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theoB610
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Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Thu Jun 13, 2013 11:34 am

Hi all
As off topic goes this is pretty out there. I thought I'd post it here cos it's a good community.
It's just an idea that I'd like viewpoints on.

So nowadays lots of people are making software, adapting software, writing programs, and publishing it on the web as free. Maybe one of the reasons why kids like me do not get into coding is that there does not seem to be any attractive profits involved.
Big data is also becoming more of a thing, with companies accessing all of the data about us. There was an article on the BBC (I think) about this guy who thinks that we should charge for all the data that people use about us, just small amounts like a few pence.

So just now I combined these ideas and what do you get?
A Software Market, in a way similar to kickstarter. People publish their programs to the market and every time people download it/think it's worthwhile the author gets a small amount of money. Maybe it should work in a similar way to kickstarter's pledge system- you could post it first to see how much support/pledges it gathers then do some work on the program and publish it, people paying £1 or something, optionally more, for each download. The idea is that people will input to the community in writing their programs but also draw from the community in downloading and paying a small amount for each download.
I guess it would have to be big to be worthwhile.


Any thoughts? Is this a good idea? How much scope do you think there is for it?

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morphy_richards
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:26 pm

Sounds exactly like an app store?

OtherCrashOverride
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Thu Jun 13, 2013 3:17 pm

theoB610 wrote:So nowadays lots of people are making software, adapting software, writing programs, and publishing it on the web as free.
The RPi is proof you can not just take a bunch of 'free' software and throw it on a device and have it all work. This is the reason software engineers will always be required. There are lots of people making lots of money in software still (even from 'free' software).
theoB610 wrote:Maybe one of the reasons why kids like me do not get into coding is that there does not seem to be any attractive profits involved.
In my opinion the software industry does not need any more that are in it 'just for the money'. It needs talented, enthusiastic, creative individuals with a passion for it who want more at the end of the day than just collecting a pay check and going home.
theoB610 wrote:The idea is that people will input to the community in writing their programs
Design by committee is very difficult to implement effectively.
theoB610 wrote:Any thoughts? Is this a good idea? How much scope do you think there is for it?
I think the current kickstarter model works well. Although they claim otherwise, it effectively amounts to pre-sales of your product. You get customer feedback early in the process, you get starting capitol, and if done correctly it will prevent you from creating a flop of a product. The dark side of this is that it has the same implications for software that genetic engineering has for people. Sometimes its the less desirable product that contributes something important.

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meltwater
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Thu Jun 13, 2013 3:22 pm

morphy_richards wrote:Sounds exactly like an app store?
Very much like the PiStore...
http://store.raspberrypi.com/projects
theoB610 wrote:
Maybe one of the reasons why kids like me do not get into coding is that there does not seem to be any attractive profits involved
This is something Eben has mentioned in his talks, hence the PiStore. For developing stuff now. Obviously the profits later in life are easier to imagine.
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johnbeetem
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:44 pm

theoB610 wrote:Maybe one of the reasons why kids like me do not get into coding is that there does not seem to be any attractive profits involved.
IMO if you want to make lots of money, I suggest going into something financial. The best programmers do it because the love the challenge and the thrill of seeing something working that they designed and worked hard to complete. If the result is artistically beautiful, its even more satisfying. Getting paid well to do it is of secondary importance.

JMO/YMMV

gritz
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Fri Jun 14, 2013 7:29 pm

johnbeetem wrote:
theoB610 wrote:Maybe one of the reasons why kids like me do not get into coding is that there does not seem to be any attractive profits involved.
IMO if you want to make lots of money, I suggest going into something financial. The best programmers do it because the love the challenge and the thrill of seeing something working that they designed and worked hard to complete. If the result is artistically beautiful, its even more satisfying. Getting paid well to do it is of secondary importance.

JMO/YMMV
If I wish to get a leaky roof or a broken bone fixed, or source a performance part for my dirtbike then I'd probably steer clear of enthusiastic amateurs. Are you seriously suggesting that young people who wish to "get a trade" or work in healthcare or engineering, etc. instead go to work for a bank or insurance company?

My personal politics are probably somewhere to the left of Che Guevara, but even I have to concede that capitalism isn't going anywhere. Skill, experience and qualifications cost money. Perhaps the reason that computing is still in the dark ages has something to do with the fact that so much computing infrastructure is cobbled together by people in their spare time, or by big corporations as a cover for spamming and hoovering personal data - because consumers have an aversion to paying for the software that they use. :lol:

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meltwater
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:04 am

Is it the lack of pay or the lack of available skills or both?
Either way, the market is in need of skilled programmers and cutting your teeth on selling software is an excellent start. I've no idea how much the programming superstars who wrote games sold on tapes, got from selling their software in the 80's (once all the additional costs had been removed), but the costs above the time spent are now minimal and the market much larger so it is worth doing.

If you are writing software professionally then you have to do it for the money, is there big money in it? I think if you are good then yes, there is always somewhere which needs the skills and they will pay for it...is it easy? No, you have to keep learning, keep re-training and work hard to be good at what you do, and for that you will need a passion for it. The days of working on the same 20 or 40 year old systems are going, often software is the last reason why they are still in use and quite often hold back the use of far superior hardware and techniques, as justifying the cost of software (time) is a hard choice for companies.
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DaveDriesen
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Mon Jun 17, 2013 2:30 pm

Wrt the superstars who wrote games on tapes back in the old days.. Not many people got rich off of it, many of our idols of old are now forgotten. And even back then, the industry was not to be underestimated. This is not getting better. In fact, I would say it is getting less and less worth doing.

If you see yourself releasing quality titles, you have years and years of work ahead of you, with many people and in a dog-eat-dog environment.

What seem to be good starter platforms such as handheld consoles, suffer greatly from piracy and as such do not deliver big $$$.

I think it's a cool initiative but beware.. There is a saying.. It goes:

If you pay peanuts
You get monkeys to do the job


Let alone putting in hundreds of hours of work for making peanuts :)

Dave Driesen
Linux dev and oldskool elite

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meltwater
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Mon Jun 17, 2013 3:03 pm

Don't get me wrong you'll not make a ton of money in app-stores unless some big company buys you out (rather than just making their own version). A lot of potentially great apps are ignored since there isn't the marketing behind them or the developer can't afford to spend enough time to improve it. But if you are writing it anyway, then the money is always encouraging.
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duberry
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:23 pm

i am reminded a little of

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Letter_to_Hobbyists ( the beginning of the end? )

and even that "Who cares " tune is changing ? :o
http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/201 ... capitalism

pursuit of "attractive profits" are imho not going to do much other than be a distraction from th code
lend me your arms, fast as thunderbolts, for a pillow on my journey.
If the environment was a bank, would it be too big to fail
so long; and thanks for all the pi

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morphy_richards
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Mon Jun 17, 2013 5:38 pm

There is a lot going on which I simply have no experience of but one thing I do know is that , whereas employment and salaries are dropping off in most sectors, in computing it is picking up and seems to continue to do so.

Being skilled in computing is still a ticket to a good old fashioned career.

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duberry
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Re: Software Market- Paying peanuts for programs

Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:01 am

maby this RSA Animate link can provide some insight ?

http://vimeo.com/15488784 -- The surprising truth about what motivates us
lend me your arms, fast as thunderbolts, for a pillow on my journey.
If the environment was a bank, would it be too big to fail
so long; and thanks for all the pi

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