jamesh
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:14 pm

the_ewan wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:05 pm
What communication would you like?
A blog post. Probably some tweets. Plus an update to the original PoE hat launch blog pointing to the new blog post.
We've told everyone there is a problem
In a forum thread, if they happen to find it.

If the TV hat had been launched with a comment in the forums then it might have looked like someone at the foundation honestly believed they were channels with equivalent visibility. But no, it launched with a blog post, a bunch of tweets, and some co-ordinated promo with the major retailers.

Because that's what you do when you want people to notice something.
I like car analogies, so here's one. When a car manufacturer start selling a new car, it's plastered over all forms of media. If the car needs a recall, there is nowhere near the same amount of publicity. This is very similar.
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ckd
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Thu Nov 08, 2018 5:37 pm

I like car analogies, so here's one. When a car manufacturer start selling a new car, it's plastered over all forms of media. If the car needs a recall, there is nowhere near the same amount of publicity. This is very similar.
Not sure how it's done in the UK, but here in the US, if a car needs a recall, the manufacturer is required by federal law to notify all purchasers that there is an issue, what the potential safety issues are, when the fix will be available, how long the fix will take to implement, and who to contact for said fix. Additionally, most manufacturers do actually do some level of publicity in order to reach customers they cannot otherwise contact.

So sure, let's do a car analogy.

martinrowan
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:20 pm

I was fortunate to receive a prototype of the modified HAT to test. I've written up my analysis, test results etc.
So if you're interested in learning more and seeing how the HAT has been modified, take a trip over to: https://www.martinrowan.co.uk/2018/11/r ... d-version/
Image
Last edited by martinrowan on Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Imperf3kt
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:49 pm

I don't really want to antagonise the situation, but it seems to me that the foundation is adamantly refusing to answer one question in particular: for all the people who did buy a PoE hat and decided to keep it, hoping to apply the "official fix", what is that fix? And will they have to pay additional money for choosing this option instead of requesting a replacement?
Stop plugging your fan directly into the GPIO 5v
https://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/power/transient-suppression.html

pantner
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:56 am

jamesh wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:14 pm
the_ewan wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:05 pm
What communication would you like?
A blog post. Probably some tweets. Plus an update to the original PoE hat launch blog pointing to the new blog post.
We've told everyone there is a problem
In a forum thread, if they happen to find it.

If the TV hat had been launched with a comment in the forums then it might have looked like someone at the foundation honestly believed they were channels with equivalent visibility. But no, it launched with a blog post, a bunch of tweets, and some co-ordinated promo with the major retailers.

Because that's what you do when you want people to notice something.
I like car analogies, so here's one. When a car manufacturer start selling a new car, it's plastered over all forms of media. If the car needs a recall, there is nowhere near the same amount of publicity. This is very similar.
I don't think you want to use the car analogy...

My (new-ish) car is one of the ones that needs it's airbag replaced as it has a factory defect.
I've received no less than 3 letters in the mail, 3 e-mails and 3 smses about it.

Will you be actively/directly notifying people that have already purchased the POE hat to notify them there is a fault with the product they have purchased and that they are entitled to a replacement?

I'm not trying to have a go, but it gets a little frustrating when 2 months ago it was posted here that there will be a blog post "probably tomorrow" and then again a day later saying "blog post soon with more details", that still hasn't eventuated.
When I was able to purchase the POE Hat after you apparently pulled them from sale and there was no "note" about a potential issue.

If I had known about this issue before I placed my order, I would not have placed the order. I should not have to google and search through these forums to find about a design fault with a product. There should be a new blog post, or the original one should have a warning/note.

Please tell me if you think that's unreasonable, I don't think it is.

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Paul Webster
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:08 am

martinrowan wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:20 pm
I was fortunate to receive a prototype of the modified HAT to test. I've written up my analysis, test results etc.
So if you're interested in learning more and seeing how the HAT has been modified, take a trip over to: https://www.martinrowan.co.uk/2018/11/r ... d-version/
Excellent

jamesh
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:48 am

There will be a blog post Monday.
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The_Raven
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:08 am

jamesh wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:48 am
There will be a blog post Monday.
Monday 7. june 2021? :P
Sarcasm OFF ;)

jamesh
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:35 am

The_Raven wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:08 am
jamesh wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:48 am
There will be a blog post Monday.
Monday 7. june 2021? :P
Sarcasm OFF ;)
Please refrain from this sort of post please. Any more will get deleted.
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burtyb
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Fri Nov 09, 2018 4:06 pm

The_Raven wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:08 am
Monday 7. june 2021? :P
Sarcasm OFF ;)
Where Monday = Friday :)

https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/poe-hat-revision/

jamesh
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Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Fri Nov 09, 2018 4:24 pm

burtyb wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 4:06 pm
The_Raven wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:08 am
Monday 7. june 2021? :P
Sarcasm OFF ;)
Where Monday = Friday :)

https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/poe-hat-revision/
Blimey, that was quick, Eben and James must have been busy. That was expected Monday!
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Roken
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Fri Nov 09, 2018 11:05 pm

Am I the only one that...a) did a quick Google search. b) found I could RMA, c) decided the V1 still suits my needs, and d) found an alternative where it doesn't?

What's with all the aggression? This is an inexpensive addition to an inexpensive board, and only the early adopters will have been affected (which I'm usually not - I tend to let others find the faults and wait for the fixed stuff).

This is brand new hardware, and the best lab tests in the world will never catch all instances of problems. Can we please stop with the criticism.
Headless PI. OMG, someone cut it's head off. Oh, hang on. it didn't have one to start with.

DjoeC
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Sat Nov 10, 2018 11:07 am

I'm glad to see the blog post! I'm glad the foundation took the problem seriously & I'm glad @Jamesh has been keeping us up-to-date.

I can only hope that the foundation draws lessons from the lack of communication. The Register is not exactly my daily-go-to information supplier.

Anyhow, it's now time to restart a planned outdoor PoE project even though the change of seasons might delay installing till next spring.

Thanks for keeping us in the loop!

jamesh
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Sat Nov 10, 2018 11:35 am

DjoeC wrote:
Sat Nov 10, 2018 11:07 am
I'm glad to see the blog post! I'm glad the foundation took the problem seriously & I'm glad @Jamesh has been keeping us up-to-date.

I can only hope that the foundation draws lessons from the lack of communication. The Register is not exactly my daily-go-to information supplier.

Anyhow, it's now time to restart a planned outdoor PoE project even though the change of seasons might delay installing till next spring.

Thanks for keeping us in the loop!
We always take things like this seriously, as we do when software problems arise (but generally people never see those - we have some some rather painful ethernet bugs over the years for example but only seem by limited subsets of users). This is the biggest HW issue we have had though, and has resulted in changes in the way we internally test new products. We now have a larger beta test team cfor example, along with new channels for communication of issues back to us.
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drgeoff
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Sat Nov 10, 2018 3:31 pm

martinrowan wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:20 pm
I was fortunate to receive a prototype of the modified HAT to test. I've written up my analysis, test results etc.
A minor correction to that report concerning the words "The inductor and resistor elements, in conjunction with the capacitors provide both high-pass and low-pass filtering ..". There is no high-pass filer, only low-pass. (A high-pass would be undesirable.)
Last edited by drgeoff on Sat Nov 10, 2018 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

martinrowan
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Sat Nov 10, 2018 3:43 pm

drgeoff wrote:
Sat Nov 10, 2018 3:31 pm
martinrowan wrote:
Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:20 pm
I was fortunate to receive a prototype of the modified HAT to test. I've written up my analysis, test results etc.
A minor correction to that report concerning the words "The inductor and resistor elements, in conjunction with the capacitors provide both high-pass and low-pass filtering ..". There is no high-pass filer, only low-pass.
Thanks. I've corrected in my blog post.

hippy
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Sat Nov 10, 2018 7:06 pm

jamesh wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:45 pm
Modified boards have a daughter board on the PCB. I didn't even spot it when I looked first time, but its actually quite large, so once you know wht to look for, very obvious.
That is very neat. I guess everyone's very grateful that it turned out to be such a simple problem to fix and with just the addition of a daughter board or who knows how much money would have been flushed down the toilet.

I am also pleased to see mahjongg indicate the PMIC issue on the Pi3B+ are being investigated.

rasporg
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Sun Nov 11, 2018 12:38 pm

There went money down the toilet and not only with Raspberry. I lost money on this because I had to sent back the product to the shop and I kept the loss low by not sending it assured. Then I could have just trew in the bin because that is very expenceive...sending it back assured.

I have received the paid amount back but not the costs of sending back to the shop.

jamesh
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Sun Nov 11, 2018 1:03 pm

rasporg wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 12:38 pm
There went money down the toilet and not only with Raspberry. I lost money on this because I had to sent back the product to the shop and I kept the loss low by not sending it assured. Then I could have just trew in the bin because that is very expenceive...sending it back assured.

I have received the paid amount back but not the costs of sending back to the shop.
It's down to the shop of course, but I woudl hope they would refund the return costs.

Did yours go missing in the post?
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rasporg
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Re: PoE HAT - USB Ports not working - over-current

Sun Nov 11, 2018 4:29 pm

If my shipment would have been lost in the post I would not received any money back. The shop does not offer a "Antwoordnummer" so shipping back is coming out of the pocket of buyer. With an "Antwoordnummer" the shop pay for shipping and the buyer gets proof that the package is shipped.

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