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CaptSunset
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A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 6:48 pm

I was just upgrading Jessie when an unusual message appeared on my 1080p Visio 'Smart' TV.
At first, I couldn't figure where it was coming from, but then realized it was from the TV itself.

Now, it has never been given the password to my router, as it's only meant to be a large field monitor; and it has never been directly connected to anything but a Pi.

The message said that I needed to go into Settings on the Visio if I wanted to turn off its default mode, which is reporting its activity back onto web.

The particular Pi is connected to the router via a Cat5 network cable, and via HDMI from the Pi to the Visio.

When I looked at the Visio's settings, it was clear it knew the ID name of my router and perhaps the wifi password; and had found this out by 'reaching thru' the Pi, regardless of the Pi's own password . (Hope I'm explaining this clearly.)

I am not that up on firewall stuff, but this seems insecure to say the least.

How would I require the TV itself to ask permission before sending any data beyond the Pi?

Thanks in advance!

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Dis93
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Location: Wuthering, Yorkshire

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 6:57 pm

'Smart' tvs are evul.
Lock it down.

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jojopi
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Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 7:01 pm

What is the exact model of the Vizio?

I think you will find it has built-in WiFi, and is using that to connect to your router.

stderr
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Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:29 pm

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 7:13 pm

CaptSunset wrote:Now, it has never been given the password to my router, as it's only meant to be a large field monitor; and it has never been directly connected to anything but a Pi.
How would I require the TV itself to ask permission before sending any data beyond the Pi?
The following, which I found on their website, strongly suggests that their TVs include wifi support, see infra quote. I'm sceptical that if you didn't give your password to the TV, or someone else didn't, that it could hack you and figure it out. Of course it could be connected via *any* other open connection that its wifi can reach. Perhaps you are being sold out by a local Starbucks or Home Depot. Even if not, nothing is stopping the TV maker from putting in a 4G mobile connection so that it's always connected to *their* network, no password from you ever needed. Now you know one of the reasons why I have two tube TVs.

http://vizhdtv.com/5-simple-steps-what- ... -internet/
#
The first thing you want to do is verify that the TV is actually connected to your WiFi network. Does this page say it’s connected to your Wi-Fi network. If it doesn’t then the TV isn’t connected to the network yet. Go back to the network settings page, highlight your Wi-Fi network name, then press the OK button. You might have to type your Wi-Fi password again.
#
Last edited by stderr on Wed May 04, 2016 7:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

linux_author
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Location: Gulf of Mexico
Contact: Website

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 7:13 pm

despite living in the exact geographic center of the most densely populated county in our state, we live in a digital ghetto... no fiber optic, crumbling cable TV infrastructure, and being 18,000 feet from the phone company's central office, pitiful DSL service:

900kbps down/400kbps up

try living with that! every single kbps is precious bandwidth to us, we make it work... but here's the point of this rant:

I INTENSELY DISLIKE 'NET-CONNECTED DEVICES THAT CONNECT TO THE 'NET WITHOUT YOUR PERMISSION!

THIS MEANS YOU, APPLE AND VISIO!!! YOU STEAL AND HOG BANDWIDTH WITHOUT OWNER PERMISSION!!!

bought two AppleTVs to provide in-house streaming of music/video, but despite my setting the devices to 'not phone home,' they did - continually; the same thing with two Visio TVs - a 50" and a 26" - oh, and there's no way to turn off the network access in the Visios once configured!

so i took a sledgehammer to the AppleTVs and blocked my Visio TVs MAC addresses in our router...

you may then ask, "Why, willie, did you destroy the AppleTVs? All you had to do was block them in your router!" WRONG! the AppleTVs WON'T WORK WITHOUT INTERNET ACCESS!!!!

ackpht!

willie
on the "i'll get even with evil devices" Gulf of Mexico

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CaptSunset
Posts: 140
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Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 7:28 pm

OK, some extra info- it is a new Pi3B that has never been used in wifi mode, or yet given the wifi password.
The TV is a 24" Visio E241i-B1; I didn't want a Smart TV, but it was a refurb practically for pocket change.
I don't want to trust the TV itself to stay silent, especially as the default mode is on.

blaablaaguy
Posts: 623
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2015 3:26 pm

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 7:48 pm

linux_author wrote:despite living in the exact geographic center of the most densely populated county in our state, we live in a digital ghetto... no fiber optic, crumbling cable TV infrastructure, and being 18,000 feet from the phone company's central office, pitiful DSL service:

900kbps down/400kbps up

try living with that! every single kbps is precious bandwidth to us, we make it work... but here's the point of this rant:

I INTENSELY DISLIKE 'NET-CONNECTED DEVICES THAT CONNECT TO THE 'NET WITHOUT YOUR PERMISSION!

THIS MEANS YOU, APPLE AND VISIO!!! YOU STEAL AND HOG BANDWIDTH WITHOUT OWNER PERMISSION!!!

bought two AppleTVs to provide in-house streaming of music/video, but despite my setting the devices to 'not phone home,' they did - continually; the same thing with two Visio TVs - a 50" and a 26" - oh, and there's no way to turn off the network access in the Visios once configured!

so i took a sledgehammer to the AppleTVs and blocked my Visio TVs MAC addresses in our router...

you may then ask, "Why, willie, did you destroy the AppleTVs? All you had to do was block them in your router!" WRONG! the AppleTVs WON'T WORK WITHOUT INTERNET ACCESS!!!!

ackpht!

willie
on the "i'll get even with evil devices" Gulf of Mexico
YEAH!!!! SMASH THE APPLES!
This signature intentionally left blank.

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Jednorozec
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Location: Deposit, NY

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 7:56 pm

All TVs are evil, not just the smart ones.
The most important leg of a three legged stool is the one that's missing.
It's called thinking. Why don't you try it sometime?

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Dis93
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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2016 8:30 pm
Location: Wuthering, Yorkshire

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Wed May 04, 2016 7:57 pm

Jednorozec wrote:All TVs are evil, not just the smart ones.
+1



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CaptSunset
Posts: 140
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:55 pm

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Thu May 05, 2016 1:26 am

Jednorozec wrote:All TVs are evil, not just the smart ones.
Commercial TV is an institutionalized electronic narcotic.

stderr
Posts: 2178
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:29 pm

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Thu May 05, 2016 1:40 am

CaptSunset wrote:Commercial TV is an institutionalized electronic narcotic.
So you're all Antiques Roadshow all the time?

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Douglas6
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Location: Chicago, IL

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Thu May 05, 2016 2:26 am

Hey! I like Antiques Roadshow.

Pithagoros
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Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Thu May 05, 2016 5:18 am

Like most WiFi devices, a TV can see all the broadcast SSIDs in range. Some WiFI devices will offer a connection, but none of them will be able to connect and use the WiFi to get to the internet via your router without a password/key, if your WiFi router is properly set up.
Though if you plug an ethernet cable in then it might well phone home without asking.

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Cancelor
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Location: UK

Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Thu May 05, 2016 5:33 am

I wonder if HDMI Ethernet Channel functionality is the cause? See http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_1_4/hec.aspx
''Allows multiple connected devices to share an Internet connection.''

''Provides a true one-cable solution for all your home entertainment needs, offering HDMI’s world-class quality and reliability plus all the benefits of home entertainment networking in one powerful connection.''
Can't find the thread you want? Try googling : YourSearchHere site:raspberrypi.org

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Paul Webster
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Re: A Security Concern regarding Smart TVs

Thu May 05, 2016 5:53 am

RPi HDMI does not support Ethernet via HDMI (HDMI 1.4 optional feature) [unless there has been a secret change].

To OP - when you say that the TV knew your router ID can you explain what you meant by "ID"?
e.g. Is this the WiFi SSID? If yes then this is to be expected since your WiFi router is broadcasting the ID - but that does not mean that it can be connected to.

Check the TV settings to see if it has an IP address.

It might just be that it popped up the warning because of a timer or because it was recently powered on but was not smart enough to realise that it was not connected to Internet.

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