mstiles92
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Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Mon Jan 25, 2016 2:24 am

I picked up my Pi Zero with a copy of the MagPi from a local store, and just got around to setting it up today. I am having an issue with getting any USB devices to work on the device. I have tried various devices and adapters, and none of them allow any sort of input from a mouse or keyboard.

For reference, here is what I have tried using:

OTG Adapters:
MicroUSB OTG Shim Adapter from Pimoroni (https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/usb- ... erter-shim)
MicroUSB Ethernet adapter with powered 3-port USB hub (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00L32UUJK)
Generic MicroUSB OTG adapter

Peripherals:
Logitech K400r wireless keyboard/mouse combo
Logitech Performance MX mouse
Generic Dell keyboard
Razer Mamba Tournament Edition
Razer Blackwidow Chroma

I have tried every combination of the above OTG Adapters and Peripherals, and none of register any input with this Pi Zero. I have tried a couple different MicroSD cards, and tried both NOOBS and straight Raspbian images. It always boots up to either the NOOBS installation interface or the Raspbian desktop, but no input is registered from any of the above devices. I am using the correct data USB port on the Pi Zero (the one closer to the HDMI port).

Is there anything else I can try to get this working, or do I appear to have a dead microUSB port? If it is dead, how would I go about getting a replacement?

mstiles92
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 4:35 pm

Just a quick update:

I have 2 of the official Raspberry Pi power supplies I have tried with this. I also took it to work today and tried one of my coworkers' generic OTG adapters with various mice and keyboards we have at the office, and still nothing seems to be working on that Micro USB port.

Is there anyone I can contact about getting a replacement Raspberry Pi Zero? I wouldn't mind purchasing a new one, but they are obviously out of stock everywhere I have seen.

weissjd
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 4:45 pm

Silly question, but you're sure you're not plugging power into data and data into power? You can power the Zero off either port but only the data port will work with a USB device.

Assuming that's not the issue, post the output of running lsusb from the terminal.

Massi
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 4:49 pm

mstiles92 wrote:Is there anyone I can contact about getting a replacement Raspberry Pi Zero
yes, your reseller.

mstiles92
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 5:09 pm

weissjd wrote:Silly question, but you're sure you're not plugging power into data and data into power? You can power the Zero off either port but only the data port will work with a USB device.

Assuming that's not the issue, post the output of running lsusb from the terminal.
Yes, I am using the correct USB port. I'm not able to run any commands, since nothing has ever worked on that port.

mstiles92
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 5:10 pm

Massi wrote:
mstiles92 wrote:Is there anyone I can contact about getting a replacement Raspberry Pi Zero
yes, your reseller.
I got it from the MagPi issue that I purchased at a local shop. Would I contact the MagPi people then?

Mikemo
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 6:14 pm

Have you tried connecting the keyboard/mouse combo directly to the Pi without using a hub?
I had terrible trouble getting a usb hub that would work with my Pi Zero. Directly connected the keyboard/mouse would work. Through the hub it would not. I finally got a belkin hub and it works fine. That was the fourth hub I tried. The first three did not.
If your problem is the same as mine, your Pi is probably fine. You just need the "right" hub.
Good luck.

mstiles92
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 6:54 pm

Mikemo wrote:Have you tried connecting the keyboard/mouse combo directly to the Pi without using a hub?
I had terrible trouble getting a usb hub that would work with my Pi Zero. Directly connected the keyboard/mouse would work. Through the hub it would not. I finally got a belkin hub and it works fine. That was the fourth hub I tried. The first three did not.
If your problem is the same as mine, your Pi is probably fine. You just need the "right" hub.
Good luck.
Yeah, I have tried the keyboard/mouse combo (which worked fine on my 4 rpi 2B and original B models) directly connected via 3 different microUSB adapters with no luck. I tested these adapters on my tablet and they worked fine as well, so I doubt the adapters are faulty. Guess I'll just keep throwing adapters at it and see if I can get something working.

MaxK1
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 7:25 pm

Latest and greatest firmware installed?
You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
When General Failure and Major Disaster get together, Private Parts usually suffers.

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mahjongg
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Tue Jan 26, 2016 7:29 pm

Read the boot problem sticky, it has supplements about the zero, testing the zero on a PC to see if the USB port is "alive".
Testing WITHOUT a SD-card, so JUST the zero powered from the PC.

mstiles92
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:11 am

mahjongg wrote:Read the boot problem sticky, it has supplements about the zero, testing the zero on a PC to see if the USB port is "alive".
Testing WITHOUT a SD-card, so JUST the zero powered from the PC.
I just tested this with a few different cables plugged in to the data port of the Pi Zero, and none of them registered a new device on my PC. I guess the port is dead after all.

Disappointing, considering how hard it is going to be to find a replacement in stock. Thanks for the help anyways.

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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Wed Jan 27, 2016 9:24 am

Have you built your SDCard with NOOBS 1.5 or Raspbian 2015-11-21? Because it won't work with earlier versions of Raspbian because the kernel/firmware doesn't have the drivers to support the PiZero.
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Mithrandir
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:42 am

My first zero had a dry joint on the power pin to the usb. no 5V to the bus. easy fix. are you getting a connection from the 0V, 5V and data pins, there are 3 test pads underneath
PP1 USB +5V Input
PP6 GND
PP22 USB D+
PP23 USB D-
worth 30 seconds to buzz out with a meter.

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mahjongg
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:13 pm

mstiles92 wrote:
mahjongg wrote:Read the boot problem sticky, it has supplements about the zero, testing the zero on a PC to see if the USB port is "alive".
Testing WITHOUT a SD-card, so JUST the zero powered from the PC.
I just tested this with a few different cables plugged in to the data port of the Pi Zero, and none of them registered a new device on my PC. I guess the port is dead after all.

Disappointing, considering how hard it is going to be to find a replacement in stock. Thanks for the help anyways.
There is still no independent reports whether this "trick" really works, can somebody with a zero try it, and tell us what happens, I would do it myself, but I am very busy.
By the way, availability of the zero seems to be improving.
and yes, checking the USB connector for solder problems seems appropriate.

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rpdom
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:26 pm

mahjongg wrote:There is still no independent reports whether this "trick" really works, can somebody with a zero try it, and tell us what happens, I would do it myself, but I am very busy.
By the way, availability of the zero seems to be improving.
and yes, checking the USB connector for solder problems seems appropriate.
I don't have a Zero, but I do have an A that I can't get to boot. So I wired a USB-USB lead up and plugged it into my laptop without and SD card

Code: Select all

[email protected]:~$ lsusb
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 003 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 004 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 002 Device 002: ID 1241:1166 Belkin MI-2150 Trust Mouse
Bus 004 Device 005: ID 0a5c:2763 Broadcom Corp. 
and there it is. I even tried the rpiboot program and that recognised it and loaded the storage code.

Apart from the socket, the USB side of the A and the Zero are the same, so I expect it would work.

drgeoff
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Wed Jan 27, 2016 3:27 pm

mahjongg wrote:
mstiles92 wrote:
mahjongg wrote:Read the boot problem sticky, it has supplements about the zero, testing the zero on a PC to see if the USB port is "alive".
Testing WITHOUT a SD-card, so JUST the zero powered from the PC.
I just tested this with a few different cables plugged in to the data port of the Pi Zero, and none of them registered a new device on my PC. I guess the port is dead after all.

Disappointing, considering how hard it is going to be to find a replacement in stock. Thanks for the help anyways.
There is still no independent reports whether this "trick" really works, can somebody with a zero try it, and tell us what happens, I would do it myself, but I am very busy.
By the way, availability of the zero seems to be improving.
and yes, checking the USB connector for solder problems seems appropriate.
I can confirm the "trick" really works with a Zero.

Windows 7 Device Manager reports a "BCM2708 Boot" under Other Devices.

Linux (Mint) lsusb reports "ID 0a5c:2763 Broadcom Corp" (same as reported by rpdom for an A).

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mahjongg
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Wed Jan 27, 2016 6:39 pm

Thanks guys, then I think I will keep it in the boot problem sticky, and make a (mental) note that it also works with the A (and probably also with the A+).

I do have some hesitation on the need to have a USB-A to USB-A type of cable for an A (or A+), AFAIK for good reasons they do not exist!
So did you make your own one?

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rpdom
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Wed Jan 27, 2016 7:44 pm

mahjongg wrote:I do have some hesitation on the need to have a USB-A to USB-A type of cable for an A (or A+), AFAIK for good reasons they do not exist!
So did you make your own one?
Well, because I suspected this A was dead, I just soldered a USB A lead from and old mouse directly on to the USB port pins. The fact that it responded show that the BCM2835 is OK, but it still won't read the SD card. New card slot didn't help. :(

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mahjongg
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Thu Jan 28, 2016 12:23 pm

Strange. there are just 6 resistors in between the SoC and the card holder that could be broken (R35 to R40), nothing more.
Doesn't it boot at all? The SoC cannot be dead, or it would not respond!

I wrote in the sticky you needed an USB-A to USB-A cable, and described how to make one yourself, perhaps I better add a warning to destroy the cable after the test, as such a cable can be dangerous!

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rpdom
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Thu Jan 28, 2016 1:23 pm

It's not something I'm that worried about. I pretty much gave up on it some time ago. The other A I bought at the same time is still working perfectly.

One of the resistors did go missing when I removed the old card slot - I must have nudged it with the soldering iron, but I've replaced it and tested the correct resistance between the slot pins and the traces between the resistors and the SoC, so everything seems to be right.

Now I'm rechecking, and I think I might have found a bad track between one of the resistors and the socket, although I can't get any reading on the resistor itself. It should be 33R, but is reading open circuit. Maybe I'll whip that off and try replacing it. (R50 on SD_DATA1).

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mahjongg
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Thu Jan 28, 2016 6:42 pm

Yeah you should be able to measure it. By the way, the resistors are just for a bit of safety (and perhaps for EMC), so you can probably "replace" them with a solder bridge if you don't have a replacement resistor.

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rpdom
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Thu Jan 28, 2016 6:53 pm

I need a more powerful magnifier. My old eyes aren't great at this sort of thing now :(

I think I managed to test that resistor again and it was OK. I really need a closer look at the connections.

Oh well, I had written that Pi off anyway, so no problem if I don't get it working again. It was just interesting to check the USB thing on it. :)

gregeric
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Thu Jan 28, 2016 9:44 pm

mahjongg wrote:There is still no independent reports whether this "trick" really works, can somebody with a zero try it, and tell us what happens, I would do it myself, but I am very busy.
By the way, availability of the zero seems to be improving.
and yes, checking the USB connector for solder problems seems appropriate.
What, you didn't believe me? ;)

No voodoo, it's stuff that's been published for a while, you'd have come across it if you had an opportunity to play with the compute module:
https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentati ... lashing.md
https://github.com/raspberrypi/tools/tr ... er/usbboot

Edited to add: I think the 6 resistors on D0-D3, CMD & CLK are for impedance matching / signal integrity. It does contionue to work with 0 ohm / solder bridges though.

mstiles92
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Sat Jan 30, 2016 4:52 am

weissjd wrote:Silly question, but you're sure you're not plugging power into data and data into power? You can power the Zero off either port but only the data port will work with a USB device.

Assuming that's not the issue, post the output of running lsusb from the terminal.
Ok, so I bought a USB to serial adapter to troubleshoot this a bit more, and have been able to get in to the serial command line with it on the Zero with a fresh Raspbian install. I plugged in several different USB devices with several different adapters again, and every time I run lsusb, here is what I get:

Code: Select all

[email protected]:~$ lsusb
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
Here is the full verbose output:

Code: Select all

[email protected]:~$ lsusb -v

Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
Couldn't open device, some information will be missing
Device Descriptor:
  bLength                18
  bDescriptorType         1
  bcdUSB               2.00
  bDeviceClass            9 Hub
  bDeviceSubClass         0 Unused
  bDeviceProtocol         1 Single TT
  bMaxPacketSize0        64
  idVendor           0x1d6b Linux Foundation
  idProduct          0x0002 2.0 root hub
  bcdDevice            4.01
  iManufacturer           3
  iProduct                2
  iSerial                 1
  bNumConfigurations      1
  Configuration Descriptor:
    bLength                 9
    bDescriptorType         2
    wTotalLength           25
    bNumInterfaces          1
    bConfigurationValue     1
    iConfiguration          0
    bmAttributes         0xe0
      Self Powered
      Remote Wakeup
    MaxPower                0mA
    Interface Descriptor:
      bLength                 9
      bDescriptorType         4
      bInterfaceNumber        0
      bAlternateSetting       0
      bNumEndpoints           1
      bInterfaceClass         9 Hub
      bInterfaceSubClass      0 Unused
      bInterfaceProtocol      0 Full speed (or root) hub
      iInterface              0
      Endpoint Descriptor:
        bLength                 7
        bDescriptorType         5
        bEndpointAddress     0x81  EP 1 IN
        bmAttributes            3
          Transfer Type            Interrupt
          Synch Type               None
          Usage Type               Data
        wMaxPacketSize     0x0004  1x 4 bytes
        bInterval              12
Plugging in the microUSB ethernet adapter/hub without the power adapter forced the Zero to reboot with the following text in the console: http://pastebin.com/rU9Wtazh. It does not reboot when the hub is already powered externally.
The light on the hub is lit when not powered externally, so the data port does appear to be applying power to devices plugged in to it, but there is still no data transmitted. I looked at the solder joints for the socket, and as far as I could tell, they seemed fine. Maybe someone with more experience can take a look. These are the best images I could get of the port's connection to the board:

http://puu.sh/mONXB/60c5e5474b.JPG
http://puu.sh/mONZz/27b1f63f14.JPG
http://puu.sh/mOO1z/5a839bfc22.JPG
http://puu.sh/mOOe7/ccda585177.JPG

hippy
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Re: Pi Zero USB does not work at all

Sat Jan 30, 2016 8:33 am

mahjongg wrote:I do have some hesitation on the need to have a USB-A to USB-A type of cable for an A (or A+), AFAIK for good reasons they do not exist!
I have a few. Before mini-USB arrived, some manufacturers chose to fit USB-A sockets rather than USB-B sockets. Presumably because they were too large for the product. I have a digital camera with a USB-A socket.

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