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Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:14 pm
by nosferatujr
Tic tac tic tac.....

Downloading now....

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:41 pm
by RPiDevelopers
I've added a mirror here:

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http://rpi.pm/dj
Feel free to add it to the OP.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:34 pm
by gbassett
I'll try and throw it on my pi when I get home. Any chance the kernel has this patch in it? (http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.usb.general/56830)

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:24 pm
by asb
gbassett wrote:I'll try and throw it on my pi when I get home. Any chance the kernel has this patch in it? (http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.usb.general/56830)
No it won't do. The kernel is just taken from https://github.com/raspberrypi/firmware and put in an appropriate debian package. This in turn is built from https://github.com/raspberrypi/linux. To get this patch included, someone would need to 1) check to see if this patch made it upstream and if so in what form, 2) apply the patch to our kernel tree (rebasing if necessary), 3) verify that it works and fixes the problem, 4) create a pull request.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:49 pm
by WeaselNo7
Is this build set up for UVC out of the box? That would be incredibly useful, and also beat down all the 'arch linux is much better for webcams' commentards.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:51 pm
by asb
WeaselNo7 wrote:Is this build set up for UVC out of the box? That would be incredibly useful, and also beat down all the 'arch linux is much better for webcams' commentards.
We build the uvc kernel module and it should work. Let me know if you have problems.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:54 pm
by DavidK
Does it have I2C/SPI drivers like bootc's kernel?

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:57 pm
by asb
DavidK wrote:Does it have I2C/SPI drivers like bootc's kernel?
No, though I think we'd love to accept them if bootc can apply them on 3.1.x and make a pull request.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:04 pm
by amar
asb wrote:
Michael1260 wrote:
Is it possible to perform the initial configuration over ssh, or is a monitor needed for the initial configuration?
When you log in via ssh and have not performed this configuration, a message will print out suggesting you "sudo raspi-config". So no need for a monitor.
I did reconfiguration with sudo from ssh console and after restart ssh didn't load, so maybe you can set it to on by default if user runs raspi-config from the ssh console for the first time, assuming that he want's to keep ssh on.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:07 pm
by arm2
asb wrote:
DavidK wrote:Does it have I2C/SPI drivers like bootc's kernel?
No, though I think we'd love to accept them if bootc can apply them on 3.1.x and make a pull request.
If that happens, any chance DS1307/1338 Real Time Clock will also be included, please? I'm told drivers are in the standard sources.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:12 pm
by bobnuts
Seeding :-)

Installation completed without issue. However, when using PCManFMI am not able to browse through any network drives - error dialog message = Operation not supported.

Should I expect SMB network browsing to work?

BTW, I have a valid network connection as I am able to browse the web using Midori etc

Thanks in advance

Richard

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:13 pm
by asb
amar wrote:I did reconfiguration with sudo from ssh console and after restart ssh didn't load, so maybe you can set it to on by default if user runs raspi-config from the ssh console for the first time, assuming that he want's to keep ssh on.
ssh is on by default, and will remain on unless the user elects to turn it off. The behaviour you report puzzles me. Did you see anything in the boot messages regarding ssh failing to start for some reason? Could you `ls /etc/rc*.d/*ssh*` and let me know what that says?

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:20 pm
by asb
bobnuts wrote:Seeding :-)

Installation completed without issue. However, when using PCManFMI am not able to browse through any network drives - error dialog message = Operation not supported.

Should I expect SMB network browsing to work?
I haven't tested it, thanks for flagging it up. Could you please confirm whether `sudo apt-get install --no-install-recommends gvfs-backends gvfs-fuse` resolves the problem for you?

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:49 pm
by DavidMS
I notice you have included NetSurf as an additional browser, this seems a bit faster than Midori but struggles to show a common web page such as BBC news correctly - is there any chance of including Chromium ?

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:56 pm
by asb
DavidMS wrote:I notice you have included NetSurf as an additional browser, this seems a bit faster than Midori but struggles to show a common web page such as BBC news correctly - is there any chance of including Chromium ?
There is currently no 'armel' chromium package in upstream Debian wheezy, and it's a bit too much of a beast to build for me to compile it myself. I would certainly be interested in including it.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:27 pm
by bbb
asb wrote:
DavidMS wrote:I notice you have included NetSurf as an additional browser, this seems a bit faster than Midori but struggles to show a common web page such as BBC news correctly - is there any chance of including Chromium ?
There is currently no 'armel' chromium package in upstream Debian wheezy, and it's a bit too much of a beast to build for me to compile it myself. I would certainly be interested in including it.
I been trying to get chromium 18 working on raspbian. Despite patching and getting a successful build it doesn't work :( http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewt ... 745#p95745

I will give it a go with wheezy armel and report back.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:10 am
by amar
asb wrote:
amar wrote:I did reconfiguration with sudo from ssh console and after restart ssh didn't load, so maybe you can set it to on by default if user runs raspi-config from the ssh console for the first time, assuming that he want's to keep ssh on.
ssh is on by default, and will remain on unless the user elects to turn it off. The behaviour you report puzzles me. Did you see anything in the boot messages regarding ssh failing to start for some reason? Could you `ls /etc/rc*.d/*ssh*` and let me know what that says?
hmm, it shows that ssh is present, and I cannot recreate error again, just flashed sd card from image and it's working like it should, after reboot ssh is on again, so ignore this :-)

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:04 am
by jcrouchley
Just loaded this image - all seems to work fine. I use a serial terminal on ttyAMA0 - I found it impossible to use raspi-config there - would be good if it had an option for a dumb serial terminal. ssh and all worked fine.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:54 am
by Davespice
asb wrote:
bobnuts wrote:Seeding :-)

Installation completed without issue. However, when using PCManFMI am not able to browse through any network drives - error dialog message = Operation not supported.

Should I expect SMB network browsing to work?
I haven't tested it, thanks for flagging it up. Could you please confirm whether `sudo apt-get install --no-install-recommends gvfs-backends gvfs-fuse` resolves the problem for you?
Samba is not installed by default. I have installed it and got it working, and successfully accessed the Pi using a Windows PC. Here is a fairly good guide.

Although yes, browsing the SMB network I haven't seen working on any Pi image yet. You can mount SMB shares though and put them into fstab if you want to.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:57 am
by jojopi
I am very impressed with this. It is much cleaner than previous images and fixes nearly all of the niggles. Some comments:
  • The first partition is misaligned.
  • Setting the keymap on first boot takes 45 seconds; nearly as long as the ssh host keys. The cached keymap could be pre-generated with "setupcon --force --save".
  • PATH does not have */sbin added in non-login shells, such as "su pi" or "ssh pi@pi ifconfig". (Or for tcsh lusers.) The first should be fixed in /etc/login.defs, the second is amazingly compiled into sshd but could be supplemented in /etc/bash.bashrc.
  • Please remove the infuriating and non-standard \e[A \e[B bindings. These belong in ~asb/.inputrc, or learn to use \C-r like everyone else.
  • It might be better to add more init scripts and leave rc.local empty for the end user.
  • "this Raspberry Pi has not been fully configured" — really, "the software on …"
The kernel config has improved a lot recently too. However, Eben stated in the Maker Faire demo that the intention is that experience with desktop Linux and resources referring to generic Debian can be applied directly to the Pi. To my mind you cannot achieve this until your kernel config is at least vaguely based on a Debian config.

Currently you are least a couple of hundred options/modules down from a standard Debian kernel. I do not see much value in arguing about which ones are common or important. For any mainstream distribution of the last decade, the answer to a question like "how do I make nfsd work" is never "compile a local kernel".

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:57 am
by asb
jcrouchley wrote:Just loaded this image - all seems to work fine. I use a serial terminal on ttyAMA0 - I found it impossible to use raspi-config there - would be good if it had an option for a dumb serial terminal. ssh and all worked fine.
I'm just using whiptail (like dialog) for the menu. I would have hoped that would work reasonably with a serial connection, but perhaps not. Any ideas?

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:12 pm
by asb
jojopi wrote:I am very impressed with this. It is much cleaner than previous images and fixes nearly all of the niggles. Some comments:
  • The first partition is misaligned.
  • Setting the keymap on first boot takes 45 seconds; nearly as long as the ssh host keys. The cached keymap could be pre-generated with "setupcon --force --save".
  • PATH does not have */sbin added in non-login shells, such as "su pi" or "ssh pi@pi ifconfig". (Or for tcsh lusers.) The first should be fixed in /etc/login.defs, the second is amazingly compiled into sshd but could be supplemented in /etc/bash.bashrc.
  • Please remove the infuriating and non-standard \e[A \e[B bindings. These belong in ~asb/.inputrc, or learn to use \C-r like everyone else.
  • It might be better to add more init scripts and leave rc.local empty for the end user.
  • "this Raspberry Pi has not been fully configured" — really, "the software on …"
The kernel config has improved a lot recently too. However, Eben stated in the Maker Faire demo that the intention is that experience with desktop Linux and resources referring to generic Debian can be applied directly to the Pi. To my mind you cannot achieve this until your kernel config is at least vaguely based on a Debian config.

Currently you are least a couple of hundred options/modules down from a standard Debian kernel. I do not see much value in arguing about which ones are common or important. For any mainstream distribution of the last decade, the answer to a question like "how do I make nfsd work" is never "compile a local kernel".
Many thanks for the feedback. Pre-generating the cached keymap is indeed on my todo list (I'll also remove the ssh host key generation from the critical path for launching raspi-config on first boot). Thanks for the /etc/login.defs tip too, I had overlooked that.

You must have a cold heart to not love my glorious \e[A \e[B bindings. Is there a specific reason you don't like them? I had hoped all users would, like me, wonder why that is not the default behaviour. However, I accept it's non standard and potentially confusing.

Regarding kernel config. If anyone wants to submit a suggested defconfig based on Debian's we'd be happy to review it. Now the decision has been made to go with a more "desktop friendly" standard kernel configuration, I agree it probably makes sense to start from the standard Debian config and make necessary changes rather than starting from a minimal config and throwing in extra stuff. Also, if there are specific modules that you think are missing do shout out.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:15 pm
by dom
asb wrote:
jcrouchley wrote:Just loaded this image - all seems to work fine. I use a serial terminal on ttyAMA0 - I found it impossible to use raspi-config there - would be good if it had an option for a dumb serial terminal. ssh and all worked fine.
I'm just using whiptail (like dialog) for the menu. I would have hoped that would work reasonably with a serial connection, but perhaps not. Any ideas?
Just tried using putty and serial connection, and it was usable. Looked like this (with the accented a characters) rather than coloured boxed I get directly.

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ââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââ
â Raspi-config                                                                 â
â                                                                              â
â     info               Information about this tool                           â
â     expand_rootfs      Expand root partition to fill SD card                 â
â     overscan           Change overscan                                       â
â     change_pass        Change password for 'pi' user                         â
â     configure_keyboard Set keyboard layout                                   â
â     change_locale      Set locale                                            â
â     change_timezone    Set timezone                                          â
â     memory_split       Change memory split                                   â
â     ssh                Enable or disable ssh server                          â
â     finish             Finish config and don't start raspi-config at boot    â
â                                                                              â
â                                                                              â
â                                                                              â
â                                                                              â
â                     <Ok>                         <Exit>                      â
â                                                                              â
ââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââââ

However I could navigate and choose menu options.
@jcrouchley perhaps try putty?

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:46 pm
by jojopi
asb wrote:You must have a cold heart to not love my glorious \e[A \e[B bindings. Is there a specific reason you don't like them? I had hoped all users would, like me, wonder why that is not the default behaviour. However, I accept it's non standard and potentially confusing.
It seems that I am very much in the habit of typing something, scrolling through history to consult a recent parameter, then returning to my partial command. Your bindings try to stop me consulting entries that do not match, and then they try to stop me from escaping. It actually makes me feel claustrophobic for the second that it takes for me to remember \C-p \C-n.

I think that I am also very attached to the sequential nature of my history. Sometimes I \C-r for an entry that I know is near the one I actually want to find.

Re: Help test the next Debian image (wheezy)

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:58 pm
by asb
jojopi wrote:It seems that I am very much in the habit of typing something, scrolling through history to consult a recent parameter, then returning to my partial command. Your bindings try to stop me consulting entries that do not match, and then they try to stop me from escaping. It actually makes me feel claustrophobic for the second that it takes for me to remember \C-p \C-n.

I think that I am also very attached to the sequential nature of my history. Sometimes I \C-r for an entry that I know is near the one I actually want to find.
That makes a lot of sense. I put it in, reasoning I would see if anyone would complain (obviously, I personally like the behaviour very much). You complained, and have good reason. Therefore I'll remove the behaviour. Thanks.