ProDigit
Posts: 374
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:24 am

Lithography, PiServer, overclocking

Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:31 am

Lithography:
Since phones are aiming towards 7nm lithography, when can we see a new die shrink for the Raspberry Pi CPU?
The current Broadcom is like what, 28nm?

With the introduction of the Pi 3, the performance was boosted, but also power usage has risen above 2,5x the earliest models!

If you ask me, I'd love to see Pi expand in 3 sectors:
- Ultra low power systems (running at a few milliwatt), for R&D, robotics, data logging equipment,
I think this can be good for college, univ research, and help with many projects that require low computing power needs on a budget.

- Standard pc on a bankcard, for end users (what current Pi is about).
I think this is what you currently are already offering, for us fans.

- Micro Servers, high performance, low power.
I think this is for funding the Pi foundation and help in R&D.
Servers can be sold with a slightly larger profit margin, to companies, and individuals, and should help the Pi foundation in research and development.


Pi Server:
And I'd really love to see a Pi server, basically a Pi, with multiple sockets per board (basically running 1x LPDDR3 or LPDDR4 ram (1-8GB), with 3 additional slots (up to 64GB of RAM) for expansion, and between 1 to 10 CPU sockets where one could click additional CPUs on, for extra processing power).
Pi Servers would do well in bitcoin farming, webspace hosting, file uploader, mini search engines, [email protected], file encoding, micro supercomputer, CAD design, or any program that can make use of multiple threads or cores); running Linux or a Pi-derivative OS.
Intel and AMD are going the way of 10 core, 20 thread systems. I want to see an ARM based variant that's affordable.
Pi-like servers like this might very well outperform massive servers of 10 years ago, at only a fraction of the power usage.
Thinking about shoe-box sized servers.

Overclocking:
Any more documentation on overclocking a Pi?
Using a thermal camera, seeing which parts get hot with overclocking, and providing info on what chips or components need extra cooling?
How far passive or active cooling can bring a pi?
How about liquid cooling?

I've always felt, on an old style Windows 98/XP computer, that 1,6Ghz is the absolute minimum for a CPU to give a snappy response (dragging windows, browsing,... Since Windows 8 (with increased browsing capabilities), this has become 2,4Ghz.
I often wonder how any normal browser like Firefox, Chrome, or Chromium would handle with a single core 1.4Ghz CPU?
Last edited by ProDigit on Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.

fruitoftheloom
Posts: 20736
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:40 pm
Location: Delightful Dorset

Re: Lithography, PiServer, overclocking

Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:48 am

ProDigit wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:31 am
Lithography:
Since phones are aiming towards 7nm lithography, when can we see a new die shrink for the Raspberry Pi CPU?
The current Broadcom is like what, 28nm?

With the introduction of the Pi 3, the performance was boosted, but also power usage has risen above 2,5x the earliest models!

Pi Server:
And I'd really love to see a Pi server, basically a Pi, with multiple sockets per board (basically running a few GB of LPDDR3 ram, and between 1 to 10 sockets where one could click additional ARM CPUs on, for extra processing power).
Pi Servers would do well in bitcoin farming, webspace hosting, file uploader, mini search engines, [email protected], etc....
Intel and AMD are going the way of 10-20 thread systems. I want to see an ARM based variant that's affordable.
Pi-like servers with 10 cores, well outperform massive servers of 10-15 years ago, at only a fraction of the power usage.
Thinking about book/shoe-box sized servers.

Overclocking:
Any more documentation on overclocking a Pi?
Using a thermal camera, seeing which parts get hot with overclocking, and providing info on what chips or components need extra cooling?
How far passive or active cooling can bring a pi?
How about liquid cooling?

The internal roadmap for next generation models has been set, your ideas are like all the other "pi in the sky" ideas, just blue sky thinking without any BoM costs.

Total rubbish and a waste of a post.
Retired disgracefully.....

drgeoff
Posts: 9812
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:39 pm

Re: Lithography, PiServer, overclocking

Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:10 am

ProDigit wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:31 am
Overclocking:
Any more documentation on overclocking a Pi?
Using a thermal camera, seeing which parts get hot with overclocking, and providing info on what chips or components need extra cooling?
How far passive or active cooling can bring a pi?
How about liquid cooling?
viewtopic.php?t=115955#p790950

ProDigit
Posts: 374
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:24 am

Re: Lithography, PiServer, overclocking

Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:56 am

drgeoff wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:10 am
viewtopic.php?t=115955#p790950
Thanks, that's an old post of 3 years old (probably Pi1 or Pi2), and doesn't have any actual data on cooling, other than suggesting fans or heat sinks.

I found some page online, for those interested:
https://medium.com/@ghalfacree/benchmar ... 122cf3d806

drgeoff
Posts: 9812
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:39 pm

Re: Lithography, PiServer, overclocking

Sat Dec 08, 2018 12:55 pm

ProDigit wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:56 am
drgeoff wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:10 am
viewtopic.php?t=115955#p790950
Thanks, that's an old post of 3 years old (probably Pi1 or Pi2), and doesn't have any actual data on cooling, other than suggesting fans or heat sinks.

I found some page online, for those interested:
https://medium.com/@ghalfacree/benchmar ... 122cf3d806
Better cooling on a Pi3A+ or Pi3B+ will help to stop it throttling back from the default clock rate when working hard for a while but it won't gain you much in terms of increasing the rate at which the device will run stable even for short periods.

People coming from the Intel/AMD CPU world are often fixated on the heat issue. The SoCs in RPis need a different mindset.

User avatar
rpdom
Posts: 15207
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 5:17 am
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UK

Re: Lithography, PiServer, overclocking

Sat Dec 08, 2018 2:07 pm

ProDigit wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:31 am
Lithography:
Since phones are aiming towards 7nm lithography, when can we see a new die shrink for the Raspberry Pi CPU?
The current Broadcom is like what, 28nm?
The current Broadcom SoC is 40nm. The next Pi will probably use 28nm. Going smaller than that will make the price too high.

Return to “Off topic discussion”