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alexeames
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Thu Jul 28, 2016 8:44 pm

Napier wrote:Of course, it could be because the official display just isn't much good when compared to the competition?
What competition exactly? There are no other screens that can utilise the Pi's DSI interface.

Yes other screens are/were/will be available, like...
  • HDMIPi (uses obsolete TN screen technology and in searching I just found out it appears to be discontinued - nice of my "partners" to tell me :lol: )
  • PiTop CEED (ips, nice big 14" screen but not very portable - great price though)
  • various Adafruit offerings (all very nice, but a bit pricey)
  • Do-it-yourself (which can end up being better value than ANY of the other offerings, but requires skill and risk-taking).
But none of these compete directly with the touch-screen ips official DSI screen. I don't know sales figures, but if the assembly video views (and Pi trends in general) are anything to go by they've sold a lot more of these than
(HDMIPi + PiTop CEED) * several

It's horses for courses. Pick a screen that suits your needs. I do a lot of GPIO hacking, for which the official DSI screen is not so useful (without some kind of clunky breakout board on a ribbon cable). But that's fine. I use a different screen or no screen for that.

As for the OP and the original question: I ordered an A+ in April when Farnell announced the 512 MB RAM upgrade. I thought I'd bag one for the collection.

Initial delivery estimate was June. I had an email from them every few weeks with an updated ETA. It kept getting pushed back, so there was obviously some kind of scheduling issue (BCM2835 availability due to Pi Zero popularity maybe? WJDK). Last week I got a shipping notification (a month earlier than expected).

If you want concrete information, try asking the people who actually make and sell these things, not the people who license the IP to them.
Alex Eames RasPi.TV, RasP.iO

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DougieLawson
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:40 am

ejolson wrote:Lots of successful tech companies produce product road maps including IBM, Intel and Oracle. Lack of a planned upgrade path can hurt sales of current hardware.
And, guess what, they don't publish any detailed plan, they release their detailed plans under a non-disclosure agreement. I've signed a couple of those for mainframe products with IBM this month. I'm not going to disclose anything I can't afford to get sued by IBM as they have big money and expensive lawyers. Everything in IBM that is remotely related to a new product or new version of an old product is marked as "Confidential until Announced".

IBM got its fingers burned with IMS V3.2 (early 1990s) which was late and quite simply the major new function didn't work on their announced general availability day. It was pulled and re-announced some time later as IMS V4.1 (once they got the code working). They also completely changed their announcement, early support testing process and product release methods to avoid publishing info about new products before they were ready based on the back of that debacle.

Their product road maps aren't worth the ones and zeros they're written with (or the paper they're printed on). Nobody gains from vapourware announcements.
Note: Any requirement to use a crystal ball or mind reading will result in me ignoring your question.

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CarlRJ
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:06 pm

jamesh wrote:... the RPF announces, right now, an Octocore 2GB device with SATA and gig ethernet, for sale in 1 years time, ...
Oh that's awesome! I'm totally going to sell all my current Pi's and wait for that one. It runs at 4GHz, right? Because that's what I need.*

To the original poster implying that customers are being treated with disrespect... I'd say, absolutely not. The RPF is a quite different animal than giant for-profit publicly-traded companies. The latter offer roadmaps because they want to hold their (potential) customer's attention, to make sure their product gets bought rather than someone else's (and as others have pointed out, major corporations regularly blow through their roadmaps - as an aside, there's one major corporation out there that doesn't give out any roadmaps, they just send out invites several times a year to an event to show off new fully-finished products; and it seems to work pretty well for them, I hear they're kind of successful). The RPF's stated goal in all this is to educate people; their contract with people is pretty simple: they make what they make, they announce new things when they are ready to make them, and they hope you find these products educational. There's no disrespect there, because advance notice isn't part of the deal. If you view them through the same lens you use for large commercial enterprises, you're doing it wrong.

*: (Yes, for the humor impaired, that was egregiously taken out of context.)

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davidcoton
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:34 pm

CarlRJ wrote:
jamesh wrote:... the RPF announces, right now, an Octocore 2GB device with SATA and gig ethernet, for sale in 1 years time, ...
Oh that's awesome! I'm totally going to sell all my current Pi's and wait for that one. It runs at 4GHz, right? Because that's what I need.
But it MUST have a pink unicorn. Even Barbie has one, how will the Pi sell to the relevant part of its target market without?
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stderr
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:09 pm

CarlRJ wrote:
jamesh wrote:... the RPF announces, right now, an Octocore 2GB device with SATA and gig ethernet, for sale in 1 years time, ...
Oh that's awesome! I'm totally going to sell all my current Pi's and wait for that one. It runs at 4GHz, right? Because that's what I need.*
I'm not sure this is that far from what is available today, currently 2GHz/2GB 4 core and gig ethernet. What I haven't seen is cheap and fast dual SATA. That would be good for attaching the hard drives, so even just one of them would be enough.
To the original poster implying that customers are being treated with disrespect... I'd say, absolutely not. The RPF is a quite different animal than giant for-profit publicly-traded companies.
Good grief, it's not just Airbus and Boeing and Intel and AMD that tell basically what they are going to try to do, it's a lot of private companies including ones that sell SBCs. I'm not talking about telling you what they will have five years from now, but telling you what they are planning to release in three months. It's done so their customers can plan. And to hype things.

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alexeames
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Sat Jul 30, 2016 6:52 am

stderr wrote:Good grief, it's not just Airbus and Boeing and Intel and AMD that tell basically what they are going to try to do, it's a lot of private companies including ones that sell SBCs. I'm not talking about telling you what they will have five years from now, but telling you what they are planning to release in three months. It's done so their customers can plan. And to hype things.
At the Pi3 launch event, Eben flagged up that there would be a CM3 and a new model A this year. On the Pi Podcast he mentioned that the A would have wifi. He also posted in a forum thread earlier this year about A+ availability.

So - yaknow - they are doing this, but you never get specific dates and specs because things change.
Alex Eames RasPi.TV, RasP.iO

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paddyg
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Sat Jul 30, 2016 8:41 am

What's the effect called when you do launch a new, unheralded item but then can't fulfil demand for several months?
The Zero Stock effect?
also https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en-GB&fromgroups=#!forum/pi3d

eupton
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Sun Jul 31, 2016 10:59 pm

I thought it might be worth sharing a few thoughts on A+ and B+ availability here.

When we launched Pi 2, demand for the B+ (and to a lesser extent the A+) fell dramatically, as expected. This is the first time we've ever had to manage a negative-going edge, but RS and Farnell had some stock of both products, and of 2835, at the transition point, and things went pretty well. What we've been struggling with over the last six months has been a rebound in demand from industrial customers, combined with long production lead times and bursty order flow.

The A+ stock-out that we're just coming out of was the result of a few large Far Eastern digital signage orders which wiped out global stocks over the course of a couple of weeks. The very high run rate of the $35 product tends to smooth these effects out (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_limit_theorem), but it's quite hard to pick a production rate for a low-volume (<500ku/year) product which can guarantee continuous availability for next-day delivery, without requiring RS and Farnell to take a lot of risk.

Where we're at now:
  • A+ has transitioned to 512MB of RAM.
  • A+ and B+ are in volume (20ku+/month) production at RS and Farnell.
  • Both distributors are shipping to backlog, so are not in stock for next-day delivery yet.
  • People who get orders in now will get theirs before people who wait for next-day delivery.
  • Some distributors (notably ModMyPi) have A+ stock.
In related news, "low-volume" now means <500ku/year. Get us :)

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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Sun Jul 31, 2016 11:21 pm

eupton wrote:I thought it might be worth sharing a few thoughts on A+ and B+ availability here.
(Details removed....anyone who wants them can go look.)

Thank you *very* much for that data. It fits with both the minor bits of data I've gleaned here and there and my own best guesses as to the root cause of most of the problems. No matter how you slice it, that's quite a tiger you guys are riding. Who would have thought, 5 years ago, that "500ku/yr" would be considered "low volume" for Pis?

This suggests that my A+512MB order (placed on launch day, 19 April) will be along once once the boards filter down to MCM. Quite possibly rather before their current expected data in mid-November.

eupton
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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Sun Jul 31, 2016 11:27 pm

W. H. Heydt wrote:This suggests that my A+512MB order (placed on launch day, 19 April) will be along once once the boards filter down to MCM. Quite possibly rather before their current expected data in mid-November.
That would be my hope. They really are building quite a lot of units.

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Re: Information and Customer Respect

Mon Aug 01, 2016 5:50 am

Thanks for the explanation Eben.

I'm quite happy to wait for the B+ to be in stock again, as I have a small project in mind that will require at least four of them (and 16 or more Pi Zeroes).

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