as well, because much of the installed based of TV won't support H265.
No, everything will be in full HD and only H265. People have to buy new hardware (a receiver box for older TVs).
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