STARTERS GUIDE for Raspberry Pi, A, B and B+


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by abishur » Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:32 am
You can provide a link to this thread in the forums, sure, but please don't reproduce off site in its entirety. I know that may seem kinda silly since it's a fairly short post, but it's just a blanket request I have for all my posts ;-)
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by OttifantSir » Tue Oct 16, 2012 7:40 pm
I just wanted to share a graphical interface method of imaging to a SD-card in Ubuntu: Palimpsest.
(Apologies for any inconcistensies in the names, and any spelling errors, I don't speak English natively)

1. Insert card
2. Open Palimpsest/Disk Utility
3. Choose the card
4. Format the card with MBR (or GPT if you want to use disks larger than 2TB) from the upper cog wheel
5. Choose the partition on the card
6. Unmount it by clicking the square/stop-button under the partition)
7. From the partition/filesystem cog wheel choose Restore Image...
8. Choose your image (.img-file)
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by martinkwong » Thu Oct 25, 2012 3:28 pm
Hi,
just as a newbie, wanting to ask:

    is it a must to have a keyboard and mouse inorder to boot the Raspberry Pi?
    and as for the USB port, does it support those USB to PS/2 converter which allow you to have Both PS/2 keyboard and PS/2 mouse with one single USB port?
Image

how someone could know the answer. thanks
martin
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by abishur » Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:58 pm
martinkwong wrote:Hi,
just as a newbie, wanting to ask:

    is it a must to have a keyboard and mouse inorder to boot the Raspberry Pi?
    and as for the USB port, does it support those USB to PS/2 converter which allow you to have Both PS/2 keyboard and PS/2 mouse with one single USB port?
Image

how someone could know the answer. thanks
martin


1) Must it have a keyboard and mouse to boot?

No, I have 2 pis which run "headless" without anything attached to it other than a hard drive.

2) Does it support those USB to PS/2 converter

Depends on the converter. The one you posted *looks* like a passive device which would only work provided the PS/2 keyboard had the logic to run as a usb device. You'd need an active converter to use the PS/2 to USB devices.
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by lokitang » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:19 am
...... and all goes well the green LED marked OK (and ACK in later version) will blink to show whenever the PI reads......


sure it's 'ACK', not 'ACT'?
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by CharlieDelta » Thu Nov 01, 2012 5:37 pm
PS/2 Mouse and Keyboard adaptor.
Hi

Your adaptor looks perfectly OK to me.
To be sure test it on a PC with your keyboard and mouse. If it works on the PC I see no reason for it not to work on the RPi.

To put the record straight there is no such thing as a passive converter
The PS/2 communication protocol for both Mice and Keyboard are very similar but the mouse packet contains more information. They are both totally different from the USB communication protocol for HID parts [Human Interface Device] or any other USB communication protocol. The same can be said for the hardware interface for PS/2 Mouse and Keyboard which are the same [other than pins differences on the 6 pin din plug] and again the USB hardware interface is completely different.

For the device that you show in your picture to function it must have a protocol converter chip buried in the plastic moulding of the USB plug. This chip will convert both the hardware interface of the PS/2 devices and their communication protocol. The latter is bidirectional since the boot process requires that the keyboard and mouse be enumerated so that the OS [operating system] knows what it is "talking to"

As an aside the original constraint on the design of the USB concept was that the cost of implementing USB on a PC [including the connector] should be no more than that of PS/2 hardware. Of course the software drivers are different with the USB being much more complicated than the equivalent PS/2 versions, hence all the problems with USB drivers in the past (and now?)

Hope that helps
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by abishur » Thu Nov 01, 2012 8:13 pm
CharlieDelta wrote:PS/2 Mouse and Keyboard adaptor.
Hi

Your adaptor looks perfectly OK to me.
To be sure test it on a PC with your keyboard and mouse. If it works on the PC I see no reason for it not to work on the RPi.

To put the record straight there is no such thing as a passive converter
The PS/2 communication protocol for both Mice and Keyboard are very similar but the mouse packet contains more information. They are both totally different from the USB communication protocol for HID parts [Human Interface Device] or any other USB communication protocol. The same can be said for the hardware interface for PS/2 Mouse and Keyboard which are the same [other than pins differences on the 6 pin din plug] and again the USB hardware interface is completely different.

For the device that you show in your picture to function it must have a protocol converter chip buried in the plastic moulding of the USB plug. This chip will convert both the hardware interface of the PS/2 devices and their communication protocol. The latter is bidirectional since the boot process requires that the keyboard and mouse be enumerated so that the OS [operating system] knows what it is "talking to"

As an aside the original constraint on the design of the USB concept was that the cost of implementing USB on a PC [including the connector] should be no more than that of PS/2 hardware. Of course the software drivers are different with the USB being much more complicated than the equivalent PS/2 versions, hence all the problems with USB drivers in the past (and now?)

Hope that helps


Well since the quibbling has been started I must further quibble with your statement :-P

There actually *are* passive converters. They take the PS/2 form factor and make it USB. The only caveat is that they only work provided your keyboard or mouse has the capability to work as a PS/2 or USB device. I've seen this done even on a combo mouse/keyboard plug and the perform *horribly* (as one would expect). It's very much like the people who sell a passive HDMI to VGA cable. Just because it won't work doesn't mean there are people who will make and sell it anyways ;-)
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by CharlieDelta » Fri Nov 02, 2012 1:16 pm
Oh dear "What a fine mess you have go me into Stanley"

The problem is how to reply to Martin's very reasonable newbie query without perpetuating forum bickering?

1.
Personal statement.
Forums are intended to provide a platform for information exchange between individuals that have similar interests. Part of this is mutual help with problems/issues. Newbies (we have all been and probably still are newbies in one field or another) tend to have more basic questions and turn to those with more experience for help and guidance. If you reply to a request for help, I believe that you should do so in an honest and factual way to the limit of your own relevant knowledge. If the reply contains unsupported comment, beliefs or conjecture then you should say so.
A forum dedicated to newbie help is no place for "big beasts" to slug it out as to who has the biggest brain.
I am therefore a little reluctant to reply to the previous post, however I do not feel that Martin has had an adequate reply from either of us, hence this trepidatious post.

2.
An apology
Dear Abishur; I had not intended to stand on any of your appendages nor to belittle your service as moderator for this forum and your massive 3256 posts. I did not intend to quibble your specific post, but simply provide (IMHO) what I considered to be the correct answer. Please accept my apology if I have caused any offence.

3.
Reality as I see it.

PS/2 hardware interface has some commonality with USB in that there are 4 wires; two data lines and two power lines (+5v and ground) however that is the limit of their commonality. It has been possible to develop Mice and Keyboards that contain dual control circuits that allow the data lines to be used either for PS/2 protocol or USB protocol.

[Here I have some issues in that USB requires Pull up and pull down resistors to signal the type of USB which has to be low speed for keyboards and mice, where as PS/2 requires open collector pull up resistors. Perhaps we can overlook this in the enumeration process]

Therefore it is possible to design a PS/2 + USB device to work in both environments simply by having a "passive adapter" that adapts the PS/2 6 pin din plug to the 4 pin USB connector.

Here there is probably an English language issue between "adapter" and "converter", not withstanding this you can have a "passive adapter/converter" for a single device.

However both PS/2 and USB are "point to point" interfaces in that you can not operate more than one device connected to one port (PS/2 or USB) by some sort of passive connection

You can daisy chain several PS/2 devices on a single PS/2 port but this requires additional electronics. An example of this is PS/2 bar code readers very often plug in between the PS/2 keyboard and the PC PS/2 port. The same is true of USB but requires the insertion of "hub" electronics. Neither of these approaches is "passive".

Given this your original request was about a device that appeared to provide simultaneous connection for two PS/2 devices into one USB port. For this device to work it must have some internal electronics to convert the two PS/2 data streams into two USB data streams.

(As I remember a standard USB port can support 5 endpoint "devices" and their associated data streams; but I can not be sure without getting all my USB documentation out)

There is just one possible implementation (ref x) for a "passive adapter/converter" (Passive implying no additional electronic devices other than wires and passive components eg resistors, capacitors etc.) constructed in the way of your example.
In this the two PS/2 sockets (one for mouse and one for keyboard - green and purple colour coding) could be wired so that one device (mouse or keyboard) of the dual PS/2+USB interface type could be plugged in and would work but NOT with both devices plugged in. This is a hypothetical concept since it would be much less costly to provide an adapter that has a 6 pin din socket on one end and a USB plug on the other with the pins that carry the PS/2+USB mouse and keyboard data lines strapped together. This I believe is the nature of commercially available adapters.

As for faux or fake devices, you should be able to test these out using a PC, as I suggested in my initial reply. As always caveat emptor should apply. I would not buy it if you think your example is as per (ref x) above.

Martin
I hope that this has been of some help. I am sorry it is so long winded but it sometimes takes a lot of explanation to substantiate a simple answer.
As such my initial advice stands; "Should work but if you have any doubts test it first on a regular PC"

Please do not hesitate to ask if you need any further help or guidance on this issue. I do not claim to be an "expert" but offer my guidance for what it is worth.

Abishur
If you have a need to discuss this issue with me in further detail may I suggest that we do so outside this section of the forum.
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by abishur » Fri Nov 02, 2012 1:53 pm
Which brings us full circle to my much less confusing to a newbie (and less blog length statement)

"Depends on the converter. The one you posted *looks* like a passive device which would only work provided the PS/2 keyboard had the logic to run as a usb device. You'd need an active converter to use the PS/2 to USB devices."
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by akvenugopal » Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:24 pm
abishur wrote:It's a guide for absolute beginners  I'm trying to keep things simple here   Besides, a 5.1V PSU is also going to have some margin of error and you get a board that goes enough into the negative and a PSU that goes enough into the positive and you have a Pi that won't work.  But, by telling people to stick with exactly 5V because A) I relieve liability for legal recourse should someone burn their Pi because they got a 5.25V PSU and it output a little more than the advertised voltage and B) 5v is what it's designed for, it would be silly of me to tell people to be okay with using something else

Wiki says USB voltage is 5.00 +/- 0.25 volts. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus
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by abishur » Tue Nov 06, 2012 6:35 pm
akvenugopal wrote:
abishur wrote:It's a guide for absolute beginners  I'm trying to keep things simple here   Besides, a 5.1V PSU is also going to have some margin of error and you get a board that goes enough into the negative and a PSU that goes enough into the positive and you have a Pi that won't work.  But, by telling people to stick with exactly 5V because A) I relieve liability for legal recourse should someone burn their Pi because they got a 5.25V PSU and it output a little more than the advertised voltage and B) 5v is what it's designed for, it would be silly of me to tell people to be okay with using something else

Wiki says USB voltage is 5.00 +/- 0.25 volts. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus


Please read the quote that you quoting me saying. ;-) We will forever and always recommend an exact 5V PSU as we want to do our best to avoid situations where your PSU is on the plus side of things and your board is on the negative side of things and the net result is a dead board. Plus depending on the quality of the power in your area and the quality of your PSU, your 5.25 PSU might come out quite a bit higher than 5.25V. Ergo, despite the official USB specs saying they can take up to +0.25 beyond 5v, this guide will stick with a firm 5v recommendation :-)
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by yousifsaadany » Tue Nov 13, 2012 12:25 am
could you please tell me the ports that i can assign input or output also the analog to digital converter ports and where they are physically on the board
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by abishur » Tue Nov 13, 2012 3:55 am
yousifsaadany wrote:could you please tell me the ports that i can assign input or output also the analog to digital converter ports and where they are physically on the board


That is an excellent question for basic setup/usage or perhaps under the automation forum. This is just the bare bones instructions for getting it set up ;-)
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by Uluruism » Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:12 pm
Hi 2 weeks in to using my 'PI' and it's bringing back fond memories of playing with my ZXspectrum48k

I bought my Pi from maplin and was very happy with it!, till last week when, during me messing with the settings I stopped it from being able to boot Doh!

So after buying a preloaded sd card i ended up trying all the different ways of downloading raspbian wheezy onto my sd card!!!!

What a nightmare for a beginner!
Eventually I sussed it!!

My newbie Start up suggestion is, as follows;(I hope this helps if like me you have been struggling)

Buy at Least a 16GB SD Card
Download latest 'Wheezy' .raspberrypi.org/downloads

Then follow the best instructions i found @ //myraspberrypiexperience.blogspot.co.uk/p/using-dd-for-windows.html !!!!!!!!!But be very carefull!!!!!!!!
And thankyou 'Atom'? i am back up and running after following the //elinux.org/images/f/f9/Trinity_RPi_Specification.pdfi downloaded from //elinux.org/RPi_Trinity_Computer_Club

and am now teaching myself basic python thanks to the great themagpi.com

This i found gave me the smoothest install and it works with any iso, so you can choose.
I prefered this method as it was like my first preloaded card from maplin!

Good luck and enjoy
Ayres
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by anta40 » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:56 pm
I just wrote Raspbian to my SD card and want to give it a try.
The problem is I don't have USB keyboard at the moment.

I wonder if I could connect the Raspberry Pi to my laptop via USB/ethernet, and then manage it using putty. Anyone?
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by abishur » Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:56 am
anta40 wrote:I just wrote Raspbian to my SD card and want to give it a try.
The problem is I don't have USB keyboard at the moment.

I wonder if I could connect the Raspberry Pi to my laptop via USB/ethernet, and then manage it using putty. Anyone?


yep ;-)
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by anta40 » Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:29 pm
Hi abishur,

Pardon my ignorance. I already connected the Pi to my laptop via ethernet cable.
Image

Now how could I access it via SSH/putty, because I don't know its IP address :?
BTW, the LEDs show rainbow colors, so I assume it booted properly.
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by abishur » Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:39 pm
hmm... one option is to load your SD card into a linux computer and edit /etc/network/interfaces and assign a static IP, the other is to turn on internet sharing on your laptop so your laptop will assign an IP address, otherwise your pi will randomly get a private IP address.
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by anta40 » Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:04 am
Hi abishur,

As you suggested, I bridged the internet connection. Then I tried to find the Pi's IP address, using Angry IP Scanner. It didn't show up on the list. Maybe dhcpd is not enabled by default?
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by abishur » Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:24 am
anta40 wrote:Hi abishur,

As you suggested, I bridged the internet connection. Then I tried to find the Pi's IP address, using Angry IP Scanner. It didn't show up on the list. Maybe dhcpd is not enabled by default?


No DHCP is enabled by default, there are some threads discussing in detail how to get it set up so finding one of those would give more detailed info on how to get it set up, I'd do a site search with google ("site:raspberrypi.org <your search here>") to find them, or just start a new thread in general discussion for additional help :-)
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by sukhoi » Thu Dec 06, 2012 6:39 pm
I have a Sony Ericsson charger output 5v 850mA. I hope that will work with a rpi model b 512MB.
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by caandrew425 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:09 am
I am trying to use the Motorola Atrix dock as was shown in the Adafruit video on Youtube. I am having a very difficult time finding female micro USB & female micro HDMI adapters. Can anyone point me to a source for these?
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by itimpi » Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:10 pm
I have seen them on eBay and Amazon. Getting them of eBay means longer delivery times as they come from China /Hong Kong but normally better prices. I got mine from eBay as I was prepared to wait, although I came very close to buying them from Amazon to avoid the 3-4 weeks wait for delivery via eBay
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by caandrew425 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:11 pm
Thanks, I will check Ebay.
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by as1mov » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:24 pm
Regarding entering and exiting the GUI, My Pi boots straight into the GUI, how can I enter the text or how do I get to the 'command line' from the GUI to add or alter the lines of text that all you clever young ones are bandying about.
As you've probably guessed, I' an old fart of 65, quite literate in IT but Ive never seen anything like this little wonder before!
I've ordered a complete beginners book on the 'Pi' but I'm keen to get started on adding projects and such.
Please be gentle I'm really fragile.

TC
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