RISC OS released on Raspberry Pi


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by NigelJK » Fri Nov 02, 2012 7:33 pm
Just downloading RC6 now, but RC5 starts up the first time with a welcome page which should hand hold you through the first few minutes (really that's all it takes) there's also loads of stuff in the documents folder.
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by bob_binz » Fri Nov 02, 2012 7:39 pm
I kept getting "not found" type errors in the documents folder. Couldn't open Basic help, for example. It's probable that I'm doing something wrong. I'll revisit the welcome page though, thanks.
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by BrokenFrog » Fri Nov 02, 2012 7:41 pm
bob_binz wrote:
I downloaded it out of curiosity, and was very impressed by the speed that it loads. Unfortunately, this was the first time I've ever seen RISC OS, and didn't really know how to proceed. I managed to get a connected, re-configured range-extender to get me on the network (no WiFi support, it seems) but that's about it. How do I:

Run Basic?

Shutdown?

Get stuff?

Install stuff?

Run the got and installed stuff?



To "load" basic, try pressing Ctrl-F12. An empty window will appear, similar in style to a terminal, but not really one. Where the * is type basic and press Enter. It's that easy!

Shutdown - either press Ctrl-Shift-F12, or click the middle ("Menu") button over the icon at the far right of the icon bar (the icon is known as Switcher). There will be a Shutdown option there.

!Packman and !Store are both apps that allow you to download and install software. !PackMan installs software inside the Apps directory (the RISC OS word for folder), in separate sub-directories, depending on their nature. !Store on the other hand, opens a window when it has downloaded - you just drag the Icon that appears and drop it to where you want it to appear on the disk structure.

In order to do both of these, you obviously need to run either !Packman or !Store. Do this by double-clicking the respective icon. This is how all applications, folders, files or archives are opened.

There is a guide on the disk somewhere, probably in the Documents directory. I don't have an installed copy on this machine to look and see, sorry.

Hope that gets you started though.
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by NigelJK » Fri Nov 02, 2012 7:57 pm
Well I'mup and running on RC6. I needed to add hdmi_drive=2 to my config.text file to get the sound working.
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by bob_binz » Fri Nov 02, 2012 8:38 pm
@BrokenFrog many thanks for that. I'll give it a go tomorrow. Knowing about the middle mouse button seems to be a fundamental requirement. I will try the docs folder again too, perhaps I was doing something wrong. Anyway, I know where to come if I have any problems ;) Thanks again.
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by BrokenFrog » Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:22 pm
bob_binz wrote:Knowing about the middle mouse button seems to be a fundamental requirement


Bob,

The middle button (or Menu, as we call it!) is the second most used mouse button in RISC OS. Mainly because, as it's name suggests, it provides ALL menu options (the first (left mouse button) is called Select, and the right mouse button is called Adjust).

The other thing that may be, er, fun for new users, is hold shift and left doubleclick on an App (pretty much anything that begins with an exclamation mark (or a Pling, as we call it) - it shows you all the component parts of the App. RISC OS doesn't do a Windows or a Linux and liberally throw things around the disk structure - Apps are self contained. The Pling at the beginning of an App's name tells the UI and the Filer that the directory (because that's what an App really is) is acting as a container for all the files that make up that App, and to look for a file called !Run inside it to see what to do and exactly how to run it. If you now shift-doubleclick on !Run, you can see the commands contained within it. It will open it in a text editor. Try it on any File and it will show you the gubbins of the file. Not pretty, but can be helpful sometimes.

The (subtly) different uses of Select and Adjust seem weird at times, but as you get used to them, they provide all sorts of useful, time-saving functions. Play and see!
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by tank » Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:47 pm
stylx wrote:I saw tank's module, looks great. But how do you use it. I install the module with RMLoad and it work's great , but How do I use it from basic.
I tried SYS "GPIO_WriteData" 7, -1 and some other combinations but keep getting a error.
is there a chance tank could give us a 101 on GPIO module he wrote.
Or am I missing something


Coming in late to the party, and I see others have hopefully helped you.
For a simple example just look at the !RunImage inside !PiLED.
That just flashes the "Disk Activity LED" on and off when you press a key.
Most of the Write SWI's take R0 as the GPIO number and R1 as either 0 or 1 to set the GPIO state, and most of the Read SWI's take R0 as the GPIO number and return 0 or 1 in R0.
The SWI's are listed in the Source.Docs.!SWIsDetal file.
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by stylx » Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:55 pm
I've got a problem.
I've Loaded tanks GPIO module using
*RMLoad GPIO
and got the module to work and I can now access with GPIO_WriteData,7,-1
I even wrote a small basic program that enable me to turn off and on three leds in any pattern I choose.
But how do I keep the module loaded when restart my pi, surely I don't have to rload the module every time I reboot
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by stylx » Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:12 pm
only got pi a week and a half ago and didn't have access to to how to load modules I down loaded the module just didn't known how to install it, I must admit the risc os is totally new to me I got a A3010 from ebay whilst I was waiting for my pi (which took 19 weeks or so to arrive) but didn't have access to basic programming manual and stuff until now.

still better late then never
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by sawdust » Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:51 pm
stylx wrote:I've got a problem.
I've Loaded tanks GPIO module using
*RMLoad GPIO
and got the module to work and I can now access with GPIO_WriteData,7,-1
I even wrote a small basic program that enable me to turn off and on three leds in any pattern I choose.
But how do I keep the module loaded when restart my pi, surely I don't have to rload the module every time I reboot


*help RMensure

Create an Obeyfile using the above command and save it in Boot:choices.boot.tasks and it will load the module at startup.

Sawdust
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by tank » Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:35 am
sawdust wrote:
stylx wrote:I've got a problem.
I've Loaded tanks GPIO module using
*RMLoad GPIO
and got the module to work and I can now access with GPIO_WriteData,7,-1
I even wrote a small basic program that enable me to turn off and on three leds in any pattern I choose.
But how do I keep the module loaded when restart my pi, surely I don't have to rload the module every time I reboot


*help RMensure

Create an Obeyfile using the above command and save it in Boot:choices.boot.tasks and it will load the module at startup.

Sawdust


Or just use Configure and add it to Boot, Run
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by theom » Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:51 am
I've started a guide to PackMan:
https://www.riscosopen.org/wiki/documen ... 's%20Guide
(no pictures yet). In addition it has its own help.
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by pygmy_giant » Sat Nov 03, 2012 2:34 pm
Great - I have unsuccessfully tried installing GCC manually off-line as I only have a 3g dongle.

Am considering taking my Pi down to the internet cafe and asking nicely if I can plug it in and use PackMan :?
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by stylx » Sat Nov 03, 2012 3:30 pm
I not sure but the pi has cross over ethernet , couldn't you just plug the dongle into your other computer the connect the pi with a ethernet cable to the other computer , then you could access pacman from home, not a internet guru but it should be possible
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by theom » Sat Nov 03, 2012 3:46 pm
Installing things with thousands of files can be very slow (hours) if you have a slow SD card - for some reason PackMan is even slower at this than a manual install. It's fine if you're using a hard drive. Until we can get to the bottom of why this is I sadly had to remove GCC from the list of programs installable by PackMan - it wasn't worth the risk of wearing out people's SD cards :( . So for the moment I advise you to persevere with installing GCC manually... what did you do and what went wrong?

The Pi does have crossover ethernet. You can also download the files and put them on a USB stick to bring across.
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by pygmy_giant » Sat Nov 03, 2012 5:44 pm
*deep breath*

well - I downloaded all the packages I thought I might need, these are:

GCC4_4.1.2-Rel2-1
GCC4-C++_4.1.2-Rel2-1

SharedLibs-C_4.1.2-Rel2-1
SharedLibs-C++_6.0.8.4.1.2-Rel2-1
SharedUnixLibrary_1.12-1

indent_2.2.10-1
make_3.81-1
subversion_1.6.12dfsg-1
patch_2.6.1-1

I popped these in a folder on my memory stick which I called GCC_ARM. I then unzipped all these package folders using my windows PC and moved the zipped packages into a sub-folder called 'zipped' so that I have zipped and unzipped versions of all the above.

I then popped this memory stick in the Pi and copied the GCC_ARM folder accross into the Programming folder under RISCOS.

I then navigated to the zipped folder and then to the !GCC application (GCC4_4.1.2-Rel2-1->Apps->Development). At this stage the icon for !GCC is the letter A made up of teeny gear wheels. When I double click on this the icon changes to another saying GCC with an Arch-type letter A behind it. This happens after about a second, so perhaps something happened? (No errors so far).

But if I open up a task window and type: *gcc --version

I get:

'An application that loads a file of this type has not been found by the Filer. Open a directory display containing the required application and try again.'

the same thing happens if I navigate into the zipped archive next to the !GCC app and type the same thing.

Should I use the unzipped files instead?

Thanks for your patience and tip about plugging the Pi into my windows machine to get internet.
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by theom » Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:53 pm
Ah. The golden rule is: always unzip things under RISC OS and not on other platforms. RISC OS has 'filetypes', which are extra data stored on the disc to indicate what type a file is (unlike other platforms it doesn't need files to be called things like 'picture.jpg', calling it 'Picture' with a filetype of 'JPEG' is just fine). If you unzip under Windows/Linux/etc, the unzip tool will throw away all the filetype information. That means RISC OS will think that all files are of type text or data. It won't know there's any programs there it can run.

A further caveat applies to FAT discs - RISC OS can store filetype information there, but if you write things to the disc on a Windows/Linux/etc machine it may trample over the filetypes and cause things to be incorrectly typed.
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by pygmy_giant » Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:59 pm
So in my example above I did not use the unzipped files - all the files I used were kept zipped up.

Have I made another mistake?

I got chuckie egg and lander running after downloading them from the internet on a windows machine and transferring them across via memory stick, so I think that technique should work here?

Any ideas?
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by stylx » Sat Nov 03, 2012 7:34 pm
I think Theom is right. I tried to unzip a basic listing in windows and put it on an sd card and tranfered it to the pi and it didn't work. then I unzip the same file on the pi (risc os) and it worked first time
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by bob_binz » Sat Nov 03, 2012 7:42 pm
Hi

Not sure if I ought to start a new thread with this, but I have a couple of questions if somebody wouldn't mind offering guidance on please. I'm getting the hang of the way the mouse works etc but I still can't manage to figure out a couple of things. I've been through Burngate's document which is really helpful, but I think it was with a different version of the OS because some things are different (i.e. there is no Example folder in BASIC)

Anyway, I've tried downloading some files from the internet (pdf docs mainly) but the NetSurf Download window just stops when the progress bar is full - it doesn't appear to complete. If I click the X, it asks if I want to abort the download. How do I complete the download?

Once it's downloaded, where will the file be?

How do I open a BASIC file for editing? When I double click, obviously it runs the file. I've tried dropping it onto a !StrongED session, but it doesn't retain the filename information. Again, what am I not doing?

I've tried downloading some apps using !Store and it "Gets" the file, but I couldn't see it installed anywhere. I noticed it downloads to !Store.Download, but I can't see how to get to this folder.

Ok, that's more than a couple of questions, but I appreciate any help offered.

BBz
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by pygmy_giant » Sat Nov 03, 2012 7:52 pm
How do I open a BASIC file for editing?


you shift-click it.

Re: zip files - I think Theom is right as well, but that does not seem to be my problem.

If I keep all the zipped up packages zipped up, and then transfer them to the pi and then go into the zipped folders and move the files outside of the zipped folder to another location, so they are unzipped, I get the same problem.

The GCC instalation instructions seem to indicate that I should effectively unzip twice, by doing this to get the !GCC application and then to go into the !GCC archive and pull out the files again.

Is that correct?

this reveals !Boot !Run and !Help files

clicking on the !Help file brings up html instructions.

clicking on !Run does not appear to do anything, until I open a task window in which case RISCOS goes potty, sticking characters and then auto repeating them when I type.

!Boot does not seem to do anything when I click on it....?
Last edited by pygmy_giant on Sat Nov 03, 2012 7:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by nr. » Sat Nov 03, 2012 7:53 pm
bob_binz wrote:How do I open a BASIC file for editing? When I double click, obviously it runs the file. I've tried dropping it onto a !StrongED session, but it doesn't retain the filename information. Again, what am I not doing?


Shift-left double click. Or, hold the button down on the second click.

Took me a while to work that one out too :)
--
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by pygmy_giant » Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:06 pm
re: GCC - think I have to merge the !Boot and !Run files with RISCOS' boot structure by dragging them onto the respective windows in configure.... here goes... nope - not that - give up for time being :|
Last edited by pygmy_giant on Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by SEDev » Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:14 pm
bob_binz wrote:Anyway, I've tried downloading some files from the internet (pdf docs mainly) but the NetSurf Download window just stops when the progress bar is full - it doesn't appear to complete. If I click the X, it asks if I want to abort the download. How do I complete the download?


Drag the file icon in the download window to a suitable directory. If there's no zuitable directory open, drag to a disc icon on the iconbar. This will save the download in the root directory, you can then move it to a better location later on.

bob_binz wrote:I've tried dropping it onto a !StrongED session, but it doesn't retain the filename information. Again, what am I not doing?


That ought to work, the file should open in BASIC mode with the filename present in the window's titlebar. If that's not the case then please report back here with a more detailed description of what happens.

bob_binz wrote:I've tried downloading some apps using !Store and it "Gets" the file, but I couldn't see it installed anywhere. I noticed it downloads to !Store.Download, but I can't see how to get to this folder.


When the download is completed the directory with the download should open automatically. If that's not the case then you can open it manually by clicking Menu over PlingStore's iconbar icon and selecting 'Downloads'.

nr. wrote:Or, hold the button down on the second click.


Please note that this is a configurable option. You can turn if on/off by setting Configure -> Filer plug-in -> Double-click and hold.
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by bob_binz » Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:36 pm
SEDev wrote:
bob_binz wrote:Anyway, I've tried downloading some files from the internet (pdf docs mainly) but the NetSurf Download window just stops when the progress bar is full - it doesn't appear to complete. If I click the X, it asks if I want to abort the download. How do I complete the download?


Drag the file icon in the download window to a suitable directory. If there's no zuitable directory open, drag to a disc icon on the iconbar. This will save the download in the root directory, you can then move it to a better location later on.

bob_binz wrote:I've tried dropping it onto a !StrongED session, but it doesn't retain the filename information. Again, what am I not doing?


That ought to work, the file should open in BASIC mode with the filename present in the window's titlebar. If that's not the case then please report back here with a more detailed description of what happens.

bob_binz wrote:I've tried downloading some apps using !Store and it "Gets" the file, but I couldn't see it installed anywhere. I noticed it downloads to !Store.Download, but I can't see how to get to this folder.


When the download is completed the directory with the download should open automatically. If that's not the case then you can open it manually by clicking Menu over PlingStore's iconbar icon and selecting 'Downloads'.

nr. wrote:Or, hold the button down on the second click.


Please note that this is a configurable option. You can turn if on/off by setting Configure -> Filer plug-in -> Double-click and hold.


That's great - thanks for that (and to the previous posters for their input.) Opening the BASIC file only seems to work by shift double clicking. If I open a !StrongED window, and drag a BASIC file onto it from the BASIC.Routines folder, the title bar says "Textfile *". There is no syntax highlighting either, which there is when I shift double click.
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