msramadan1
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:22 pm

LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:25 pm

Hey,
I'm a graduate student, wanna make an LTE-4G signal strength and performance measurement by Raspberry pi.
I don't have enough knowledge or experience about RF signals.
I'm just looking for a sensor that I can use with Raspberry Pi to measure the signal strength. :D

Brandon92
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Mon Aug 13, 2018 4:38 pm

msramadan1 wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:25 pm
Hey,
I'm a graduate student, wanna make an LTE-4G signal strength and performance measurement by Raspberry pi.
Interesting project for a graduation student, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe this is a bachelor degree. And what's your education (electronics?, ..)
msramadan1 wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:25 pm
I don't have enough knowledge or experience about RF signals.
I'm just looking for a sensor that I can use with Raspberry Pi to measure the signal strength. :D
Because it is a bachelor degree, did you do any kind of research to this, or do you expect here to find a complete solution?

msramadan1
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:22 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:08 pm

Brandon92 wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 4:38 pm
msramadan1 wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:25 pm
Hey,
I'm a graduate student, wanna make an LTE-4G signal strength and performance measurement by Raspberry pi.
Interesting project for a graduation student, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe this is a bachelor degree. And what's your education (electronics?, ..)
msramadan1 wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:25 pm
I don't have enough knowledge or experience about RF signals.
I'm just looking for a sensor that I can use with Raspberry Pi to measure the signal strength. :D
Because it is a bachelor degree, did you do any kind of research to this, or do you expect here to find a complete solution?

Yes I'm graduate, and this is not the full project, it's just a section of it.
I don't want a full solution, and I don't have electronics background.

drgeoff
Posts: 8442
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:39 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:21 pm

You need to be more explicit about your meaning of signal strength.

In the same way that many radio stations broadcast on the AM band, in most countries the mobile/cellular bands have frequency ranges in those bands allocated to different mobile/cellular companies. And those different companies have their own base-stations which are not necessarily co-located. So the RF signal from one company can be at a significantly different level from that of another company. A simple signal strength sensor does not handle that.

msramadan1
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:22 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:36 pm

drgeoff wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:21 pm
You need to be more explicit about your meaning of signal strength.

In the same way that many radio stations broadcast on the AM band, in most countries the mobile/cellular bands have frequency ranges in those bands allocated to different mobile/cellular companies. And those different companies have their own base-stations which are not necessarily co-located. So the RF signal from one company can be at a significantly different level from that of another company. A simple signal strength sensor does not handle that.
Thank you drgeoff,
I don't have communications background but I worked on signal processing alot.
The signal strength parameters needed are the RSRP, RSSI, SNIR , Download/Upload speed.
I found many devices that are compatible with Matlab or Raspberry pi or both, but the give raw RF data frames.
I am not sure as I said I have no communications background , but do I have to get the raw signal to be able to calculate these parameters? and if I get this raw data, how to know to which company it belongs to? Also, Can I get download/upload speed by raw data calculations?

And the second idea , is to get the data after being received and LTE protocols applied , and you work with this received digital information, not the raw (analog) signal.

What do you think? which one of these explains better how things work?

Brandon92
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:40 pm

msramadan1 wrote: wanna make an LTE-4G signal strength and performance measurement by Raspberry pi.
drgeoff wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:21 pm
So the RF signal from one company can be at a significantly different level from that of another company.
And if you what to test this, you need to "buy" there services. To get access to there network.
You could also use a smartphone to test this.

msramadan1
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:22 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:47 pm

Brandon92 wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:40 pm
msramadan1 wrote: wanna make an LTE-4G signal strength and performance measurement by Raspberry pi.
drgeoff wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:21 pm
So the RF signal from one company can be at a significantly different level from that of another company.
And if you what to test this, you need to "buy" there services. To get access to there network.
You could also use a smartphone to test this.
I'm working on something fully developed in the university lab, the Navigation solution/Autopilot / RF signal mapping ... etc , all must be designed in the lab.
and about "buying" yes I will buy their SIM card to access their network.

Brandon92
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:49 pm

Okey, maybe this is interesting to take a close look at or to get some ideas from.

msramadan1
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:22 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Wed Aug 15, 2018 9:03 pm

Brandon92 wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:49 pm
Okey, maybe this is interesting to take a close look at or to get some ideas from.
Yes this is a good board , I talked to sixfab 1 weak ago and they were very helpful. Also I purchased this board and waiting it to arrive.

msramadan1
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:22 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:28 am

Can I please have a rough guideline that I can follow ? I am really confused

Brandon92
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:02 am

msramadan1 wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:28 am
Can I please have a rough guideline that I can follow ? I am really confused
What do you mean with that, if I can ask. Do you want to now how to connect your hardware?
Is it not possible to use a smartphone for this kind of thing? There are apps that can test you download/upload speed and the phone gives the signal strength out of the box?

msramadan1
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:22 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:22 pm

Brandon92 wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:02 am
msramadan1 wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:28 am
Can I please have a rough guideline that I can follow ? I am really confused
What do you mean with that, if I can ask. Do you want to now how to connect your hardware?
Is it not possible to use a smartphone for this kind of thing? There are apps that can test you download/upload speed and the phone gives the signal strength out of the box?
Smart Phone applications do not give full access on all signal parameters, Also our goal is research and making a platform that undergraduate students can use in other projects.

I have a confusion in:
1-The LTE signal in the air is just a certain type of electromagnetic signals, 2- and the signal after decoding by a modem or a receiver is some type of digital signals.
which one do I have to access in order to find all signal parameters?

Brandon92
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:47 pm

I'm not a expert on this, but I think you need both. If you use for example spectrum analyse you could find out how "strong" a signal is*. But you can't get acces to it. For that you need a 'decoder', like the one we mention. The signal that you will git from the module are probably digital. And what parameters that you could read out, depends on the module that you are using and you need to read the manual for that.

* I think the module can also provide this information to you.

msramadan1
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:22 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:54 pm

Brandon92 wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:47 pm
I'm not a expert on this, but I think you need both. If you use for example spectrum analyse you could find out how "strong" a signal is*. But you can't get acces to it. For that you need a 'decoder', like the one we mention. The signal that you will git from the module are probably digital. And what parameters that you could read out, depends on the module that you are using and you need to read the manual for that.

* I think the module can also provide this information to you.
Thank you Brandon for your explanation,
Do you have any idea about cheap but still effective Spectrum Analyser ?

Brandon92
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:07 pm

msramadan1 wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:54 pm
Thank you Brandon for your explanation,
Do you have any idea about cheap but still effective Spectrum Analyser ?
I also found this. And in this video it's looking very interesting for you. And a good spectrum analyser is a realy expansive peach of instrument.
And if there is one special measure instrument, there is probably also a other one somewhere.

You told us before that you are on a university, is there no spectrum analyser at you location, or somewhere else. Also some oscilloscope has a "build" in spectrum analyser. But not so good as a real one.

disclaimer, this is not my field of knowledge

drgeoff
Posts: 8442
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:39 pm

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:36 am

Brandon92 wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:07 pm
Also some oscilloscope has a "build" in spectrum analyser. But not so good as a real one.
Yes some digital storage scopes have a spectrum analyser function. However they do that by FFT on the sampled signal. The raw LTE RF signals are at a couple of GHz. If a digital scope exists that can do spectrum analysis on that it will be mega-expensive.

For real spectrum analyzers see eg https://www.keysight.com/en/pcx-x201500 ... =GB&lc=eng

Brandon92
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 9:29 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: LTE-4G signal strength measurement by Raspberry Pi

Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:08 pm

I was thinking. The product that I showed in my prevision post. Can see what for kind of networks there are. But, my (smart)phone is also capable of showing this kind of information. Or, at least the acces point.
msramadan1 wrote: Yes this is a good board , I talked to sixfab 1 weak ago and they were very helpful. Also I purchased this board and waiting it to arrive.
So, I think would be also possible with the module that you have purchased. But, I think you need to ask the seller, manual, datasheet,... to see if this is possible and how you can do it.

@drgeoff
I agree. But, I think to buy a spectrum analyzers for this project somewhat overkill and not needed.

@msramadan1
As we said the frequentie is high. The price for a good spectrum analyzers is also high.

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