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Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:28 am
by takitaki
Hiya, I'm trying to make a custom HAL between the hardware and the operating system, and Start.ELF is getting in my way... I'm trying to find documentation online but I'm not able to find it anywhere :(

Does anyone know where I can find the Start.ELF source code?

Thanks

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:34 am
by jamesh
Source code for start.elf is not available.

Try a more specific question in the bare metal forum, perhaps the people there can help you out with your problem.

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:49 am
by takitaki
jamesh wrote:Source code for start.elf is not available.
Is there any reason why this is the case?

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:06 am
by Ravenous
It's not owned by the foundation and isn't open source, as far as I'm aware.

See also these, which touch on the same sort of question:
http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=66126
http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewt ... f=7&t=5170

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:42 am
by jamesh
takitaki wrote:
jamesh wrote:Source code for start.elf is not available.
Is there any reason why this is the case?
Ravenous is correct, it's closed source and proprietary. It's the firmware that runs and controls the GPU, so is not ARM code anyway.

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Sun Jun 14, 2015 4:23 pm
by kriss
bootcode.bin is said to be gpu code to make the bcm look as an arm
it have an elf loader in it
start.elf is run after and is a elf object of unknown arch so objdump refuse to disasm it
(well open source is for profit)
it should have some arm code in some of the 41 sections
if you know hex you should use a hex viewer
and make an open-source clone more friendly with bare-metal

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Sun Jun 14, 2015 4:39 pm
by kriss
using strings on it show it was made on 2009
and is full of craps that look as a partial shell

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Sun Jun 14, 2015 5:55 pm
by kriss
hehehe
a longer read with less tell me that the foundation (here) have some code in it
it support audio & video encoding
it can open ports
it report to a remote operator
it could be used as a backdoor for dvd piracy in cluster and ...

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 4:56 am
by ShiftPlusOne
kriss wrote:a longer read with less tell me that the foundation (here) have some code in it
Lots of it, but of course that doesn't mean they can release it. They're the ones that maintain this particular branch of it.
kriss wrote:it report to a remote operator
It does or it can? If 'does', how did you determine that? If 'can', what's your point?

Easy enough to sniff the packets and see if it does anything you don't ask it to do.

As I understand it, it started long before Linux ran on VC SoCs, so it pretty much has its own OS, which can do hell of a lot. So if you find a network stack or some parts thereof, that's not particularly surprising or interesting.

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:36 am
by kriss
it's not possible to know if it does wake from power off with the electricity of ethernet without tools i cant make (i'm handicapped)
my point is it should be better ;)
bootcode.bin and start.elf should be merged without craps code to support anything else than the board
do you thinks all those printf messages to report failures or not to a port that i don't ask to open are in it just for not null padding ???
the size of merged clean code should be 10%
it should work faster
it should include a a.out loader for asm exec without shared lib
thanks

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:37 am
by ShiftPlusOne
And it should come with a pony. Unfortunately, it doesn't.

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:40 am
by jamesh
It should also make sandwiches.

On the other hand - it works. That should be a good enough reason to leave it alone. It a great bane of software that people think a quick rewrite to fix up/tidy something that already works is a good way to spend money...it almost always takes much longer than expected, introduces new bugs, and generally doesn't deliver the improvements expected.

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:47 am
by DougieLawson
jamesh wrote: On the other hand - it works. That should be a good enough reason to leave it alone. It a great bane of software that people think a quick rewrite to fix up/tidy something that already works is a good way to spend money...it almost always takes much longer than expected, introduces new bugs, and generally doesn't deliver the improvements expected.
Even re-writing old code to add new function (rather than just a pointless fix up/tidy) is guaranteed to introduce new bugs. I can't knock it solving bugs paid my mortgage off.

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:51 am
by kriss
well
i have nothing to do with the no-future peoples you are here : i quit forever this forum and never buy again *berry* things

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:52 am
by PeterO
RFC 2119 :
"SHOULD This word, or the adjective "RECOMMENDED", mean that there
may exist valid reasons in particular circumstances to ignore a
particular item, but the full implications must be understood and
carefully weighed before choosing a different course."

PeterO

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:56 am
by fruitoftheloom
kriss wrote:well
i have nothing to do with the no-future peoples you are here : i quit forever this forum and never buy again *berry* things
Please close the exit door quietly, otherwise it may wake us up ;)

Maybe an AllWiiner Product is more your cup of tea :?:

http://www.element14.com/community/thre ... iendly-soc

Re: Where can I find the Start.ELF source code?

Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2015 1:01 pm
by jamesh
And before it all goes pear shaped, let's take a break.