dmikester1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:19 pm

RPi 3 not booting after updates

Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:20 pm

So I loaded the latest Buster image onto my Raspberry Pi 3 last night. I plugged it in and turned it on and it booted right up into the OS. I ran through the initial config and then it said it needed to download updates. I was using this over wifi. I told it to get the updates. It took a bit then said it had an issue getting all the updates and that it needed to reboot. I rebooted and it never came back up. When I power it on, I get the red light but nothing on the display. Any ideas what happened or what is going on? I am guessing the OS got hosed up somehow. I will probably try and reformat and reimage the sd card tonight unless someone here has a better idea. I thought Linux was supposed to be pretty rock solid. But so far my experience with the RPi has been that it feels very fragile. The reason I am reloading the OS is that it was no longer booting due to some error.
Thanks!
Mike

RonR
Posts: 516
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:29 pm
Location: US

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Wed Aug 21, 2019 10:11 pm

dmikester1 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:20 pm
So I loaded the latest Buster image onto my Raspberry Pi 3 last night. I plugged it in and turned it on and it booted right up into the OS. I ran through the initial config and then it said it needed to download updates. I was using this over wifi. I told it to get the updates. It took a bit then said it had an issue getting all the updates and that it needed to reboot. I rebooted and it never came back up. When I power it on, I get the red light but nothing on the display. Any ideas what happened or what is going on? I am guessing the OS got hosed up somehow.

FWIW...

I just tried to reproduce your problem here and everything went fine. The update issue you experienced must have left things awry. Starting over is probably your only option. If it happens again, then it's time for concern.
dmikester1 wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:20 pm
I will probably try and reformat and reimage the sd card tonight unless someone here has a better idea. I thought Linux was supposed to be pretty rock solid. But so far my experience with the RPi has been that it feels very fragile. The reason I am reloading the OS is that it was no longer booting due to some error.

It's a waste of time to reformat prior to reimaging. Writing an image to an SD card or USB device wipes out everything during the process.

I've been running Raspberry Pi's (1/2/3/4) for over 6 years now and they've all been rock solid as long as you use good media (SD cards/USB mass storage devices), use an adequate power supply, and don't let the power fail (mine are all on UPS's with software installed to shut the Raspberry Pi's down if the UPS is about exhausted).

ProDigit
Posts: 374
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:24 am

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Wed Aug 21, 2019 10:57 pm

Probably an error in the boot sector.
My recommendation is to write the image, do the preliminary install, no updates, and then reconfigure the VRAM (personally I set it to 32MB, as I don't need more), and finally do the overclocking in /boot/config.txt.

Then reboot, and after reboot, use apt to update your Pi.
I have found apt to do a better job than the included Pi GUI updater.

User avatar
rpdom
Posts: 15214
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 5:17 am
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UK

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:18 pm

ProDigit wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 10:57 pm
Probably an error in the boot sector.
What boot sector? That's a PC concept and means nothing to a Pi.
My recommendation is to write the image, do the preliminary install, no updates, and then reconfigure the VRAM (personally I set it to 32MB, as I don't need more), and finally do the overclocking in /boot/config.txt.
By "VRAM" do you mean GPU memory? The optimum for a desktop session on a Pi 0-3 is about 64MB.unless you are doing heavy video encoding/decoding or using the Pi camera. The Pi 4 uses a different memory configuration.
I have found apt to do a better job than the included Pi GUI updater.
I believe the GUI uses apt behind the scenes.

RonR
Posts: 516
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:29 pm
Location: US

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:26 am

ProDigit wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 10:57 pm
and finally do the overclocking in /boot/config.txt.

What rpdom said.

And where did overclocking come into the OP's issue.

ProDigit
Posts: 374
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:24 am

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:45 am

It helps with slower pis installing updates quicker. Just a trick to help speed up the installation, not a solution to the problem.
The title says it's a Pi3, so I presume Pi 3a+ or B model (non B+).

Perhaps boot sector wasn't the right wording, should be boot files.

RonR
Posts: 516
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:29 pm
Location: US

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:51 am

ProDigit wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:45 am
It helps with slower pis installing updates quicker. Just a trick to help speed up the installation, not a solution to the problem.

Overclocking prior to getting a stable system up and running and backed up is a terrible idea.

dmikester1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:19 pm

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:11 pm

Just wanted to check back in and give an update and answer some of the questions.

First of all, I reflashed the card last night with that spiffy Etcher tool. Thanks to RonR for the tip about not need to reformat first, saves me some time! Then I plugged it in and booted it up. Ran through the initial config but this time skipped the updates in the config. Rebooted. It came back up! Then I manually downloaded the updates with the apt-get commands. Installed my Unifi controller software and I think I'm ready to rock!

That's a great idea about the UPS RonR. Is there a good small cheap one that you recommend? I imagine for the Pi, I don't need to go plunking down $100 on a massive heavy UPS.

As far as which version of the 3 it is, I honestly can't remember which one I bought. I have it in a case so don't want to open it up really. Is there anyway to tell right from inside the OS which version I have?

Last question, and this might require a whole new thread, but can anyone tell me why it always seems so laggy? I click and then I usually wait for a second or 2 or 3 before the action happens. Someone mentioned overclocking, would that help? Makes me want to go out and buy the 4 in hopes that it won't be so laggy. But I thought the 3 had good enough specs that it could be used for basic web browsing. I guess I had sometimes up to 5 or 6 tabs open in Chromium.

fruitoftheloom
Posts: 20746
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 12:40 pm
Location: Delightful Dorset

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:32 pm

dmikester1 wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:11 pm
As far as which version of the 3 it is, I honestly can't remember which one I bought. I have it in a case so don't want to open it up really. Is there anyway to tell right from inside the OS which version I have?

https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentati ... /README.md
Retired disgracefully.....

User avatar
rpdom
Posts: 15214
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 5:17 am
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UK

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:37 pm

dmikester1 wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:11 pm
As far as which version of the 3 it is, I honestly can't remember which one I bought. I have it in a case so don't want to open it up really. Is there anyway to tell right from inside the OS which version I have?

Code: Select all

[email protected]:~ $ cat /proc/device-tree/model ;echo
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B Rev 1.2

[email protected]:~ $ cat /proc/device-tree/model ;echo
Raspberry Pi 3 Model B Plus Rev 1.3

RonR
Posts: 516
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:29 pm
Location: US

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:54 pm

dmikester1 wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:11 pm
That's a great idea about the UPS RonR. Is there a good small cheap one that you recommend? I imagine for the Pi, I don't need to go plunking down $100 on a massive heavy UPS.

I use a CyberPower CP1350PFCLCD managed by NUT. This UPS powers not only several Raspberry Pi's but everything Internet related (modem, router, switches, etc.). One of the Raspberry Pi's is a VoIP PBX and the UPS can keep my phone service up through about 1.5 hours of power outage.

ProDigit
Posts: 374
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:24 am

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:38 pm

RonR wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:51 am
ProDigit wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:45 am
It helps with slower pis installing updates quicker. Just a trick to help speed up the installation, not a solution to the problem.

Overclocking prior to getting a stable system up and running and backed up is a terrible idea.
Not really.
As long as it's a stable overclock, it can't harm. It only installs (extracts & processes) the updates faster.

As soon as the Pi (Buster) gets all it's updates installed, the overclock will be overwritten to stock (after reboot) anyway, so you can do it again.

User avatar
PeterO
Posts: 5023
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 4:14 pm

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Thu Aug 22, 2019 10:00 pm

ProDigit wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:38 pm
RonR wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:51 am
ProDigit wrote:
Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:45 am
It helps with slower pis installing updates quicker. Just a trick to help speed up the installation, not a solution to the problem.

Overclocking prior to getting a stable system up and running and backed up is a terrible idea.
Not really.
Yes, really !
As long as it's a stable overclock,
And therein lies your mistake. To assume a PI is going to be stable when over clocked just shows how inexperienced you are. Adding another unknown when first setting up a system is "A really bad idea" (tm).

Also how do you propose someone sets up overclocking ? Are you prepared to tell them how to edit the config files on the boot partition on the SDcard using their Windows box ? Are you prepared to answer all the questions from people who follow you (misguided) instructions and then find their PI doesn't boot ?

At this stage the installation process really has to be kept as straightforward as possible to minimise the number of "My Pi doesn't boot" threads on here started by new users.

PeterO
Discoverer of the PI2 XENON DEATH FLASH!
Interests: C,Python,PIC,Electronics,Ham Radio (G0DZB),1960s British Computers.
"The primary requirement (as we've always seen in your examples) is that the code is readable. " Dougie Lawson

ProDigit
Posts: 374
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:24 am

Re: RPi 3 not booting after updates

Sat Aug 24, 2019 4:02 am

Anyone who can find out how to overclock the Pi, will more than likely have knowledge on how to do it, and the consequences of it.

Installing updates, just like running the Pi, on an overclock can be done without issues.

Also, concerning to a comment made before, the updating process of the GUI is quite different, and more lengthy than updating from apt.
While it may use apt in the background, the way it handles it, is a lot slower than using the terminal.
About 18-80x slower on regular Class 3-10 microSD cards, as well as on older USB 2.0 drives. (this without overclocking)

Return to “Troubleshooting”