Should the raspberry pi Include wifi and blue tooth

Yes
24%
15
Only WIFI
26%
16
Only Bluetooth
No votes
0
No
35%
22
Doesn't matter
15%
9
 
Total votes: 62
trip3980
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:29 am

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Sun Dec 06, 2015 6:07 pm

[/quote]

Yes, but if you are so passionate about you RPi0 with WiFi and Bluetooth when are you off to Element14 to have 3,000 manufactured, because you have so far blown hot air and more hot air without a single piece of substance, I have seen better debates from Secondary School Children :? :?[/quote]

I may not be well spoken but I know what I am talking about and more then you may know.

fruitoftheloom
Posts: 23005
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:40 pm
Location: Delightful Dorset

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Sun Dec 06, 2015 6:17 pm

trip3980 wrote:
Yes, but if you are so passionate about you RPi0 with WiFi and Bluetooth when are you off to Element14 to have 3,000 manufactured, because you have so far blown hot air and more hot air without a single piece of substance, I have seen better debates from Secondary School Children :? :?[/quote]

I may not be well spoken but I know what I am talking about and more then you may know.[/quote]
WHATEVER
Rather than negativity think outside the box !
RPi 4B 4GB (SSD Boot)..
Asus ChromeBox 3 Celeron is my other computer...

ame
Posts: 3172
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2012 1:21 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Sun Dec 06, 2015 11:43 pm

fruitoftheloom wrote: Yes, but if you are so passionate about you RPi0 with WiFi and Bluetooth when are you off to Element14 to have 3,000 manufactured, because you have so far blown hot air and more hot air without a single piece of substance, I have seen better debates from Secondary School Children :? :?
trip3980 wrote: I may not be well spoken but I know what I am talking about and more then you may know.
WHATEVER
Did someone say "children"?

User avatar
expandables
Posts: 654
Joined: Fri Jun 27, 2014 7:34 pm
Location: Neverland with Michael Jackson

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Mon Dec 07, 2015 1:30 am

I think the new Raspberry PI 3D (whenever it comes out) should have a real time clock and build in WIFI.
:twisted:
By thinking like an engineer you can create a raspberry pi.
Michael Jackson enthusiast.
I got the PI model B, B+ and PI 2 model B.
When will I get the A? I don't know.

BMS Doug
Posts: 3824
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:42 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Mon Dec 07, 2015 1:55 pm

expandables wrote:I think the new Raspberry PI 3D (whenever it comes out) should have a real time clock and build in WIFI.
:twisted:
Not to mention Gigabyte Ethernet, USB3, a Kettle, a Kitchen Sink and a Pony!
Doug.
Building Management Systems Engineer.

ame
Posts: 3172
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2012 1:21 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Mon Dec 07, 2015 2:02 pm

BMS Doug wrote:
expandables wrote:I think the new Raspberry PI 3D (whenever it comes out) should have a real time clock and build in WIFI.
:twisted:
Not to mention Gigabyte Ethernet, USB3, a Kettle, a Kitchen Sink and a Pony!
You know, I'm willing to forgo the pony if I could get an actual Pi Zero.

fruitoftheloom
Posts: 23005
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:40 pm
Location: Delightful Dorset

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Mon Dec 07, 2015 2:11 pm

ame wrote:
BMS Doug wrote:
expandables wrote:I think the new Raspberry PI 3D (whenever it comes out) should have a real time clock and build in WIFI.
:twisted:
Not to mention Gigabyte Ethernet, USB3, a Kettle, a Kitchen Sink and a Pony!
You know, I'm willing to forgo the pony if I could get an actual Pi Zero.
..is that with WiFi & BT at $5.00 ?
Rather than negativity think outside the box !
RPi 4B 4GB (SSD Boot)..
Asus ChromeBox 3 Celeron is my other computer...

BMS Doug
Posts: 3824
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:42 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Mon Dec 07, 2015 2:17 pm

ame wrote:
BMS Doug wrote:
expandables wrote:I think the new Raspberry PI 3D (whenever it comes out) should have a real time clock and build in WIFI.
:twisted:
Not to mention Gigabyte Ethernet, USB3, a Kettle, a Kitchen Sink and a Pony!
You know, I'm willing to forgo the pony if I could get an actual Pi Zero.
Yes, I know that feeling, I would be quite happy to buy at least 10 Pi Zero's (without any modification, just the board as released) whenever they are available.

I would regret passing along the ones I had but I know they all went to good homes, as will the replacements (when i get some).
Doug.
Building Management Systems Engineer.

User avatar
davidcoton
Posts: 4868
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 2:37 pm
Location: Cambridge, UK
Contact: Website

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:28 pm

ame wrote:
BMS Doug wrote:
expandables wrote:I think the new Raspberry PI 3D (whenever it comes out) should have a real time clock and build in WIFI.
:twisted:
Not to mention Gigabyte Ethernet, USB3, a Kettle, a Kitchen Sink and a Pony!
You know, I'm willing to forgo the pony if I could get an actual Pi Zero.
Oh no, the Pony is essential. I work in different places, so how is my Pi0 going to get the kettle to me in time for a coffee break without a Pony to carry it?

It will also need builtin GPS and a Pony Control Interface (PCI). Please don't suggest it can catch a bus -- they run too infrequently through the village. :ugeek:
Signature retired

User avatar
Jim Manley
Posts: 1600
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:41 pm
Location: SillyCon Valley, California, and Powell, Wyoming, USA, plus The Universe
Contact: Website

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:34 am

trip3980: You've only been here in the forum going all the way back to 30 November 2015, which is a lifetime when you're waiting for a Pi Zero to become available to buy :). Your approach is totally appropriate for a capital-backed venture that can afford to burn Other People's Money with nothing to show for it should something go wrong, and as an engineer, I can guarantee you that _everything_, every little picayune thing, _can_ not only go wrong, sooner or later, it _will_.

The Foundation is a charity, a non-profit organization whose sole goal is to improve educational computing, that's it. If your needs happen to coincide with their educational mission, so much the better, but they're under no obligation to cater to your whims. Its goal is not to satisfy the general market with doodads that some people say they want, but when it comes to reality, they can't understand just how much work it takes to do the really thorny engineering needed to get even something seemingly as simple as a Pi Zero produced. It has to be designed, prototyped, debugged (it wasn't just a matter of tossing out components, believe me), reimplemented, debugged again, fixed some more, tested, made less buggy some more, put into pre-production, RF compliance tested (not at all a small effort or cost when it comes to active RF transceivers - especially multiple ones), have more bugs stomped on, final-tested, the assembly line designed/debugged/documented for both manufacturing and testing, go into limited series production, assembly and testing tweaked, manufactured in initial quantity limited by funds in the bank or donated by principals (board members), and distributed.

None of these steps comes without risk, and some have been done on a volunteer basis by engineers (I don't know if that's still partly or completely true, but I wouldn't doubt it for a second in getting the Zero to $5.00). If anything went wrong, you instantly have thousands of paperweights (albeit, in the case of the Zero, not even much good for that!). No more money, no more charity, no more educational benefit - poof. All so you could have your "sure thing" WiFi and Bluetooth. Sorry, but I prefer a world where they Foundation continues in a healthy existence.

The Foundation has been wringing every last iota out of the BCM-2835/6 and related components, to the point of wringing most of the components out, too, in the case of the Zero! They hitched their wagon to a convenient device already fully amortized and then some, and created a wholly-unexpected new market for it that's larger than the commercial product for which it was originally designed, AIUI. They have to bide their time until another device comes along that has any more desirable features at an equivalent cost, and then they have to be able to buy it, in quantity.

As others have pointed out more than sufficiently, you're welcome to pay to have at least three thousand of what you want built with whatever you want ... as long as you're willing to pay all of those development costs mentioned above. Ah, I see, that's not your area of expertise after all ... that's been pretty much the case for marketing experts who have come here to share their certain knowledge of how the Pii really ought to be developed ... without any of the hard engineering work necessary to do so.
The best things in life aren't things ... but, a Pi comes pretty darned close! :D
"Education is not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire." -- W.B. Yeats
In theory, theory & practice are the same - in practice, they aren't!!!

User avatar
rpdom
Posts: 16964
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 5:17 am
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UK

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Tue Dec 08, 2015 6:37 am

Jim Manley wrote:The Foundation is a charity, a non-profit organization whose sole main goal is to improve educational computing,
FTFY ;)

solyaris
Posts: 77
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:03 am
Location: Genova, Italy
Contact: Website

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Sat Dec 12, 2015 5:35 pm

I voted for just WIFI, see also: viewtopic.php?f=44&t=128806&p=860965#p860965

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 26355
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:33 pm

Really not quite sure what this thread is all about, but will insist that people keep it polite - don't attack the poster, attack the argument.

My input.

Wifi/BT would be great on a Pi, but it's a cost thing. Right now, it's not possible to add that to the Pi without increasing cost. That is a known fact. It not something that can be designed around. The component costs simply make it impossible This may change over time as component costs reduce.

The Zero was built DOWN to a price. Wifi/BT/ethernet was never going to make it on to a board that costs $5 (to the end user). It also why it is a 2835 not a 2836.

Other Pi devices have varying levels of connectivity and CPU power - this is reflecting the the price of each device. As connectivity goes up, so does the price - it's costs money to add that stuff, both in component cost, PCB cost, and design cost.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed.
I've been saying "Mucho" to my Spanish friend a lot more lately. It means a lot to him.

fruitoftheloom
Posts: 23005
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:40 pm
Location: Delightful Dorset

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:47 pm

53 votes out of how many Zero Users ?

Obviously not important features for the majority.. :shock:
Rather than negativity think outside the box !
RPi 4B 4GB (SSD Boot)..
Asus ChromeBox 3 Celeron is my other computer...

User avatar
Jim Manley
Posts: 1600
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:41 pm
Location: SillyCon Valley, California, and Powell, Wyoming, USA, plus The Universe
Contact: Website

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Sun Dec 13, 2015 6:06 pm

rpdom wrote:
Jim Manley wrote:The Foundation is a charity, a non-profit organization whose sole main goal is to improve educational computing,
FTFY ;)
Apparently, the Foundation disagrees with you in their charter:
http://apps.charitycommission.gov.uk/Sh ... er=1129409
THE OBJECT OF THE CHARITY IS TO FURTHER THE ADVANCEMENT OF EDUCATION OF ADULTS AND CHILDREN, PARTICULARLY IN THE FIELD OF COMPUTERS, COMPUTER SCIENCE AND RELATED SUBJECTS
Capitali(z/s)ation is per the website, but it helps make the point. FTBJFY (fixed that back just for _you_)! :lol:
The best things in life aren't things ... but, a Pi comes pretty darned close! :D
"Education is not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire." -- W.B. Yeats
In theory, theory & practice are the same - in practice, they aren't!!!

fruitoftheloom
Posts: 23005
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:40 pm
Location: Delightful Dorset

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Sun Dec 13, 2015 6:38 pm

Jim Manley wrote:
rpdom wrote:
Jim Manley wrote:The Foundation is a charity, a non-profit organization whose sole main goal is to improve educational computing,
FTFY ;)
Apparently, the Foundation disagrees with you in their charter:
http://apps.charitycommission.gov.uk/Sh ... er=1129409
THE OBJECT OF THE CHARITY IS TO FURTHER THE ADVANCEMENT OF EDUCATION OF ADULTS AND CHILDREN, PARTICULARLY IN THE FIELD OF COMPUTERS, COMPUTER SCIENCE AND RELATED SUBJECTS
Capitali(z/s)ation is per the website, but it helps make the point. FTBJFY (fixed that back just for _you_)! :lol:
Yes quite, so having WiFi, BT (and as someone else in another post want eMMMC) built in to a RPi0 advance reaching that goal Original Poster ?

If all that was added to a RPi it would become another Tablet / Phablet / Laptop / Chromebook alternative, would it not ?????????
Rather than negativity think outside the box !
RPi 4B 4GB (SSD Boot)..
Asus ChromeBox 3 Celeron is my other computer...

Pithagoros
Posts: 578
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:16 pm

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Mon Dec 14, 2015 10:02 am

[quote="jamesh"]
My input.

Wifi/BT would be great on a Pi, but it's a cost thing. Right now, it's not possible to add that to the Pi without increasing cost. That is a known fact. It not something that can be designed around. The component costs simply make it impossible [/quote

That all makes perfect sense. But how much extra is a few copper cb tracks to create a hardware interface?
Design the WiFi/BT in, but leave the components off. Then sell the extra components as an add on board, or allow 3rd parties to create and sell the add ons.

OK, so that is technically possible already with the board as it is of course, but it could be made more integral and straightforward.

Or you could leave those tasks up to the end user in order to encourage them to do and learn.

BMS Doug
Posts: 3824
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:42 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: raspberrypi zero + wifi and Bluetooth

Mon Dec 14, 2015 10:21 am

Pithagoros wrote:
jamesh wrote: My input.

Wifi/BT would be great on a Pi, but it's a cost thing. Right now, it's not possible to add that to the Pi without increasing cost. That is a known fact. It not something that can be designed around. The component costs simply make it impossible
That all makes perfect sense. But how much extra is a few copper cb tracks to create a hardware interface?
Design the WiFi/BT in, but leave the components off. Then sell the extra components as an add on board, or allow 3rd parties to create and sell the add ons.

OK, so that is technically possible already with the board as it is of course, but it could be made more integral and straightforward.

Or you could leave those tasks up to the end user in order to encourage them to do and learn.
What sort of hardware interface?

It can't be USB as there is only one USB input on the SOC, to add extra USB requires adding a USB hub (the B+ and 2 do this with a LAN9514 combined ethernet and USB hub, the B used a LAN9512 (some late model B's had LAN9514 chips)).

How about using SPI, I2C or UART? There are convenient connection points for these interfaces at the edge of the board.
There is also a convenient USB port, to which you could connect the USB device of your choice, or a Hub as you wish.
Doug.
Building Management Systems Engineer.

Return to “General discussion”