flanylla
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:28 pm

No.

Discourse is one of those modern JS abominations that will gradually, just like most of the modern web has done particularly over the past seven years or so, become incredibly bloated to use on slower connections/devices. Not everyone who is interested in the Pi has the hardware/bandwidth to keep up with the modern Internet, and heck, the Pi itself would probably crash on big threads due to the fact it uses infinite scroll.

phpBB is better than most of them, it keeps things simple, traditional and easy while still having a decent design (as of 3.2, it's definitely improved since its past self). Discourse feels like it's trying to make forums into bloated social media service design, which will steer away old members most likely.
Jamie Dignam | flanylla

ejolson
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:05 pm

flanylla wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:28 pm
Not everyone who is interested in the Pi has the hardware/bandwidth to keep up with the modern Internet, and heck, the Pi itself would probably crash on big threads due to the fact it uses infinite scroll.
Being able to access the main website and forums using a Raspberry Pi to me is an obvious requirement that sometimes seems overlooked when the artists get to work. While the phpBB database design may not be the best, loading an entire thread (even dynamically) into the browser does not sound like a useful improvement.

If there is a change, I would recommend the people involved exclusively use the Raspberry Pi (preferably a Zero) as their daily desktop computer during the design, development and testing.

Heater
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:13 pm

Agreed.

It's absurd that the Raspberry Pi website is not tuned to the Raspberry Pi!

No Javascript. Or at least very little. I actually like Javascript as a language at it is very useful in web pages. But a forum should not require it at all.

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bensimmo
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:24 pm

It's the animated 'GIF' or video as GIFs have become that bog downs Pi (and my RPi Desktop laptop) maxing then out at 100% sat watching the front page.
Why!
Luckily on Vivaldi you can make them only loop once, unfortunately Vivaldi seems to have become more of a hog than Chromium of late.
On a Pi3B/(+)

notstephen
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Wed May 15, 2019 2:27 am

I stumbled on this topic and the sheer around of misinformation is mind-boggling, so decided to register and respond.
Heater wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:02 am
Discourse does that infinite scrolling of threads rather than chopping them into pages of 20 or so posts.

That means:

1) When you are on a thread page you cannot search it in the browser for anything you might like to refer to or quote. It's likely not in the page.
This is... completely untrue. You can search within the browser, the last 20 posts are in-memory and searchable in the usual fashion just as any paginated topic would be.

You can also use the search at the top within any topic and tick the box to search within the topic.:
Screen Shot 2019-05-14 at 7.17.43 PM.png
Screen Shot 2019-05-14 at 7.17.43 PM.png (30.14 KiB) Viewed 283 times
Heater wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:02 am
3) You cannot keep track of where you are in a long thread easily it has no pages
This also isn't true, Discourse retains your last read-to position, and even if you scroll back up it adds a back button to the topic navigation, allowing you to easily return to where you last read to. When you revisit a topic your progress is still synced to that location.

The URL increments as you scroll too, making it easy to share the position within a topic.
Heater wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:02 am
3) Google search is broken. There is no page for google to return.
Discourse serves a flat version of topics up to Google, everything is crawled correctly and search results take you directly to the relevant post, rather than the top of the page where a post can be found. So for example this search hit on Google for WorldofWarcraft.com:
Screen Shot 2019-05-14 at 7.21.40 PM.png
Screen Shot 2019-05-14 at 7.21.40 PM.png (62.08 KiB) Viewed 283 times
Links you directly to [reply 11,171 of 15,419](https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t ... 6463/11171).
Heater wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:02 am
Discourse is written in Ruby and hence not the future of anything.
I usually rate the topics I read here, it's odd to find a technology-centered community that doesn't bat an eyelid when one of the members gets it so wrong.

stuartiannaylor
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Wed May 15, 2019 9:21 am

Discourse is actually really good, but there are quite a few forumesque applications that have evolved far more than maybe what we have.
I say forumesque as what is a forum is less defined now like Slack and others mix up methods and actually are much more than just paint.

Dunno if its just me but the DuckDuckGo search here currently seems to suck eggs big style, forum works generally, bit mweh, but the search...

HypnoToad
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Thu May 16, 2019 2:19 am

I do prefer the older php style forums, but that's mostly due to the fact that it's what I'm used to.

I do also use a few Discourse forums, and while they are functional, it still feels off. Maybe it feels slow, or feels confusing as It's not what I"m used to, but if all forums go to Discourse then it's a case of adapt or die.

It's a shame Discourse doesn't have some sort of classic mode which could make it more like the php style forum to use, and while I don't hate Discourse forums, I don't really enjoy using them either.

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Gavinmc42
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Thu May 16, 2019 2:45 am

Perhaps start afresh with the Pi4 at the latest and just get on with it from there.
That might be a good idea, keep the existing system for Zero to 3's.
Have a new one for Pi4.

How much different will the 4 be?
The volume of users for the Pi4 maybe much more 100 million users :o
And if it is Desktop replacement capable, maybe a entirely new audience.
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epoch1970
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Thu May 16, 2019 3:25 pm

Gavinmc42 wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 2:45 am
That might be a good idea, keep the existing system for Zero to 3's.
Have a new one for Pi4.
Yesss. Alienating one's customer base is the best known recipe for successful product launch. Especially if the product or the experience it provides is innovative...
"S'il n'y a pas de solution, c'est qu'il n'y a pas de problème." Les Shadoks, J. Rouxel

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Gavinmc42
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 8:29 am

Yesss. Alienating one's customer base is the best known recipe for successful product launch. Especially if the product or the experience it provides is innovative...
Discourse that bad?

Perhaps just double up on the existing arrangement?
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Raspberries are not Apples or Oranges

jamesh
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 8:36 am

We have no plans to change the forums right now. A new server was installed a month or two back which has improved performance, but its still stalls occasionally when banning users (ie spammers). On the whole though it's not too bad.
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PeterO
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 9:10 am

jamesh wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 8:36 am
We have plans to change the forums right now. A new server was installed a month or two back which has improved performance, but its still stalls occasionally when banning users (ie spammers). On the whole though it's not too bad.
Missing "NO" ?

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jamesh
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 9:20 am

PeterO wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 9:10 am
jamesh wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 8:36 am
We have plans to change the forums right now. A new server was installed a month or two back which has improved performance, but its still stalls occasionally when banning users (ie spammers). On the whole though it's not too bad.
Missing "NO" ?

PeterO
Thanks, updated.
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epoch1970
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 10:39 am

Gavinmc42 wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 8:29 am
Discourse that bad?

Perhaps just double up on the existing arrangement?
My (snarky, I apologize) remark had nothing to do with discourse itself, it relates to community "social amplification" and "influence" as they like to say.
RPT will launch a new product, they will say over every possible outlet: "It's the best we've ever made. Come and get it."
And almost everybody who hears that thinks "Yeah, sure. I'll think about it."
Friends and family (the existing community) will be the 1st to give it a try, out of faith. Once enough of them say "Gee. It IS the best I've ever bought", the product will gain momentum.

People can't be in 2 places at the same time, so spawning a new specific forum, splitting the family, would not be a good idea, esp. at launch.
The only realistic way is to shutdown one and start another. And migrate as much posts (the user experience proofs) as possible.
Last edited by epoch1970 on Fri May 17, 2019 10:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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LTolledo
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 10:41 am

jamesh wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 9:20 am
PeterO wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 9:10 am
jamesh wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 8:36 am
We have plans to change the forums right now. A new server was installed a month or two back which has improved performance, but its still stalls occasionally when banning users (ie spammers). On the whole though it's not too bad.
Missing "NO" ?

PeterO
Thanks, updated.
Maybe this will now "put a lid" on the discussion.....
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 10:57 am

LTolledo wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:41 am
jamesh wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 9:20 am
PeterO wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 9:10 am


Missing "NO" ?

PeterO
Thanks, updated.
Maybe this will now "put a lid" on the discussion.....
No, not yet:
jamesh wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 8:36 am
We no have plans to change the forums right now.
We no have ? We now have not ? We not have plans ?
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Gavinmc42
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 11:03 am

We no have plans to change the forums right now. A new server was installed a month or two back which has improved performance, but its still stalls occasionally when banning users (ie spammers). On the whole though it's not too bad.
That would explain why I have not seen that message "we are very busy...." for some time.
How many users can the system handle at once?
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Raspberries are not Apples or Oranges

jamesh
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Re: Should the Pi Forum switch to Discourse?

Fri May 17, 2019 11:31 am

Ernst wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:57 am
LTolledo wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 10:41 am
jamesh wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 9:20 am


Thanks, updated.
Maybe this will now "put a lid" on the discussion.....
No, not yet:
jamesh wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 8:36 am
We no have plans to change the forums right now.
We no have ? We now have not ? We not have plans ?
Put the 'no' in the wrong place, sorry. Updated (again). It's "no plans"
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Contrary to popular belief, humorous signatures are allowed. Here's an example...
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