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Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 8:17 am
by fruitoftheloom
""After Raspberry Pi, Waxberry Pi, and Banana Pi boards, here come another fruit-named board with Orange Pi. There are actually three models, with Orange Pi and Orange Pi mini based on Allwinner A20, and Orange Pi Plus powered by a quad core Allwinner A31s processor.""

http://www.cnx-software.com/2014/12/22/orange-pi-board

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 9:14 am
by jamesh
Whilst I have no problem with people making boards like this - the more the merrier, what really gets my goat is the continual copying of the Raspberry Pi name format. There is some recourse to trademark infringement, but that's like playing whack-a-mole, but wouldn't it be nice if these producers could think up their own names rather than relying on the Raspberry Pi goodwill?

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 9:36 am
by fruitoftheloom
jamesh wrote:Whilst I have no problem with people making boards like this - the more the merrier, what really gets my goat is the continual copying of the Raspberry Pi name format. There is some recourse to trademark infringement, but that's like playing whack-a-mole, but wouldn't it be nice if these producers could think up their own names rather than relying on the Raspberry Pi goodwill?
These Chinese Manufacturers will in a few years be a distant memory.

They are just churning out products a cheap as possible, no long term goals

Yes Copyright is a fraught game to play but as proved over the last 3 years the original is still the best.

Nice to have choice but even better to have community support, I take community support as first priority every time ;)

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 10:20 am
by jamesh
fruitoftheloom wrote:
jamesh wrote:Whilst I have no problem with people making boards like this - the more the merrier, what really gets my goat is the continual copying of the Raspberry Pi name format. There is some recourse to trademark infringement, but that's like playing whack-a-mole, but wouldn't it be nice if these producers could think up their own names rather than relying on the Raspberry Pi goodwill?
These Chinese Manufacturers will in a few years be a distant memory.

They are just churning out products a cheap as possible, no long term goals

Yes Copyright is a fraught game to play but as proved over the last 3 years the original is still the best.

Nice to have choice but even better to have community support, I take community support as first priority every time ;)
Me too. I guess that why they try these similar names - to hang on the coat tails to get some level of support which would otherwise be likely non-existent.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 10:34 am
by drgeoff
Will anyone dare to try 'Apple Pi'? :)

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 10:42 am
by DougieLawson
drgeoff wrote:Will anyone dare to try 'Apple Pi'? :)
The Chinese will, they don't even pay lip-service to copyrights, patents and trademarks.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 12:47 pm
by gkreidl
What the hell is an "open-source" computer?
It’s an open-source single-board computer.
(from orangepi.org)

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 12:52 pm
by jamesh
gkreidl wrote:What the hell is an "open-source" computer?
It’s an open-source single-board computer.
(from orangepi.org)
A waste of time to the huge majority of people.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 6:03 pm
by W. H. Heydt
If a test to see if these work at all adequately...it's someone elses turn.

Just from what is in this thread so far, these sound more like clones of the Cubieboards than clones of the Pi. While Raspbian may well run on them, the firmware blob will not. (A10 and A20 use the Mali 400 GPU. I'd have to look up the A31 to find out what it uses.)

Edit to add...

Definitely looks like a variant on the Cubieboard. Essentially identical specs to the Cubieboard 2, so Raspbian should run without problems, once one finds a bootloader that works with the board and can load Raspbian. (Berryboot might well do the trick.) The two wierdnesses I see are (1) the middle range board includes a VGA connector, and (2) the top board use an A31s rather than an A31. The difference is the difference between doing H.264 decode at 30fps vs. 60fps.

Have to admit that the prices look pretty good, though, at least on the two lower boards. The Odroid-C1 will give the top board a run for it's money, having similar specs for half the price. The main feature resolver between those two is that the Orange has a SATA port.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 6:47 am
by Jessie
The a31has a power VR sgx 544. I think. The sata port peaks my interest but I would have to see some numbers before I put down for one.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 7:59 am
by fruitoftheloom
Jessie wrote:The a31has a power VR sgx 544. I think. The sata port peaks my interest but I would have to see some numbers before I put down for one.
Regards SATA ports I have noticed on some devices they use USB-SATA Chips when the SoC does not natively support SATA.

Another Caveat Emptor..... ;)

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 6:25 pm
by W. H. Heydt
fruitoftheloom wrote:
Jessie wrote:The a31has a power VR sgx 544. I think. The sata port peaks my interest but I would have to see some numbers before I put down for one.
Regards SATA ports I have noticed on some devices they use USB-SATA Chips when the SoC does not natively support SATA.

Another Caveat Emptor..... ;)
The SATA connection on the Cubieboard (both 1--A10--and 2--A20) works in practice. It certainly acts like it's a native interface, though someone who wants to dig out the actual datasheets on the chips would have a better idea.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 6:30 pm
by W. H. Heydt
Jessie wrote:The a31has a power VR sgx 544. I think. The sata port peaks my interest but I would have to see some numbers before I put down for one.
According to Wikipedia, the chip be used in this device, the A31s, is rather less capable with regards to GPU than the A31. Got to watch the fine print. The table in the article on Allwinner says that the A31 will do H.264 1080p decoding at 60fps, where the A31s will only do that at 30fps.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 7:45 pm
by fruitoftheloom
That is the issues with these "RPi lookalikes" the manufacturers are more interested in selling then giving the full story of what one is buying ;)

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 7:51 pm
by jamesh
I hadn't heard of the Armv5, but it's a bit slower than the A7 at the same clockspeed, so not a lot faster than the Arm11 in the Pi, but of course there are 4 of them as well which clearly helps.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 5:58 am
by Jessie
W. H. Heydt wrote:
Jessie wrote:The a31has a power VR sgx 544. I think. The sata port peaks my interest but I would have to see some numbers before I put down for one.
According to Wikipedia, the chip be used in this device, the A31s, is rather less capable with regards to GPU than the A31. Got to watch the fine print. The table in the article on Allwinner says that the A31 will do H.264 1080p decoding at 60fps, where the A31s will only do that at 30fps.
To me the video decode block and the GPU are not the same. So I guess I need to dig up the specs. And I'm assuming that you ment one of those to be the a30.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 6:57 am
by W. H. Heydt
Jessie wrote:
W. H. Heydt wrote:
Jessie wrote:The a31has a power VR sgx 544. I think. The sata port peaks my interest but I would have to see some numbers before I put down for one.
According to Wikipedia, the chip be used in this device, the A31s, is rather less capable with regards to GPU than the A31. Got to watch the fine print. The table in the article on Allwinner says that the A31 will do H.264 1080p decoding at 60fps, where the A31s will only do that at 30fps.
To me the video decode block and the GPU are not the same. So I guess I need to dig up the specs. And I'm assuming that you ment one of those to be the a30.
No, actually, I didn't. I was going by the table in this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allwinner_Technology article. It doesn't show an A30. In the A3x family they have the A31, A31s, and A33. (As this is not controversial material, Wikipedia has a decent chance to be correct.)

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Thu Dec 25, 2014 7:10 pm
by ric96
why do other raspi Ripoffs look so over complicated
for ex.
1) like on the raspi ram is insside the soc and on others its outside.

2) no nand makes a lot of difference in terms of simplicity and reduces bricking

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Thu Dec 25, 2014 7:26 pm
by DirkS
1) like on the raspi ram is insside the soc and on others its outside.
No. the RAM sits on top of the soc (Package On Package'). http://www.raspberrypi.org/help/faqs/#performanceMemory
AIUI the choice in these is limited.

Gr.
Dirk.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Thu Dec 25, 2014 7:45 pm
by ric96
DirkS wrote:
1) like on the raspi ram is insside the soc and on others its outside.
No. the RAM sits on top of the soc (Package On Package'). http://www.raspberrypi.org/help/faqs/#performanceMemory
AIUI the choice in these is limited.

Gr.
Dirk.
what I meant was within the same physical chip that is soldered on to the PCB. other boards have a couple of separate ram chip.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Thu Dec 25, 2014 10:48 pm
by W. H. Heydt
ric96 wrote:
DirkS wrote:
1) like on the raspi ram is insside the soc and on others its outside.
No. the RAM sits on top of the soc (Package On Package'). http://www.raspberrypi.org/help/faqs/#performanceMemory
AIUI the choice in these is limited.

Gr.
Dirk.
what I meant was within the same physical chip that is soldered on to the PCB. other boards have a couple of separate ram chip.
Probably depends on what they're sourcing and what it costs. Once the board gets down to the size of a Model B--not to mention the Model A+--there isn't a whole lot of room for memory that isn't PoP, especially if they're going to include the CSI/DSI connectors. And if they include on-board flash (aka NAND) storage, that's going to eat into the available space.

As for the on-board flash... Not sure about the choices there. On the RPF Compute Module, it's probably to make the board suitable for industrial/embedded use where a removable SD card is neither desireable nor--in many cases--practical. On the Cubieboards, the flash comes loaded with Android, though it can be reflashed to hold Linux. So far as I know, loading flash memory with Android is fairly common, which suggests what "development" boards are meant for developing.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Fri Dec 26, 2014 4:20 pm
by mrpi64
jamesh wrote:
gkreidl wrote:What the hell is an "open-source" computer?
It’s an open-source single-board computer.
(from orangepi.org)
A waste of time to the huge majority of people.
Open-source is where you spend hours trawling the internet to find the source-code for something, find out it's not there, download something that seems to be the right thing but turns out not to work on anything except x86.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Fri Dec 26, 2014 4:45 pm
by gkreidl
mrpi64 wrote: Open-source is where you spend hours trawling the internet to find the source-code for something, find out it's not there, download something that seems to be the right thing but turns out not to work on anything except x86.
That's nonsene. 99 % of what you are using on the RPi or any other linux system is open source software.

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Fri Dec 26, 2014 5:23 pm
by Joe Schmoe
That's nonsene.
It's not nonsense if you just download binaries. The fact is that most of the "source" out there is not really compilable by most people.

In a sense, open-source is just an illusion.

P.S. Note that I said "most people". Don't bother writing in and telling me that *YOU* can compile it. That doesn't touch the assertion about "most people".

Re: Orange Pi Development Boards

Posted: Fri Dec 26, 2014 5:32 pm
by shuckle
Most opensource products are compiled with command like
make
And installed like
sudo make install

Surely this cannot be too difficult for average users. There are exceptions of course.