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Imperf3kt
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:35 am

Gavinmc42 wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 2:10 am
They are not very good in small sizes, any friction stops them.
You can increase the power output by increasing the gas pressure.
That's how the power generator ones work.
This design here appears to work well and looks small enough to fit on a Pi SOC

https://youtu.be/hHZD4UcazHo

Granted, it uses a heat source of 800°C
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Gavinmc42
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:59 am

Those low temperature Stirling's use a foam polystyrene displacer piston and graphite power piston.
We use a cup of boiled water < 100C. Still too hot.

Based on my experience with miniaturizing PCR's, an alum heatsink and fan are just easier and simpler.
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Raspberries are not Apples or Oranges

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Imperf3kt
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:28 am

Gavinmc42 wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:59 am
Based on my experience with miniaturizing PCR's, an alum heatsink and fan are just easier and simpler.
True, but where's the fun in that?

I've got a bunch of material I could use to construct a miniature stirling engine, might give this a try.
Not for efficiency or practicality, but rather just for the novel aspect of it; a Pi cooled by its own excess heat.

Maybe even coat the piston with a starlite like material
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Gavinmc42
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:13 am

Thermal diode, they only allow heat to flow one way.
I'm dancing on Rainbows.
Raspberries are not Apples or Oranges

pepeEL
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:34 am

After update this firmware speed USB dont slow down ?

kflmiami420
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Joined: Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:54 pm

Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:24 am

Ran my pi 4 1gig with the

while true; do vcgencmd measure_clock arm; vcgencmd measure_temp; sleep 10; done& stress -c 4 -t 900s

for ten minutes
and
then

while true; do vcgencmd measure_clock arm; vcgencmd measure_temp; sleep 10; done& ./cpuburn-a53

from ( https://core-electronics.com.au/tutoria ... ry-pi.html)

logged with

https://github.com/darrell24015/tempmon

seeing temps in the 55 - 61 passive cooling small rpi3 heatsink not doing much video more data collecting

dksamuel
Posts: 6
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:42 am

I cut the case on top and attached a fan, drilled holes on top bottom and sides and now the temperature is 35 C (without 4K) earlier it was 85, definitely cooling helps.
Rpi4_temp.png
Rpi4_temp.png (38.23 KiB) Viewed 1711 times
:)

dksamuel
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:08 am

Even with 4K processing, with a fan, the temperature remains 35, I suggest that all Rp4 have a fan mounted on the case
Rpi4_temp1.png
Rpi4_temp1.png (31.25 KiB) Viewed 1664 times

jamesh
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:00 am

The Pi4 I run on my desk has no case, no fan, and runs well. If you case it up, I would suggest a fan is the best option for best performance, although you don't NEED to have one it will make things faster.
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martinrowan
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:27 am

jamesh wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:00 am
... If you case it up, I would suggest a fan is the best option for best performance, although you don't NEED to have one if will make things faster.
I disagree, James, Sorry. If you case it up in the fully enclosed Pi 4 Case and intend to try and use the Pi like a Linux PC with its dual displays, then the constant temperature warning symbol isn't really viable.

For non-PC desktop-like uses that aren't performance sensitive the remaining outstanding issue with the Pi 4 fully enclosed is that the exposed metal parts get really hot (> 60°C)

So I'd say in an eclosure the Pi 4 does need some active cooling.
I'm sure there are guidelines/requirements for the maximum temperature of surfaces which can be touched before they need to have warning labels too. Should this apply to a fully enclosed Pi 4?

Update: Yep apparently IEC 60950-1 (2005), is the most common standard for consumer electronic devices. Pretty sure the Pi 4 is a tad close to these thresholds.
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bensimmo
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:03 pm

80C which is what mines sits at with a browser open (no case). These should have a warning in schools* it can burn, so CodeClubs, jams etc should be the same.
Else that place may have H&S problems.
This was from our last talk.



*I do need to check on this, I don't know the law just the information we are provided with, but it is the place using it to supply the Risk Assessment, not RPT.
i.e. get an 11 year old to stick their finger (they will do this since they will do it to solder iron tips to see if it is on...)
See what they say, if it ouch I need to go to the nurse, run it under a tap etc...you know the answer. P.S. not a recommended method.but you probably don't need to ask them as they prod around.

RPT for their kit provide a case.

jamesh
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:18 pm

bensimmo wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:03 pm
80C which is what mines sits at with a browser open (no case). These should have a warning in schools* it can burn, so CodeClubs, jams etc should be the same.
Else that place may have H&S problems.
This was from our last talk.



*I do need to check on this, I don't know the law just the information we are provided with, but it is the place using it to supply the Risk Assessment, not RPT.
i.e. get an 11 year old to stick their finger (they will do this since they will do it to solder iron tips to see if it is on...)
See what they say, if it ouch I need to go to the nurse, run it under a tap etc...you know the answer. P.S. not a recommended method.but you probably don't need to ask them as they prod around.

RPT for their kit provide a case.
80 with just a browser running seems odd when not in a case. Mine sits at about 55-60 in that state. Are you running 40p60? That bumps the temps a bit, and have you tried the lower power VLI firmware?
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phil995511
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:30 pm

pepeEL wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:34 am
After update this firmware speed USB dont slow down ?
With the frimware vl805_fw_0137a8.bin :

+/- 5% loss in data transmission speed with a SSD connected on USB 3 for me.

Crash disk/system if I connect a 2nd device (UBS key, etc.) on the 2nd USB 3 port.

I stopped testing it to get back to the firmware vl805_fw_013701.bin which does not create problems of system instability, even if the RPi 4 heats a little more...

Regards.

disappointed_tom
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:31 pm

Regarding a post on this thread. I trued to apply the temperature update on my PI 4, but this is the result i get

Code: Select all

[email protected]:~ $ cd Documents
[email protected]:~/Documents $ cd update
[email protected]:~/Documents/update $ unzip vl805_update_0137a8.zip
Archive:  vl805_update_0137a8.zip
  inflating: vl805                   
  inflating: vl805_fw_013701.bin     
  inflating: vl805_fw_0137a8.bin     
[email protected]:~/Documents/update $ chmod a+x vl805
[email protected]:~/Documents/update $ sudo ./vl805 -w vl805_fw_0137a8.bin
sudo: ./vl805: command not found
[email protected]:~/Documents/update $ 


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HawaiianPi
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:36 pm

I finally received my 2GB model (4GB still on back-order) and I'm using it in a case like this:
2layer_acrylic_case.jpg
2layer_acrylic_case.jpg (39.3 KiB) Viewed 1297 times

I was using this case on a couple of Pi3 computers before they got moved into Flirc cases, and because it's open sided it fits the Pi 4B fine. I had replaced the loud fan with a quiet Noctua and it stays nice and cool with no heatsink and very little noise (you have to be pretty close to hear it).

My temps barely pass 40C under typical loads (web, youtube, etc). This will work great until my pre-ordered Pi4 Flirc arrives.

I'm using the old 2.5A Raspberry Pi Universal Power Supply with a Volutz micro-USB to USB-C adapter, and that works fine as well, even when hybrid booting from SD with the OS on a USB 3.0 SSD. This will do until the USB-boot firmware drops, and it will be easy to switch to pure USB boot when that happens.

I'll be doing more testing and perhaps a tutorial or two after I deal with some other nonsense I've got going on in my life right now.
My mind is like a browser. 27 tabs are open, 9 aren't responding,
lots of pop-ups...and where is that annoying music coming from?

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bensimmo
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:54 pm

jamesh wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:18 pm
bensimmo wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:03 pm
80C which is what mines sits at with a browser open (no case). These should have a warning in schools* it can burn, so CodeClubs, jams etc should be the same.
Else that place may have H&S problems.
This was from our last talk.



*I do need to check on this, I don't know the law just the information we are provided with, but it is the place using it to supply the Risk Assessment, not RPT.
i.e. get an 11 year old to stick their finger (they will do this since they will do it to solder iron tips to see if it is on...)
See what they say, if it ouch I need to go to the nurse, run it under a tap etc...you know the answer. P.S. not a recommended method.but you probably don't need to ask them as they prod around.

RPT for their kit provide a case.
80 with just a browser running seems odd when not in a case. Mine sits at about 55-60 in that state. Are you running 40p60? That bumps the temps a bit, and have you tried the lower power VLI firmware?
I've not tried the newer firmware, mention of poor usb performance so I await an official version release. Saying that I've not followed every update on the forum so not sure if that was fixed.

Just low resolution video pushed it that high or some slightly involved website.
Max would be 1080p output as that's all the TV is capable of.

Ethernet made it even worse so I switch back to WiFi.
I'm just waiting till updates come along.

It's unfortunate as I do know lots of people who a have been out off buying these. :-(
I know the enthusiastic people on here, myself included and many others are buying but it's getting a bad rep in the headlines and that's not good :-(
Facebook groups don't look pretty either, they just read the headlines then repeat them to every comment

Ah the joys of being a popular product.

At the moment it's just been sat at the command line from boot and left all day doing absolutely nothing.
uHDMI, PSU, Logitech wireless usb thing in it and uSD.
60C is the reported temp.
It is completely open to the air away from most things, other then the backside.

I'll run an apt update as there are 24 updates again.
Chromium and various rpi_things.

Edit
Still 60/61 at terminal only.


----
Edit2
Grabbed a fan from an old cooler, 12V but works easily at 5V.
And this angle gave coolest setup to others (about 38/39C idle desktop which is a few deg less than above and to the side)

Using the fan
For reference for others with ram usage.
Amazon Prime in Vivaldi streaming The Grank Tour 4K, outputting to 1080p and it 44/45C

(So full screen background)
And with Scratch3 lamas vs something with music and it hits 50C
Add in Minecraft pi, (no difference)
Add in libre office Calc
Thonny
All four cores dancing around on htop and 1.56G of ram in use, no swap in use (4G. Version)

Fan of and it rises to 65, hovers with very gentle rise to 70C
Its not as rapid as I once was.
Stick a certain fibo let's of digits and give 4784969 an extra 0 at the end to keep it busy.
There goes 80C
(Fan soon brings it down and everything runs a bit smoother).
PhotoPictureResizer_190711_205148237-926x711.jpg
PhotoPictureResizer_190711_205148237-926x711.jpg (209.09 KiB) Viewed 1247 times




So these really do just need a bit of airflow, that adds more cost.

dksamuel
Posts: 6
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:34 am

jamesh wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:00 am
The Pi4 I run on my desk has no case, no fan, and runs well. If you case it up, I would suggest a fan is the best option for best performance, although you don't NEED to have one it will make things faster.
Please check the temperature, it will be minimum 78-85 centigrade. Open the case it will become 65, use a fan and it comes to 35. Raspi4 definitely runs hot

dksamuel
Posts: 6
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:08 am

using a 12V simple fan setup the temp is really low in Pi4
Annotation 2019-07-12 123224.jpg
Annotation 2019-07-12 123224.jpg (23.99 KiB) Viewed 1075 times
IMG_20190712_122246.jpg
IMG_20190712_122246.jpg (226.87 KiB) Viewed 1075 times

techjesse
Posts: 4
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:55 am

My Pi4 4GB Ram :)

Code: Select all

[email protected]:~ $ sudo vcgencmd measure_temp
temp=33.0'C

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Imperf3kt
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:22 am

dksamuel wrote:
Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:34 am
jamesh wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:00 am
The Pi4 I run on my desk has no case, no fan, and runs well. If you case it up, I would suggest a fan is the best option for best performance, although you don't NEED to have one it will make things faster.
Please check the temperature, it will be minimum 78-85 centigrade. Open the case it will become 65, use a fan and it comes to 35. Raspi4 definitely runs hot
Jamesh is well aware of what temperature the Pi4b runs at, having had one (or several) for much longer than you or I.
He is an employee of the people who made the device after all
55:55:44:44:4C
52:4C:52:42:41

galicin
Posts: 11
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 10:49 am

I did pre-order this - https://geekworm.com/collections/new-ar ... tive-shell (will share results once I have it).
Image

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RaTTuS
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:19 am

How To ask Questions :- http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
WARNING - some parts of this post may be erroneous YMMV

1QC43qbL5FySu2Pi51vGqKqxy3UiJgukSX
Covfefe

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Gavinmc42
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:28 am

Is that going into space?
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Raspberries are not Apples or Oranges

Seketh
Posts: 2
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:36 am

I'm currently using a pibow case with a heatsink. I was idling at 71ºC :o It's quite hot around here, ambient temperature is about ~25ºC. Heatsink is burning hot to touch.

I tried the USB firmware and it worked, it's now averaging at about 65.º while idle. Note that I have 4k HDMI enabled. I'm still seeing 100mb/s on file transfers to a USB 3 hdd over smb, so apparently I have no issues so far with the alpha firmware.I'm not seeing how else I can reduce idle temperatures. I disabled Wi-Fi and BT, but that offers no temperature drop at all.

Has anyone tried undervolting, and have you observed any significant effect? I had undervolting before on a Pi 3A+, but even over_voltage=-1 made it unstable at full load.

alphanumeric
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Re: Raspberry Pi 4 temperature

Fri Jul 12, 2019 1:24 pm

54 c here after doing update upgrade, ambient is 22 c. No case, no heatsink, no fan. Four short stand offs for feet. No config.txt edits etc. Stock Buster install.

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