abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:45 pm

Has anybody come up with a way to overcome this yet? I have tried overclocking but to no avail. I bought the PI to set up a node-red-dashboard and small display in my car but it is so slow that the dashboard is unusable. General browsing is also ridiculously slow and clunky, and anything animated is a no go (js gauge examples, for example). If I connect to NR from another system, the output is perfect.

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:52 pm

Oh, I should mention my PI also stinks of electrical burning !

klricks
Posts: 4857
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:01 am
Location: Grants Pass, OR, USA
Contact: Website

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:59 pm

Which RPi model?
IMO for acceptable performance you need a RPi 3B with either official display or HDMI monitor.
Go here for my RPi writeup. Basic config, Serial Port add-on etc:
http://blackeagle12.net/Comp/RPi/Rpi.html Click contact icon then world icon --->

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:26 pm

3b, connected to hdmi. It freezes and stutters a lot generally and as above, an animated dashboard which equates to about 4 gauges (https://canvas-gauges.com/) in node-red-dashboard is basically unusable. It seems to buffer all the data and then play it back, which over time means the delay gets longer and longer, unless I limit the flow to the point where the framerate is notably low. Even then though, it takes so long to load etc that it is pointless.

User avatar
topguy
Posts: 3690
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:46 am
Location: Trondheim, Norway

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:53 pm

Which browser ?

SurferTim
Posts: 1100
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2013 9:27 am
Location: Miramar Beach, Florida

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:58 pm

abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:52 pm
Oh, I should mention my PI also stinks of electrical burning !
Do you have a heatsink? Fan? If you are running it hard, she will get hot and throttle CPU speed.

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:28 pm

SurferTim wrote:
abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:52 pm
Oh, I should mention my PI also stinks of electrical burning !
Do you have a heatsink? Fan? If you are running it hard, she will get hot and throttle CPU speed.
No heatsink or fan, its a new out the box board, a day old. vcgencmd measure_temp returns 45deg, despite clocking
topguy wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:53 pm
Which browser ?
Any! Even typing this reply is prone to pauses and hiccups. The only other thing that I am aware of is that the low voltage warning is on, despite my multimeter reading 5v across GPIO pins 2 and 6

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 18185
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:32 pm

I suspect this is simply a problem with the code you are running requiring a lot of CPU horsepower to work. Despite the apparently simple requirements, it's running something like Javascript, which in turn is running in a browser, both of which are horrendously inefficient compared with writing code to run directly on the Pi.

Basically, the API distance from your code to the CPU is so high its simply struggling to run it. Might even be running out of memory.

Not a problem with the Pi, but with the SW stack. After all, the Pi is clearly capable of running the actual requirements, and displaying the results in super 3D with over the top graphics. As long as it doesn't have to run over 50 layers of API.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Please direct all questions to the forum, I do not do support via PM.

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 18185
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:33 pm

abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:28 pm
SurferTim wrote:
abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:52 pm
Oh, I should mention my PI also stinks of electrical burning !
Do you have a heatsink? Fan? If you are running it hard, she will get hot and throttle CPU speed.
No heatsink or fan, its a new out the box board, a day old. vcgencmd measure_temp returns 45deg, despite clocking
topguy wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:53 pm
Which browser ?
Any! Even typing this reply is prone to pauses and hiccups. The only other thing that I am aware of is that the low voltage warning is on, despite my multimeter reading 5v across GPIO pins 2 and 6
Low voltage goes on at 4.63v or less (+-5%). So your DVM is probably misreading. Worth sorting out the power requirements, that can cause CPU throttling.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Please direct all questions to the forum, I do not do support via PM.

ghans
Posts: 7432
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:30 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:34 pm

Did you try enabling the experimental graphics driver ? You are running the latest image , aren't you ?

ghans
• Don't like the board ? Missing features ? Change to the prosilver theme ! You can find it in your settings.
• Don't like to search the forum BEFORE posting 'cos it's useless ? Try googling : yoursearchtermshere site:raspberrypi.org

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:34 pm

Don't get me wrong I'm not expecting a speed machine and I won't be using it to browse (like I am now) daily but if it can't display a simple set of gauges in a browser then it is of no real use to me. It's just taken about 3 minutes to log into Facebook, with extra time on top for it to open a message. Surely something is amiss?

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:39 pm

ghans wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:34 pm
Did you try enabling the experimental graphics driver ? You are running the latest image , aren't you ?

ghans
Everything is as up to date as can be. I haven't enabled the experimental driver, do you have details for that?
jamesh wrote: I suspect this is simply a problem with the code you are running requiring a lot of CPU horsepower to work. Despite the apparently simple requirements, it's running something like Javascript, which in turn is running in a browser, both of which are horrendously inefficient compared with writing code to run directly on the Pi.

Basically, the API distance from your code to the CPU is so high its simply struggling to run it. Might even be running out of memory.

Not a problem with the Pi, but with the SW stack. After all, the Pi is clearly capable of running the actual requirements, and displaying the results in super 3D with over the top graphics. As long as it doesn't have to run over 50 layers of API.
I get what you are saying, but this is on a fresh install. Completely ignore the node-red requirements that I have and I'm still struggling to type this message. It just paused for two seconds, for the text to magically appear. Using Chromium.
jamesh wrote: Low voltage goes on at 4.63v or less (+-5%). So your DVM is probably misreading. Worth sorting out the power requirements, that can cause CPU throttling.
I've never had reason to believe it is wrong before, but I'll not rule it out. I'll have to find a bigger power supply and see what happens.

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 18185
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:45 pm

abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:39 pm
ghans wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:34 pm
Did you try enabling the experimental graphics driver ? You are running the latest image , aren't you ?

ghans
Everything is as up to date as can be. I haven't enabled the experimental driver, do you have details for that?
jamesh wrote: I suspect this is simply a problem with the code you are running requiring a lot of CPU horsepower to work. Despite the apparently simple requirements, it's running something like Javascript, which in turn is running in a browser, both of which are horrendously inefficient compared with writing code to run directly on the Pi.

Basically, the API distance from your code to the CPU is so high its simply struggling to run it. Might even be running out of memory.

Not a problem with the Pi, but with the SW stack. After all, the Pi is clearly capable of running the actual requirements, and displaying the results in super 3D with over the top graphics. As long as it doesn't have to run over 50 layers of API.
I get what you are saying, but this is on a fresh install. Completely ignore the node-red requirements that I have and I'm still struggling to type this message. It just paused for two seconds, for the text to magically appear. Using Chromium.
jamesh wrote: Low voltage goes on at 4.63v or less (+-5%). So your DVM is probably misreading. Worth sorting out the power requirements, that can cause CPU throttling.
I've never had reason to believe it is wrong before, but I'll not rule it out. I'll have to find a bigger power supply and see what happens.
Probably the cable. The little voltage icon doesn't lie. Or at least, has never lied to me!

It does sound odd, usually browsing is acceptable.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Please direct all questions to the forum, I do not do support via PM.

ghans
Posts: 7432
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:30 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:47 pm

Code: Select all

sudo raspi-config
Go to advanced options for the experimental driver.

ghans
• Don't like the board ? Missing features ? Change to the prosilver theme ! You can find it in your settings.
• Don't like to search the forum BEFORE posting 'cos it's useless ? Try googling : yoursearchtermshere site:raspberrypi.org

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:08 pm

ghans wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:47 pm

Code: Select all

sudo raspi-config
Go to advanced options for the experimental driver.

ghans
I remembered as soon as I posted. Which option is the experimental one? Full KMS or fake?

ghans
Posts: 7432
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:30 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:40 pm

Try full. You might want to take a backup beforehand though ....

ghans
• Don't like the board ? Missing features ? Change to the prosilver theme ! You can find it in your settings.
• Don't like to search the forum BEFORE posting 'cos it's useless ? Try googling : yoursearchtermshere site:raspberrypi.org

User avatar
piglet
Posts: 799
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2011 1:16 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:58 pm

abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:45 pm
I have tried overclocking but to no avail
abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:52 pm
my PI also stinks of electrical burning !
Could the two be linked with your slowness? Is it damaged and now throttling down? Someone here can probably tell you how to find out.

jahboater
Posts: 1930
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2015 6:38 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:13 pm

Have you actually checked the clock speed?
You could be down to 600Mhz ....

This is a useful tool:-
https://github.com/MilhouseVH/bcmstat

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:32 pm

piglet wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:58 pm
abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:45 pm
I have tried overclocking but to no avail
abyssdj wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:52 pm
my PI also stinks of electrical burning !
Could the two be linked with your slowness? Is it damaged and now throttling down? Someone here can probably tell you how to find out.
I don't think so, it smelled straight out the box.
jahboater wrote: Have you actually checked the clock speed?
You could be down to 600Mhz ....

This is a useful tool:-
https://github.com/MilhouseVH/bcmstat
According to the panel app its set to on demand and switches between 600 and 1200 (1400 now) but I'll check with that tool too.

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:42 pm

Sure enough, it appears to be stuck on 600mhz, even though CPUFreq front end frequently says its gone up to 1400, or whatever. How do we fix that? For what its worth, I'm running on a usb power pack now and no longer have the voltage icon in the top right, although the red light is still a bit flickery

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:45 pm

Config: v0.4.8, args "", priority lowest (+19)
Board: 4 x ARMv7 cores available, ondemand governor (Pi3 rev 1.2, BCM2837 SoC with 1GB RAM by Sony)
Memory: 1024MB (split 948MB ARM, 76MB GPU) plus 100MB Swap
HW Block: | ARM | Core | H264 | SDRAM |
Min Freq: | 600MHz | 250MHz | 0MHz | 575MHz |
Max Freq: | 1400MHz | 500MHz | 333MHz | 575MHz |
Voltages: | +4, 1.2000V | +6, 1.3500V |
Other: temp_limit=85, hdmi_force_hotplug=1, sdram_schmoo=0x2000020
Firmware: Oct 24 2017 17:09:22, version a3d7660e6749e75e2c4ce4d377846abd3b3be283 (clean) (release)
Codecs: H264 H263 MPG4 MJPG PCM
Booted: Thu Dec 7 17:28:16 2017

Time ARM Core H264 Core Temp (Max) IRQ/s RX B/s TX B/s
======== ======= ======= ======= =============== ====== ========== ==========
17:42:35 600Mhz 250Mhz 0Mhz 46.16C (46.16C) 663 0 0
17:42:37 600Mhz 250Mhz 0Mhz 45.08C (46.16C) 645 0 0
17:42:39 600Mhz 250Mhz 0Mhz 44.55C (46.16C) 647 0 0

17:42:41 600Mhz 250Mhz 0Mhz 44.01C (46.16C) 651 0 0
17:42:43 600Mhz 250Mhz 0Mhz 43.47C (46.16C) 664 0 0^C
Peak Values: IRQ: 664, RX: 0, TX: 0

mattmiller
Posts: 1447
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 11:25 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:52 pm

If you just run a browser on a Pi3 and nothing else and don't go onto complex websites then I'd say 50% of people would say performance is acceptable

Once, you deviate from a simple requirement like that, things are just going to get less acceptable

So its easy to see how running nodeRed and a browser together would seem not acceptable

it might be worth trying out using 2 Pi - one to run the nodered server and one to display it

You might even find using a PiZeroW does the job of running the nodered server

Matt

abyssdj
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:11 pm

mattmiller wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 5:52 pm
If you just run a browser on a Pi3 and nothing else and don't go onto complex websites then I'd say 50% of people would say performance is acceptable

Once, you deviate from a simple requirement like that, things are just going to get less acceptable

So its easy to see how running nodeRed and a browser together would seem not acceptable

it might be worth trying out using 2 Pi - one to run the nodered server and one to display it

You might even find using a PiZeroW does the job of running the nodered server

Matt
To clarify, node-red is not running. Nothing else is running, its a plain, fresh boot of Raspbian. As above, I can run node-red on the PI and connect from a desktop machine and the whole thing works swimmingly - it's literally PI's browser that is struggling. I'm booted in Ubuntu Mate now off a usb stick which is a little snappier, but ultimately I still have the same problem. However, throttled=0x50005 is definitely not going to help, which I believe is undervoltage and throttled.

User avatar
Imperf3kt
Posts: 356
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:16 am
Location: Australia

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:50 pm

The more I come across the undervoltage issue, the more I suspect it should be called undercurrent.

I have two suggestions:

1: get a heatsink and probably also a decent fan. Those cheap Chinese '5v fans' on Ebay are generally useless. Go for something at least 50mm. Don't worry if it says 12v, most fans can run on less, especiallythe larger fans.
This is probably half the cause of the throttling.

2: get a better cable. The Pi is struggling for juice and you are whipping it trying to make it run faster.
Try the same with a car, crimp the fuel line and acellerate hard to make it go faster. Additional bonus of improving mpg by 50%!

Look for cables rated 2.1A at least or otherwise, find a cable with 2C/24AWG or LOWER printed on it.
Pi3b - 'normal use' temperature (25% CPU load) 76℃, ambient 21℃

jamesh
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Raspberry Pi Engineer & Forum Moderator
Posts: 18185
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:41 pm

Re: Painfully slow performance

Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:05 pm

Imperf3kt wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:50 pm
The more I come across the undervoltage issue, the more I suspect it should be called undercurrent.
The circuitry on the board detects the VOLTAGE dropping below 4.63+=5%, at which point the icon will be displayed.
Principal Software Engineer at Raspberry Pi (Trading) Ltd.
Please direct all questions to the forum, I do not do support via PM.

Return to “Troubleshooting”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: bergera, pcmanbob and 52 guests