LucidEye
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How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Mon Aug 19, 2013 7:25 am

I want to make sure I'm running the newest firmware for my Pi in Pidora. I know Raspbian has the "rpi-update" command, but that doesn't work in Pidora.
How do I do this in Pidora?
Can't seem to find anything on this forum or on google that explains this.
Thanks.

macemoneta
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Mon Aug 19, 2013 11:05 am

The instructions are here, which points you to the tool installation instructions, here.

LucidEye
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:49 pm

This did not work... I followed the instructions and when I run "rpi-update" I get the following error:

*** Raspberry Pi firmware updater by Hexxeh, enhanced by AndrewS
*** Performing self-update
--2013-05-17 11:57:19-- https://github.com/Hexxeh/rpi-update/ra ... rpi-update
Resolving github.com... 204.232.175.90
Connecting to github.com|204.232.175.90|:443... connected.
ERROR: cannot verify github.com's certificate, issued by ‘/C=US/O=DigiCert Inc/OU=www.digicert.com/CN=DigiCert High Assurance EV CA-1’:
Issued certificate not yet valid.
To connect to github.com insecurely, use `--no-check-certificate'.
!!! Failed to download update for rpi-update!
!!! Make sure you have ca-certificates installed and that the time is set correctly


What am I doing wrong?

LucidEye
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 5:41 am

UGH... this is getting really frustrating... ok.. don't understand why my clock is wrong... I setup the NPT service at the boot configuration and I have the Pi on a wired connection... but it seems like it's not syncing the clock for some reason.
It really seems like the Pidora distro is incomplete at this time... like they are still working on (or just didn't think about) a lot of things.

For instance... no adjustable screen resolutions in the GUI... default display resolution is set at 1330x738???? Wouldn't it be better to set that at what most HDMI displays would use as a "native resolution", say 1080p or 780p? I have tried all of the HDMI default settings offered in the first run boot config and none of them work right... they all end up overscanning and I end up not being able to see the menu bar at all when the XFCE DE starts... and if I boot into text only mode... it's still overscanning and I can't see the first several letters of each line... that makes it really hard to edit anything and it's a major PITA to open a terminal and re edit the boot config file until you get the resolution right.

Also, why would there be no pre-installed app to upgrade the firmware for the Pi? Seems like that would be something that should be built in and run at first boot, right?

I understand that the rev 2 Pi can do dynamic memory scaling and allocation... shouldn't that be an option to setup in the first boot config app as well... or at least the option to set the memory split? And shouldn't there be an app for this in the XFCE DE since Pidora is supposed to be the "desktop workstation" distro available for the Pi? I mean Raspbian is the "tinker/project/programer" distro, and RaspbMC and XBMC are the "entertainment" distros... Pidora is supposed to be the "home/office" distro right? So why is all of this stuff so complicated and convoluted to setup... this is all basic setup and configuration stuff that should all be point and click... especially being that many new Pi owners have never had their hands on a LINUX machine before.

I also understand that one of the big things that people would want to use Pidora for is the "headless mode"... but there's no pre-installed VNC server.... and so far the only vncserver app I've been able to get to install is tigervnc... none of the other vnc packages I've tried to install work on pidora... and I don't know if it's because of the screen resolution they have as the default or the XFCE DE, but so far I have not been able to get any of my vnc clients to connect to the Pi where I can see the desktop... it's just black... it doesn't work.... so what is the point of "advertising" a headless mode if you have to go through so much time and trouble to get it to work... shouldn't that all be pre-installed and ready to work "out of the box"?

Am I missing something? The point of a computer is to be able to get more work done with less effort.... but it seems like the LINUX mentality is to make things more complicated than they should be.

macemoneta
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:02 am

The RPi is not a turnkey end-user desktop computer. Its reason for existing is education. It's early in the RPi's software life-cycle, and things are a bit rough. You can wait a few years for everything to be made ready for you by others, or you can dive in and gain proficiency in administration by overcoming the hurdles yourself now. If you don't want to learn how to perform the tasks needed to establish the environment you want, and don't derive pleasure from the learning process, it's probably not the best platform for you.

LucidEye
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 4:58 pm

Trust me, I fully understand and appreciate that the R-Pi is an educational tool and that was it's core purpose. And I am all for it. But there is a point where having to learn too much will actually get in the way of achieving your end goals. I am a photographer, not a software developer/programmer. I saw the R-Pi as a tool that could help me do things with my photography for tens of thousands of dollars less than if I were to just go buy a turn-key setup from a commercial company. I knew the trade off would be that I would have to learn some python or java programming... however, instead of working towards that goal, I have spent the last month being distracted by the fact that I can't even get the basic OS running smoothly. You can't build a house without a solid foundation.

LucidEye
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 7:51 pm

Yes... my reason for wanting to use Pidora is that the one thing that seems to work better in Pidora than Raspbian is gphoto2... and as I said I am a photographer and my whole reason for using the Pi is to do camera control... motion control and time lapse.
I have had nothing but problems trying to run gphoto2 in Raspbian... I am trying to control my DSLR camera in tethered mode using gphoto2 and the program is unreliable... it only works about 1 out of 5 tries... most of the time when I enter a command at the terminal nothing happens, or I get an I/O error... or if it does run, it ends up hanging part of the way through the shoot... when shooting several hours of time lapse you are talking about shooting THOUSANDS of individual frames... solid reliability is key! Even doing a recompile of the gphoto2 source code on my Pi didn't help in Raspbian.
This does not seem to happen in Pidora... gphoto2 runs smoothly every time I enter a command to my camera, it does hang in the middle of the shoot sometimes, but I am convinced this is because I need to allocate more memory to the CPU so it can handle the file transfer from the camera to the Pi and then send the file to my laptop across the network. It's just that the rest of the things I really need to work in Pidora don't...
like the screen resolution...
getting my RTC module recognized and working...
dynamically allocating memory to processes so the Pi doesn't hang in the middle of a shoot...
getting VNC to run... which is critical so I can setup and control the Pi and camera out on location via WiFi remotely using a laptop without having to be tied down by an extension cord, a network cable, and a separate monitor/keyboard/mouse for the Pi.

And from what I've been reading... http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewt ... p?p=358244
all of these same problems I have complained about have been problems since the initial release of this Pidora version almost 4 months ago... and so far none of them seem to have been addressed or fixed. So what's up with that? Is the Pidora remix dead already? Is no one working on these bugs? How long before we can expect a stable OS so that we can actually start using the Pi to it's potential? Like I said, can't build a house on a bad foundation... I am the carpenter... I can build an amazing house... but I am not a cement worker... if the cement worker doesn't do their job to lay a solid foundation... whatever I try to build... no matter how strong and magnificent... simply won't stand.

Oakham
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:19 pm

I am in a similar position and though au-fait with Linux am not a programmer, Fedora is not a good base and never has been.

After trying various Distro's I have found that Raspbian aka Debian, followed by Arch to be the only 2 I could recommend to a Pi newcomer.

I will take issue with you lambasting the developers, none of them are paid to undertake the work and expecting a time-line is quite frankly absurd :shock:

So I would say take a deep breath, forget the past few weeks, and start with Raspbian Wheezy


Raspbian “wheezy”
If you’re just starting out, this is the image we recommend you use. It’s a reference root filesystem from Alex and Dom, based on the Raspbian optimised version of Debian, and containing LXDE, Midori, development tools and example source code for multimedia functions.

:D
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Joe Schmoe
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 10:20 pm

So I would say take a deep breath, forget the past few weeks, and start with Raspbian Wheezy
Did you even read the previous posting (by LucidEye) ?
And some folks need to stop being fanboys and see the forest behind the trees.

(One of the best lines I've seen on this board lately)

Oakham
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 10:33 pm

"I have had nothing but problems trying to run gphoto2 in Raspbian."

It may of been easier to solve the gphoto issue ?????

Arch has gphoto2 and VLC in repository and Arch is more mature than Pidora !


If I am out of order, apologies :oops:
Last edited by Oakham on Tue Aug 20, 2013 10:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joe Schmoe
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 10:36 pm

No need to apologize.

It just seems to me that if someone explains that "X app doesn't work under OS Y", and that app X is critical to their use of the computer, then it is a little silly to suggest that they use OS Y anyway.

The classic example of this, of course, is suggesting Linux to someone who says "I need MS Word for my work." Linux may be all manner of wonderful, but if it don't run Word, it ain't gonna cut it for someone who needs Word in order to keep on eating.
And some folks need to stop being fanboys and see the forest behind the trees.

(One of the best lines I've seen on this board lately)

Oakham
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 10:42 pm

"It just seems to me that if someone explains that "X app doesn't work under OS Y", and that app X is critical to their use of the computer, then it is a little silly to suggest that they use OS Y anyway."

Yes I should of given a fuller reply !!

I will creep back in my burrow :roll:
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AndrewS
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Tue Aug 20, 2013 11:17 pm

I haven't been monitoring the project very closely, but unfortunately it seems like Pidora is currently getting little or no development :-(
I tried running it a couple months ago (purely out of curiosity), and found the same problem that you did with NTP, so filed a bug report about it http://trac.proximity.on.ca/projects/rpfr/ticket/372

I also found a few other bugs, so filed several other bug reports:
http://trac.proximity.on.ca/projects/rpfr/ticket/368
http://trac.proximity.on.ca/projects/rpfr/ticket/369
http://trac.proximity.on.ca/projects/rpfr/ticket/370
http://trac.proximity.on.ca/projects/rpfr/ticket/371

And then I gave up and switched back to my regular distro of Raspbian. Since filing all those bugs, there's been absolutely no comments on any of them from any of the Pidora dev team :( I've got no idea why Pidora has "gone dark".

LucidEye
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Wed Aug 21, 2013 12:10 am

HAHA... ok.. ok.. no need for any arguments to erupt over my soap box rantings :cry: I am speaking mostly out of frustration at this point with all of my complaints... but they are VALID complaints nonetheless... and I know I am not the only one who feels this way about these shortcomings of the Pi distros.

I have not tried the Arch distro yet. I was under the impression that it does not come packaged with a GUI desktop environment... and to me that is counter productive. I am not new to computers. I have a degree in MIS and worked as a systems admin and CCNA for almost 15 years. Thus I am not entirely new to the unices either... however, about 8 months ago I finally swore off Windoze altogether and forever and threw myself completely into Ubuntu and I am now running that on my 2 home/office laptops... and I love it... it's stable and does everything my Windoze systems used to do... and FOR FREE :-) However, I am used to a GUI desktop environment and having to learn and remember command line text is to me a completely backwards concept in the computing world... I mean the world has been using GUIs since 1970... "object orientation" is the accepted standard method for operating a computer in this day and age... but for some reason old school LINUX die-hards seem to feel that having to learn and remember obscure lines of gibberish is somehow better... if that's what makes them feel "elite" than whatever... but they are a small minority in a world that uses GUIs to actually get real work done on a timely basis... and (unfortunately) LINUX will remain a minority until it can get past the archaic command line mentality and develop GUIs that can harness the full power of the OS.... so that users can spend their time getting work done rather than fiddling around with having to remember encyclopaedia's worth of command lines that have to be typed in manually... how quaint. :roll:

Anyway... I'm rambling again and this whole thread has now gone WAY off on a tangent and I should probably get back to where I started...

How do I get the rpi-update to work... oh yea... gotta get the clock working first... how do I get my clock to sync using NTP in Pidora? I thought I had setup NTP in the first-run setup app, but it's doesn't seem to be working at all... I know it's a bug that's already been reported by dozens of other people... but there doesn't seem to be a clear fix for this 4 month old problem. Can someone offer a simple fix for the clock sync so I can update my Pi?
Thanks a bunch :-)

LucidEye
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Wed Aug 21, 2013 12:28 am

Well... I have been looking around the Pidora distro official website and it looks like total amateur hour over there... their whole forum is full of nothing but spam.
And all of the real posts asking about bugs and fixes have been closed with no replies or solutions.
Looks like everyone abandoned the project and left the doors open for vandals and vagrants to move in and foul up the place.
I guess Pidora has died before it even got off the ground.
I motion to have the Pidora distro stricken from the Raspberry Pi site and the NOOBS installer until it looks like someone is actually doing some real work on it again. What's the point of leaving an unfinished, broken distro up if there is no official work being done to make it functional?
Who will second the motion?

gritz
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Wed Aug 21, 2013 12:51 am

Oakham wrote: I will take issue with you lambasting the developers, none of them are paid to undertake the work and expecting a time-line is quite frankly absurd :shock:
I think it's worth mentioning that whilst most open source developers put their work out there for free and in what little spare time they have, Seneca (maintainers of Pidora) do get paid:

http://www.senecac.on.ca/media/2012/2012-05-08.html
Toronto, May 8, 2012 – Seneca Professor Chris Tyler has been named among the first Industrial Research Chairs for Colleges by the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council of Canada (NSERC).

The $1 million renewable five-year grant recognizes Seneca’s expertise and establishes Tyler as a research leader in open source technology for emerging platforms. In this new role, his research will focus on foundational software for new energy-efficient computing platforms, ranging from the revolutionary $35 Raspberry Pi computer to large data centres, with industry partner Red Hat Canada. Emerging ARM computer systems have the potential to reduce energy, space, and cooling requirements by 90 per cent or more.
Given Seneca's woeful record re. the Pi over the last 18 months and the amount of negative feeling that one rotten apple can cause towards the wider open source effort I can't help feeling that perhaps the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council of Canada would be better off spending their $1,000,000 elsewhere. Perhaps a representative from Seneca would like to comment, but given that the only time they grace the official Raspberry Pi forum with their presence is to punt a fresh alpha to unwitting users I don't suppose that will happen...

Sorry to hear of your woes LucidEye.

LucidEye
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Wed Aug 21, 2013 12:59 am

OK... Here is the OFFICIAL last posting I could find on Pidora 18
This comes directly from the Element14 website forum.... it pretty much confirms that all Pidora development has been abandoned for the Raspberry Pi using the ARMv6 chip architecture... because that architecture is now obsolete... which makes the Pi itself obsolete... makes me wonder if the Pi was even worth buying now if no Linux distros are going to be continuing development for a chip that's no longer being made. :-(


2. Jun 4, 2013 1:47 PM (in response to oatley)
Re: Pidora 18 (Raspberry Pi Fedora Remix) Status Update

Andrew,

Thanks for the minutes!
It's encouraging to see that fundamental issues are being addressed, particuarly:

"The future of Pidora--

How much energy do we want to put into this?
Low energy: just build what's in Fedora
High energy: make this the preferred/top Raspi distro"

It's important that if you plan to make this a low-energy project, that
this be clear to your audience. Otherwise, it looks like you're spending
lots of energy, but with very little to show for it, which isn't at all good for
your résumés.

I would like to point out the difference between a meeting agenda and
meeting minutes, because these "minutes" look more like an agenda to me.
Meeting minutes normally say who attended the meeting. These don't.
Meeting agendas list the topics to be discussed, but meeting minutes
also summarize the discussions, particularly including any decisions made
and any action items assigned, and any decisions deferred to a future meeting.
Meeting minutes normally say when the previous meeting was, with a link
to its minutes, and when the next meeting will be.
Staff meeting minutes normally say what each staff member has been working
on since the previous meeting, and what their priorities are for the next work period.

I would suggest as topics for the next meeting:
a) RPi camera support
b) Wayland preview support
c) NOOBS support
d) pixman armv6 optimizations
e) status of each open bug report
f) GPU accelerated X11 plans, if any
g) support plans for soft-float Fedora Remix 18
h) Pidora 19 plans, if any

notes:

for (e) bug report status, please include status of the 25 open bug reports in
your previous tracker at:
https://fedorahosted.org/arm/report/1
such as #63: "fxup_cd.dat and start_cd.elf are missing from the RPM making booting the raspberry with gpu_mem=16 impossible"

for (h) Pidora 19 plans, I suggest that with limited resources you would attract more users
by focusing your effort on improving Pidora 18, even if it means deferring Pidora 19,
rather than continuing the apparent policy of always focusing effort on the next release to the
detriment of the current release users.

I note that there have been significant changes in plans since the RPi Fedora Remix started,
beyond the obvious loss of market position as the RPF recommended distro,
notably, X11 GPU acceleration has apparently been abandoned, leaving little hope for
significantly improved browser speed; Fedora ARM has abandoned pre-armv7 architectures,
making armv6 support more difficult; plans for armv6 as a primary Fedora architecture have been
abandoned; plans for mainlining the RPi kernel changes have apparently been abandoned;
any hope for including RPi in a unified ARM kernel has apparently been abandoned;
any hope for youtube viewing in a browser window on Pidora has apparently been abandoned
and instead we have NOOBS for switching between xbmc and Pidora.

Given these changes in plans, it would not be unreasonable to announce that Pidora
support is not planned beyond Pidora 18, so you can focus your efforts on armv8 and
similar projects that have long-term viability.



So that's it in a nutshell... Pidora is dead, and should be removed from the Raspberry Pi site as it will never be completed.

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AndrewS
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Wed Aug 21, 2013 1:56 am

LucidEye wrote:Well... I have been looking around the Pidora distro official website and it looks like total amateur hour over there... their whole forum is full of nothing but spam.
Yeah, the Pidora bug tracker I linked to earlier keeps getting filled with bogus spam bug reports too (even though they are using a CAPTCHA), which I've been closing myself as invalid, but if Pidora is now a dead-end then maybe I shouldn't bother :? Shame.

Oakham
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:25 am

[quote="I have not tried the Arch distro yet. I was under the impression that it does not come packaged with a GUI desktop environment... and to me that is counter productive. [/quote]

Linux 20 years ago was like its parent Unix, command line only, anyway rather than dissing Pidora try Arch, ranting will not make it work any better. Installing a Desktop in Arch is not rocket science

http://elinux.org/ArchLinux_Install_Guide
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LucidEye
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Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Wed Aug 21, 2013 7:36 pm

Well... I can't seem to get Arch to install... can't write the .img file to the SD card. I'm using ImageWriter on my Ubuntu laptop and when I try to write the .img file the program hangs and does nothing... just sits there till I kill it.
I am not having this problem with any of the other .img distro files, and it's not the SD card... I even tried re-downloading the Arch .img file a few times from different sources just in case it was corrupted and still the same problem...

Now what?

Oakham
Posts: 366
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:11 pm

Re: How do I update Pi firmware in Pidora?

Wed Aug 21, 2013 7:59 pm

The above Arch question already answered in this Arch related thread and I have posted a response:

http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewt ... 53&t=53440
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