ChicagoBob123
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Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:37 am

Hi, is there anyone that knows of a industrial pi equivalent?
Its the temperature rating has to be ISO etc.
Thanks,
Bob

Heater
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 1:26 am

How about the IDEE IGEP v2. Temp spec. -40 ºC to +85 ºC

https://www.isee.biz/products/igep-proc ... pv2-dm3730

They were about 250 Euro when we bought them. Then the Pi arrived...

I notice they are up to IGEP v5 now.

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liudr
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 3:38 am

Digi international also has an industrial quality SBC connect core

https://www.digi.com/products/embedded-systems

They are also in the 200USD range, designed after pi has already become popular.
Arduino data loggers, user interface, printed circuit board designer since 2009, RPI 3B 2B 2B Zero Jessie, assembly/C/C++/java/python programmer since the 80's

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karrika
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 3:57 am

A bit larger boards is the Alix series. at pcengines.ch. I have been using these for headless servers. They are cheaper but also a bit older. You cannot use modern kernels with them. Ubuntu 10.04 is the latest supported because of the Geode CPU.

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ab1jx
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:27 pm

I'd look at Beaglebone or Odroid, maybe Allwinner, there's another I can't think of right now. You'd have to look up the spec sheets yourself. But yeah, for some applications like a nature camera in the winter temperature range would be crucial. Not to mention automotive projects.

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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 4:35 pm

The is the BeagleBone Black - Industrial Temp version for 75 dollars:

https://www.arrow.com/en/products/bb-bb ... ment-tools

jamesh
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 5:02 pm

I believe the Pi would pass that set of tests, if it hasn't already, I'll need to check when I get back to work. We have some certification for the CM but I cannot remember what...
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 7:12 pm

I'm confident the Pi would pass such tests.

The problem is not that it won't function over industrial temperature ranges.

The problem is that for many applications there are requirements that components do meet temperature specification. That there is evidence and certification from testing. That the vendor guarantees it.

Same goes for mechanical shock and vibration requirements and others.

This all takes testing. On going testing of samples during production. Or even bake in of every individual unit.

There is a reason industrial spec. devices tend to be much more expensive.

I guess the Pi suppliers would offer industrial strength Pi, at extra cost, if they thought there were demand enough.

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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:54 pm

ab1jx wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:27 pm
I'd look at Beaglebone or Odroid, maybe Allwinner, there's another I can't think of right now. You'd have to look up the spec sheets yourself. But yeah, for some applications like a nature camera in the winter temperature range would be crucial. Not to mention automotive projects.
You mean like the people who used a Pi to do population studies of penguins, in Antarctica?

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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:31 am

Telling your boss that the Pi has been used to snap penguins in Antarctica may be impressive but when the project requirements demand that components have industrial specifications it does not help.

I guess another way around this, if a company really needs tests results for an industrial application, is to do the testing in house.

I'm pretty sure the Pi that ended up on the Space Station were subject to some stringent tests before they were allowed on board.

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karrika
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Mon Aug 21, 2017 5:06 am

There are things like vibration tests, shock tests, conducted disturbance through power wires etc.

For industrial tests you sometimes require that the unit under test does not malfunction. Sometimes the unit has to fully recover by itself.

The cords need to be secured so that they don't shake loose during vibration tests. You need to activate hardware watchdogs. The power planes of the PCB have to be symmetrical so that when a voltage spike comes the power planes will both react to it in the same way and you do not get large gradients between the layers.

I really don't believe that a Pi should be called an industrial computer. This does not mean that it can not go to a spaceship for fun. But I would not choose a Pi to control any vital functions on the spaceship.

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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Mon Aug 21, 2017 5:34 am

As always, it all depends on your application.

Companies like to have these blanket "industrial" specifications so that they can check the boxes and get their ISOxxxx certificates. Which is all just paper pushing nonsense.

Sometimes such extreme specs. are not really required to get the job done reliably.

Sometimes such extreme specs. are not enough to ensure the job does get done reliably.

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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Mon Aug 21, 2017 6:53 am

jamesh wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 5:02 pm
I believe the Pi would pass that set of tests, if it hasn't already, I'll need to check when I get back to work. We have some certification for the CM but I cannot remember what...
There is nothing useful under the "Industrial Use" page
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/hardware/
and just standard conformity documentation (as expected of guess).
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentati ... /README.md

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ab1jx
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:53 pm

I just stumbled across this ad, it's rated for -40-80 C by the Aliexpress ad. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/NanoPi- ... sstype=600 Still only 1 GB of RAM. Same absurd micro USB power connector. There's Ubuntu for it at least. IR, not sure how the 1 GB ethernet is connected. No bluetooth.

The Pi is a deal that's hard to beat especially with a userbase of millions and bootable images ready for download. This is $41.99 with free shipping to the US by the Aliexpress Android app so I hit the share button.

Cheaper model ($31.75), same temperature range. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/NanoPi- ... sstype=600

Somebody should stick a Pi in a freezer.

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Imperf3kt
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:11 pm

People have stuck Pis in a freezer, they work fine so long as you watch out for condensation and don't mind destroying your batteries.
Pi3b - 'normal use' temperature (25% CPU load) 76℃, ambient 21℃

W. H. Heydt
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Fri Sep 08, 2017 5:07 am

ab1jx wrote:
Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:53 pm
Somebody should stick a Pi in a freezer.
See comments above referring to using a Pi to phtograph penguins in Antarctica. The Pi functioned well in temperatures down to at least -42C. That's almost certainly lower than your freezer goes.

SuperJojo2001
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:26 pm

ChicagoBob123 wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:37 am
Hi, is there anyone that knows of a industrial pi equivalent?
Its the temperature rating has to be ISO etc.
Thanks,
Bob
Bob just let me understand your inquiry. Are you looking for alternatives cause Pi isn't industrial or are you looking for a Pi equivalent ... cause you don't like ... whatever ... its ARM processor basis too and you need a different type of processor ... or the USB powering method and you need robust terminals to connect power too?

Heater
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:08 pm

ChicagoBob123 does not say what he wants or needs.

Only some hand waving about "ISO" something.

Bob is not polite enough to return when we have answers.

Time waster.

SuperJojo2001
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Tue Oct 31, 2017 3:44 pm

Well ISO doesn't tell me something either. To be more constructive, how about a custom Pi by Element14 service https://www.element14.com/community/doc ... on-service including an industrial upgrade?

Found this blog related to this service: http://linuxgizmos.com/raspberry-pi-bas ... -ethernet/

Also Microsoft is writing about it https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/holger ... on-part-1/

timrowledge
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Tue Oct 31, 2017 5:54 pm

Nice device, but ouch on the price (350euro).
Making Smalltalk on ARM since 1986; making your Scratch better since 2012

Heater
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Tue Oct 31, 2017 8:23 pm

Interesting,
Now enter the NetPI. Hilscher has built an industrial gateway hardware that combines the standard Raspberry Pi 3 Broadcom SOC
Am I to understand these Hilscher guys are building boards using the Raspi SoC?

Which I have been told since forever is not available unless you want to buy a million of them?

I don't believe these Hilscher guys are going to sell a million of their box.

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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Tue Oct 31, 2017 8:55 pm

Heater wrote:
Tue Oct 31, 2017 8:23 pm
Interesting,
Now enter the NetPI. Hilscher has built an industrial gateway hardware that combines the standard Raspberry Pi 3 Broadcom SOC
Am I to understand these Hilscher guys are building boards using the Raspi SoC?

Which I have been told since forever is not available unless you want to buy a million of them?

I don't believe these Hilscher guys are going to sell a million of their box.
As SuperJojo2001 linked, they've used the Element14 Pi Customisation service. So Element14 are sourcing the SoC and altering the Pi licenced designs to meet Hilscher's requirement. Quantities are still going to have to be in the thousands to make it vaguely economic.
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Sergey RS Russia
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Wed Nov 08, 2017 1:26 pm

Hi all,

we tested Rpi3 and Rpi2 for industrial temperature range. Let you see our article https://habrahabr.ru/post/318486/ (in Russian).
During these tests RPi 3 boards started and worked in temperature range from -35℃ to +90℃, RPi 2 – from -45℃ to +106℃. These ranges are close to industrial grade electronic components -40℃…+85℃ on the boards.

Kind regards,
Sergey, RS Russia

Heater
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Wed Nov 08, 2017 10:41 pm

That is great work Sergey.

Problem is that unless the device comes with some such guarantee from the vendor or if we don't do such testing ourselves then we cannot use it.

jamesh
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Re: Industrial rated PI equivalent boards

Thu Nov 09, 2017 10:29 am

Sergey RS Russia wrote:
Wed Nov 08, 2017 1:26 pm
Hi all,

we tested Rpi3 and Rpi2 for industrial temperature range. Let you see our article https://habrahabr.ru/post/318486/ (in Russian).
During these tests RPi 3 boards started and worked in temperature range from -35℃ to +90℃, RPi 2 – from -45℃ to +106℃. These ranges are close to industrial grade electronic components -40℃…+85℃ on the boards.

Kind regards,
Sergey, RS Russia
Nice one. Were these simply the testing environments you use - could they go further in each direction or is that where they became erratic?
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